JFK Assassination Documents to be released this year

[Fiver]

There were about half a dozen groups considering killing Kennedy.

Feel free to list these half a dozen groups and their motives for killing JFK.

But one group did and achieved a great deal. This group showed that the so called 'leader of the free world' could be executed in public if he defied the will of powerful economic interests. (In America they are called 'oil magnates' or 'tech entrepreneurs' whilst in Russia they are called 'oligarchs.')

Feel free to show how JFK's economic policies were harming US oligarchs and how those economic policies changed under LBJ.

[Fiver]

It is as facile a point to make as some CT saying that JD Tippit made an emotional farewell to his son on that day which proves he was 'badgeman' or connected to the conspiracy. Neither of these actions have been explained by the actors themselves so no proof is available, only supposition.

JD Tippit didn't make an an emotional farewell to his son on that day. Any source which claims that doesn't know that Tippit had two sons.

[Fiver]

60 years of conspiracy theorists tormenting the Kennedy family with goulish fantasies and totally illogical conspiracies.

It's worse for the Tippit family as many Conspiracists try to make an officer killed in the line of duty into part of a plot to kill JFK.

[cobalt]

Hi Sherlock,

As I see it there was a conspiracy and it had been arranged for Oswald to be linked to that conspiracy. But the shots that killed Kennedy did not have to be the exclusive preserve of the one rifle connected to Oswald; that was a conclusion reached by the WC (although not unanimously) for political reasons.

It's sometimes asked why the conspirators would have risked Oswald wandering around the TSBD during the assassination but I can't see the problem. He was probably on the 2nd floor during the shots but even if he had gone outside and been photographed that would not remove the links that had been made between Oswald and the Carcano rifle allegedly left by him on the 6th floor. A fellow conspirator(s), named or anonymous, could have been discovered in that instance. There were after all a number of witnesses who thought they had seen two men on the 6th floor before the shots were fired. Which makes sense really, since most assassins would welcome a spotter to guard their rear.

The picket fence area is often discounted on this site as an extremely difficult location to control if planning to shoot from there. Yet there is evidence that this is what happened. Men in suits flashing security ID badges were reported by a few witnesses, one of whom was a civilian and is widely discredited since there are no supporting photos of him even being at the scene. However that still leaves a couple of policemen, one called Smith I think, who testified to the same. Since the official position is that no secret service personnel were in the picket fence area then it is hard to consider the presence of bogus SS as anything other than nefarious.

There was no fatal flaw in the assassination itself but the conspiracy had a problem in the aftermath. Oswald was not shot dead in the TSBD, the bus he originally boarded (armed police arrived after he had left for a taxi) nor in the Texas Theatre. (Some would claim that Tippit failed to shoot him dead as well.) LHO was living a charmed life, for a couple of days at least. Had Ruby failed in the police basement then Oswald would still have had to survive the County jail.

[Fiver]

Or why Tippit was such a well known in Oak Cliff he might have stood for election to the local council.

Tippit was based out of the Oak Cliff Substation.

[Patrick Differ]

Cobalt- if you believe the Single Bullet theory has been disproven rather than proven then you have a conspiracy. Since Humes cut corners and didn't trace the shot from back to front he only aided the conspiracy theory.

The Zapruder Film , Nix Film and Moorman film show the head shot and its aftermath with a debris field to the back and left and not to the front. So if the head exit wound was forward then why wasn't the debris field ?
Because we are to believe another theory using neck spasm proven using goats and gel heads.

A Jury in 1963/1964 would have seen these films. Would there eyes deceive them because there would not be these after the fact theories or tests to support the governments theories.

The Mafia was affiliated with the CIA because of Castro. They set up regime change assassination teams and those teams were based in New Orleans under the Mafia Control of Johnny Roselli and Carlos Marcello. They called Roselli the Colonel.

RFK went after Marcello and Hoffa and deported Marcello to the jungles of Guatemala. Marcello at that point wanted to kill RFK. Before JFK was scheduled for Dallas he was scheduled for Chicago and Miami. Chicago was Giancana and Miami was Trafficanti. The Mafia, to stop RFK, decided to cut off the head of the snake- JFK. If they couldn't get him in Chicago they would get him in Miami or Dallas.

Roselli, Giancana and Trafficanti were all murdered before they had a chance to testify. Ruby was a hood from Chicago and was into gambling and prostitution which was controlled by the MOB. Carlos Marcello controlled Dallas.

Oswald never had a chance to Defend himself. Ruby was allowed free access to Oswald. That only added to the Conspiracy theories.

Any conspiracy theory would have to include the relationships that the CIA had to the Mafia. RfK was motive for the MOB.
The Bay of Pigs was motive for the CIA. Castro was motive for the CIA and Mob assassination teams. Did they turn this assassination team concept to cut off the head of the snake.

WHo benefited from this assassination?

LBJ became President. He never would have otherwise.
RFK was marginalized and assassinated in 1968.
The MOB became more powerful.
The CIA became more powerful.
The Vietnam War escalated making millions for the Military Industrial Complex and its investors.
Hoover became FBI Director for Life, instead of forced retirement.

The MOB silenced it's own. Ruby silenced Oswald.

All from 4.8 seconds in Dallas. Assassination site #3.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Question - Where is the rear head wound in the Zapruder film?

Answer - It obviously doesn’t exist.

