JFK Assassination Documents to be released this year

[scottnapa]

60 years on, theory after theory and now all of these released files and guess what? Still not an iota of evidence of a plot. Not a smidgeon. Not a scintilla. And still not even one piece of paper proving that Oswald was a CIA operative. How could this fantasy still be active? Tenacity and obsession over reason, evidence and common sense. Conspiracy is a big game played jointly by hobbyists and those that make a living from it.

Way past time to let this embarrassment go. Time removed this fantasy ‘burden’ from the American people. It’s gone on too long.

Two hours before you posted this, there was a post and conversation discussing one of the witnesses that recently spoke before Congress. Dr Don Curtis, a Parkland doctor who saw the wounds of JFK, just told Congress: “The two bullets that killed President Kennedy came from the front.” He said Oswald did not fire the fatal shots. “The wounds are not consistent with the government’s findings.” Very powerful statement. Very specific by a witness that was there.
Lock, I do not expect to convince you to change your mind. You believe Oswald acted alone. That's fine.

[Patrick Differ]

This administration has already demonstrated how they do things, so no need to wait and see any longer. When they say they want to straighten something out, that means replacing relatively non-partisan people with people who will provide greater fealty to the president.

The Kennedy brothers weren't trying to stop assassinations. They tried to assassinate Castro, and JFK supported a coup in South Vietnam that lead to their leader's assassination. JFK didn't want him assassinated, but it was a foreseeable outcome of the coup.

Lewis- the wait and see refers to document review and follow up if needed. There is fealty in every administration as well as corruption. Deep State or bureacracy within Departments and Agencies is another story. Truth is sometimes elusive but nothing wrong with pursuit.

JFK and RFK had no idea that the State Department was a puppet to the CIA and that Foriegn Policy was being conducted by CIA and not State. They wanted to move away from Dulles and CIA and rebuild the State Department. Regime change through assassination they definately did not want as Policy. Some things were in play when JFK came in. Killing Castro was always there but never attempted.

[cobalt]

''No one impersonated Oswald. As has been pointed out numerous times if you want to ‘impersonate’ someone you don’t choose someone that looks absolutely nothing like him.''

J.Edgar Hoover believed that Oswald was impersonated- by telephone and by someone that sounded nothing like him. So it does happen.

''Way past time to let this embarrassment go. Time removed this fantasy ‘burden’ from the American people. It’s gone on too long.''

It's not a burden to those in power otherwise they would open all their files. They can live with conspiracy theories since, I presume, the unvarnished truth is more dangerous to them. From my perspective you are asking for the public to condone a coup d'etat in order to avoid embarrassment to those who benefitted by it and their supporters who have acquiesced in it.

[Herlock Sholmes]

60 years on, theory after theory and now all of these released files and guess what? Still not an iota of evidence of a plot. Not a smidgeon. Not a scintilla. And still not even one piece of paper proving that Oswald was a CIA operative. How could this fantasy still be active? Tenacity and obsession over reason, evidence and common sense. Conspiracy is a big game played jointly by hobbyists and those that make a living from it.

Way past time to let this embarrassment go. Time removed this fantasy ‘burden’ from the American people. It’s gone on too long.

[Herlock Sholmes]

No one impersonated Oswald. As has been pointed out numerous times if you want to ‘impersonate’ someone you don’t choose someone that looks absolutely nothing like him. This was simply a case of mistaken identity. Read Shenon.

[FISHY1118]

Thank you. I am still learning.
The comments of Dr Curtis of Parkland Hospital describing the head wound as frontal should have gotten more publicity.

Indeed it should have . As should have everything that was mentioned on the day that the W.C thought didn't matter.