Conclusion - There was only an entry wound to the back of the head. There is no other conclusion.

Therefore - Shots from the rear proven.

Case closed.

[Fiver]

As Warren Commission Supporters ( Herlock, Fiver) you are asking me to support what the government states is true. Beyond a reasonable doubt.

There is a key difference - you refer to it as "the government" as if it was a monolithic single entity. The government is composed of multiple organizations, many of which are rivals. Many of these organization are composed of factions, which are rivals to each other. And those are composed of individuals, each with their own goals.

I'm not asking anyone to support anything because the government, or any section of government says it's true. Neither should we reject something just because the government says it.

We need to look at the facts. I'll look at just one example - the prints. There are two possibilities - either they were left there by Oswald, or the Dallas Police, the FBI, multiple government investigations, and multiple independent experts over the course of decades were all part of a criminal plot to kill JFK.

[Fiver]

However, in the USA you are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Oswald in this case was assassinated by ( another lone nut) before he could mount a defense.

Most Conspiracists only believe in innocent until proven guilty for Lee Harvey Oswald.

Those same Cospiracist assume that everyone who supports the idea that Oswald killed JFK is guilty of murder, conspiracy, treason, perjury, evidence tampering, etc. They don't just apply that standard to Hoover and LBJ, they apply it to the Bethesda doctors, Charles Givens, the Three Tramps, the Umbrella Man, Clay Shaw, JD Tippet, and dozens of others.

[Fiver]

No. No doubt at all. It was categorically Oswald alone. The most obviously guilty man in the history of crime.

It was categorically Oswald who killed JFK. It was categorically Oswald who killed JD Tippit.

Oswald almost certainly acted alone, but I don't rule out that he might have gotten another person or two involved who promised to help, but failed or got cold feet. Anything bigger requires a Conspiracy composed of lucky idiots.

But even the small conspiracy is wildly unlikely and I've seen no evidence to support the idea.

[Herlock Sholmes]

It was categorically Oswald who killed JFK. It was categorically Oswald who killed JD Tippit.

Oswald almost certainly acted alone, but I don't rule out that he might have gotten another person or two involved who promised to help, but failed or got cold feet. Anything bigger requires a Conspiracy composed of lucky idiots.

But even the small conspiracy is wildly unlikely and I've seen no evidence to support the idea.

The only way that I could even consider anyone else being ‘involved’ in any way was if Oswald had been in some way encouraged after a contact perhaps with Cubans in Mexico. Maybe he met one or two who let it be known that they would be willing to offer him a new life after he’d killed Kennedy. Or that they could get him anonymously into the Soviet Union. Some such lie. Maybe they told him to get to the Texas Theatre after the assassination where he’d be met. A random bloke or two could easily avoid being traced leaving Oswald stranded and telling a tale with no evidence to back it up.

There’s just no evidence of there being actual assistance though or an attempted cover-up. That’s just spy novel territory.

[Fiver]

Knott used the Leica 360 3D scanner with digital twin to perform this . Leica Geosystems and others perform these scan tests on a range of things like shootings or even the operation of chemical plants. The 360 3D is the most advanced and accurate scanner in commercial use. The Zapruder film was used as input for the analysis.

Here's the 2013 scan that supported the Single Bullet Theory.

"With the help of Leica Geosystems’ ScanStation P20, ballistic experts Michael and Luke Haag set out to determine if the “single bullet theory” was possible in “Cold Case JFK”, part of a special Nova series presented by PBS." - Leica Geosystems

[Fiver]

I don't follow your logic here. The conspiracy (the one you think does not exist) succeeded on all the three grounds you mention. The POTUS was assassinated; the perpetrators were not identified; and the political shift under Johnson proved beneficial to those who backed the coup d'etat. Dulles and McCone (central figures in the WC) both had spells leading the World Bank IIRC as part of their reward.

You are assuming the lack of evidence of a Conspiracy is proof that there was a successful Conspiracy.

The only political shift under LBJ was he pushed harder for Civil Rights than JFK. Neither of Dulles or McCone ran the World Bank. Neither they, nor the CIA gained anything from JFK's death.

[Patrick Differ]

In the USA you are innocent until proven guilty. Period. You are also entitled to a trial by jury. Is it perfect? I would think not if you consider OJ Simpson and change of venue.

[Fiver]

What witnesses saw Oswald in the 6th floor window? How credible could they be 6 stories down with a window half open and the shooter supposedly perched in the back corner of the window. And in a 6 to 10 second timeframe.

After the first shot, several people spotted the rifle in the sixth story window of the Book depository - Robert Jackson, Malcom Couch, James Crawford, Mrs Earle Cabell, James Worrell, and Amos Euins. Howard Brennan saw the shooter, describing him as a "white male, approximately thirty, slender build, height five feet ten inches, 165 pounds". Arnold Rowland saw a man with a rifle before the shootings. Combined with the testimonies of Harold Norman, James Jarman, and Bonnie Ray Williams; who heard shots above them; it is clear that there was a shooter on the 6th floor of the TSBD.

But there was no definite identification of the shooter. For that, we have the forensic evidence - Oswald's prints, the rifle being Oswald's and provably the murder weapon. And Oswald's lack of an alibi.

No one. A good team of Defense Lawyers would tear these witnesses apart.

The defense could only tear them apart if the prosecution was stupid enough to claim that the witnesses had positively ID'd Oswald.