[scottnapa]

An eariler comment was made linking a CIA involvement with Oswald In Mexico City with a CIA involvement in New Orleans.
The CIA in Mexico City want to have the President of Mexico to not recognize the Castro Government.
The CIA wants to instill fear in the Mexican ruling class. that a Cuban inspired Communist revolution in Mexico would rob them of their wealth.
I see the OSWALD protest and arrest in New Orleans as part of a FBI effort to embarrass the FPCC. The CIA very interested in DRE international affairs, .\
and less interested in a domestic FPCC.
OSWALD in New Orleans is public. There is no reason for a TV news station to film a one person protest. The Hoover loves publicity.
The FBI had access to all of Oswald's correspondence with the FPCC. The FBI had its own source, inside the group's office, which it used to copy both correspondence, and the FPCC's membership and mailing lists. The FBI routinely prepared intelligence updates on the FPCC and copied the CIA on much of that information. Oswald wrote to Vincent T. Lee, head of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee in New York:

In regards to my efforts to start a branch of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee in New Orleans…I rented an office as planned and was promptly closed 3 days later for some obsure [sic] reasons by the renters, they said something about remodeling, ect. [sic] I'm sure you understand after that I worked out of a post office box and by useing [sic] street demonstrations and some circular work have substained [sic] a great deal of interest but no new members. Through the efforts of some cuban-exial [sic] 'gusanos' a street demonstration was attacked and we were oficialy [sic] cautioned by the police.

This August 1, 1963 letter, postmarked August 4, describes a street demonstration and physical confrontation. However, the confrontaion on Canal Street happens on August 9th, substantiating the idea that the protest and arrest of Oswald is political theater.

Asking to talk to an FBI agent is NOT typical for any American, much less a proclaimed Marxist Communist. Oswald offers to inform on the New Orleans FPCC chapter to FBI Agent Quigley. Why would Oswald volunteer to betray a notional New Orleans committee of one? The FBI finds no Hidell. No group. Oswald is not a political activist; he is a street performer protester.

[scottnapa]

Hi Scott, I find your information and research very impressive, thanks for posting it ,

It certainly helps to promote this thread, and in my opinion helps bring to light that Lee Harvey Oswald wasn’t the "lone nut gunman " people have been led to believe via the Warren Commission "cover up" report.

Thank you. I am still learning.
The comments of Dr Curtis of Parkland Hospital describing the head wound as frontal should have gotten more publicity.

[FISHY1118]

Hi Scott, I find your information and research very impressive, thanks for posting it ,

It certainly helps to promote this thread, and in my opinion helps bring to light that Lee Harvey Oswald wasn’t the "lone nut gunman " people have been led to believe via the Warren Commission "cover up" report.

[scottnapa]

The current US Administration has described the CIA as worse than anyone can imagine. It would be highly unlikely to find any admission by the CIA or FBI in documents beyond tbe documents that admit to knowing who Oswald was. Oswald was being monitored by the FBI before the Assassination. Both agencies knew who he was before the assassination.

There are documents related to Oswalds time in Atsuki Japan and the U2 project. There are documents that show Oswald was in Russian speaking and writing school courtesy of the US Marines. There are documents showing his time in the Soviet Union. It was the height of the Cold War and any idea that Oswald was a Marine, trained in Russian, and just allowed to defect would, in my mind, be ludicrous.

There are many documents regarding all of the work Jim Garrison did and the CIA documents that analyze his interviews with the NYTimes and others in May 1967. Its hard to dispute the ties of CIA- Guy Bannister, Clay Shaw and David Ferrie considering Ferrie was Oswalds boss in the Civil Air Patrol in New Orleans or the relationship between Carlos Marcello, Johnny Roselli and David Ferrie.

The CIA Oswald Webster and was into serious regime change in the 50s, 60's and possibly the 70's. It seems bizarre to think the Military Intelligence community would let one of their own military men, working on U2 in Japan, just go off to Russis. A very hard pill to swallow.

Oswalds defection and return without being debriefed dispells that for me.

The CIA debriefing of Oswald was handled by Andy Anderson. Oswald is more likely an ONI dangle not CIA.
The most suspicious aspects of Oswald's defection are Helsinki, Albert Switzerland College and going to the American Embassy.
The Russian Embassy in Helsinki is the only place in the world where a same day visa can be obtained to enter the USSR. Not common knowledge.

Albert Schweitzer College was an experimental school not a traditional degree-granting four year college. It was non-accredited and very small with less than 50 students and a few staff members. Not common knowledge.How did Lee Oswald find out about this "school"? The school was unknown to the Swiss police. The school didn't advertise. The only influx of applicants came from word of mouth and Friends of Albert Schweitzer College.

Oswald Robert Edward Webster and Nicolas Petrulli all went to the American Embassy in Moscow to declare their intentions to expatriate, and all three returned to America, safely and with less difficulty than these other defectors who did not go the Moscow Embassy: Charles Lucas, Sgt. Joseph Durtkanicz, Sgt Lewis Henry Jones, Pvt Vladimir Sloboda, William H. Martin, Bernon Mitchell, none made an appearance at American embassy and all died without returning to America. Sgt Fletcher spend 22 years in a Stazi defector "village". Mollie and Morris Block defected as a couple, and luckily they were interviewed by a correspondent from the New York Times in Odessa. Otherwise their defection might have lasted as long as Sgt. Fletcher.
Bruce Frederick Davis is the defector that may be a dangle like Oswald or Webster. Davis defected. He did not speak Russian, knew no one in Russia, refused Soviet citizenship and made numerous unauthorized trips including Russian air bases. He returns to America after three years.

[Lewis C]

Two things here.
Do I trust any government to not lie ? No
Do I think this Administration can straighten out the CIA ? They said they were so will have to see.

As a note. The CIA in the 50's and 60's under Dulles had taken over the role of Department of State and was setting Foriegn Policy. Another reason JFK wanted to break up the CIA and fired Dulles. They were using assassinations fir regime change and the Kennedy brothers were going to stop it.

This administration has already demonstrated how they do things, so no need to wait and see any longer. When they say they want to straighten something out, that means replacing relatively non-partisan people with people who will provide greater fealty to the president.

The Kennedy brothers weren't trying to stop assassinations. They tried to assassinate Castro, and JFK supported a coup in South Vietnam that lead to their leader's assassination. JFK didn't want him assassinated, but it was a foreseeable outcome of the coup.

[Patrick Differ]

Hmm. You say this after referring, in your previous post, to what the current administration said, as if that meant something. It would be very hard to make the case that the current administration is more credible than a previous administration.

Two things here.
Do I trust any government to not lie ? No
Do I think this Administration can straighten out the CIA ? They said they were so will have to see.

As a note. The CIA in the 50's and 60's under Dulles had taken over the role of Department of State and was setting Foriegn Policy. Another reason JFK wanted to break up the CIA and fired Dulles. They were using assassinations fir regime change and the Kennedy brothers were going to stop it.

[Lewis C]

The only thing I know for sure Herlock is that governments never lie to its citizens. Just ask them :-) Peace!

Hmm. You say this after referring, in your previous post, to what the current administration said, as if that meant something. It would be very hard to make the case that the current administration is more credible than a previous administration.

[Herlock Sholmes]

The only thing I know for sure Herlock is that governments never lie to its citizens. Just ask them :-) Peace!

Absolutely Patrick. No one could doubt that governments lie, break the rules, defy convention and cover things up but we can’t assume that they lie on every single occasion. One of the main complaints from the Warren Commission counsels (which came across strongly in Shenon’s excellent book) was that it was like trying to get blood from a stone to get info from the FBI and the CIA. I don’t think that any of them were under any doubt that they held back information that showed them or potentially showed them in a bad light. One of their other main complaints was that Warren was far too concerned about the feelings of the Kennedy family.

I think that Oswald acted alone. You and many others think that he was part of a conspiracy. The problem is that we will never get to a stage where everyone agrees because evidence can be interpreted in different ways. To be honest, I just wish that it could be conclusively solved one way or another then the American people would be able to move on from this tragedy. Likewise the RFK murder which also has many thinking that it wasn’t just a straightforward assassination by a madman.

I’m from the UK and the last General Election was the first time that I didn’t bother to vote. I wouldn’t send any one of them to do my weekly shopping because they’d come back with the wrong stuff or disappear with my money.

[Patrick Differ]

I agree that there’s nothing wrong with that but the tendency is to assume links. The fact that the FBI and the CIA knew of Oswald certainly gives them a reason for wanting to distance themselves from him which, for me, explains the perception of a cover-up. The Secret Service for example should have been warned about the presence of someone like Oswald before Kennedy’s visit. They did receive a list and checked out the people on it but they received nothing about the man that went on to kill the President. It’s hardly surprising that these agencies wanted to hide this fact. We can’t assume that they were involved because of this particular cover up though.

The only thing I know for sure Herlock is that governments never lie to its citizens. Just ask them :-) Peace!