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Kate's Last Half Hour

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  • Joseph Barnett goes to St. James Orange Market waiting to establish an alibi. The night watchman Blenkinsop is there.
    Rather than have him say "What are you doing here so early?", Joe asks him: "Have you seen a man and Woman....?"

    That gives him an excuse to go and ask the watchman, and/or look for a couple inside the warehouse.
    Behind the watchman's back he takes off his respectable coat so he can wear it again when he escapes.

    He exits the warehouse via the door that leads to the square, which the watchman left ajar.
    Seeing that P.C. Watkins had passed, he exits the square via the Duke Street exit, meets Kate at 1:34 and is seen by Lawende & co at 1:35.

    Comment


    • You've still got it in for poor old Joe Barnett, eh?
      Regards, Jon S.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Wickerman View Post
        You've still got it in for poor old Joe Barnett, eh?
        Yes I have because he fits the case so well. And it's attitudes like yours that prevented him being identified as the Ripper then. Poor Joe gave a weak alibi for his girls murder of playing whist with his friends until he went to bed at midnight. Mary was killed well after midnight. Joe probably hoped to give her his little winnings to pay for her rent.

        Did they check out his alibi? Did they record that?....or did they feel sorry for him?

        Comment


        • Yup i think we can eliminate poor old Joe Barnett . Nothing to see here.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by FISHY1118 View Post
            Yup i think we can eliminate poor old Joe Barnett . Nothing to see here.
            WHY FISHY?????
            give me
            one good reason why he gets a free-ride.
            Last edited by Leanne; 07-23-2019, 06:15 AM.

            Comment


            • If Eddowes was a fish , you have me hook line and sinker , but for Barnett to have removed Eddowes kidney and uterus and inflict all the other injuries in 5 minutes in the dark , not possible where his concerned im afraid.

              Comment


              • Hi
                At one time I was passionate about Barnett , being 'Number one suspect', I actually started a thread entitled that.
                But since then with the passage of time, one sees the whole case through more experienced eyes.
                The trouble with all of us, is we are trying to get every snippet of information, from newspapers , and use them to picture what could have happened,, even knowing that most reports were vastly inaccurate.
                There were several people in the area of the square that evening , around that time, hard to believe that Eddowes, and killer were the only couple.
                I remember reading that somebody heard, and saw, a man walk by close by to the scene, muttering to himself '' They think I am the killer , but they are wrong'' he was carrying an umbrella.
                Seems to resemble, a man seen near Bucks Row, exiting a building wearing overalls, muttering ''They hunt geese, but not always catch them''.
                Easy to suggest that this person [ if existed] was a person of interest.
                I would be surprised if Barnett was anything more, then a very depressed and anxious soul.
                But stranger things have happened.
                Regards Richard.

                Comment



                • Originally posted by richardnunweek View Post
                  Hi

                  There were several people in the area of the square that evening , around that time, hard to believe that Eddowes, and killer were the only couple.
                  I remember reading that somebody heard, and saw, a man walk by close by to the scene, muttering to himself '' They think I am the killer , but they are wrong'' he was carrying an umbrella.
                  PLEASE PLEASE, find me that report. What were these people doing? Waiting for the orange market to begin? waiting for the shops to open?

                  Were all the women wearing clothes similar to Kate's? Where they all waiting for the policeman to pass so they could all use the square?

                  Why did the nightwatchman at
                  Kearley and Long's warehouse leave THE DOOR AJAR?

                  Why did Jack choose a location that was so busy?

                  Last edited by Leanne; 07-23-2019, 10:28 PM.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by richardnunweek View Post
                    Hi
                    At one time I was passionate about Barnett , being 'Number one suspect', I actually started a thread entitled that.
                    But since then with the passage of time, one sees the whole case through more experienced eyes.
                    The trouble with all of us, is we are trying to get every snippet of information, from newspapers , and use them to picture what could have happened,, even knowing that most reports were vastly inaccurate.
                    There were several people in the area of the square that evening , around that time, hard to believe that Eddowes, and killer were the only couple.
                    I remember reading that somebody heard, and saw, a man walk by close by to the scene, muttering to himself '' They think I am the killer , but they are wrong'' he was carrying an umbrella.
                    Seems to resemble, a man seen near Bucks Row, exiting a building wearing overalls, muttering ''They hunt geese, but not always catch them''.
                    Easy to suggest that this person [ if existed] was a person of interest.
                    I would be surprised if Barnett was anything more, then a very depressed and anxious soul.
                    But stranger things have happened.
                    Regards Richard.
                    INSPECTOR COLLARD SAID AT HER INQUEST:
                    When I got to the square I took immediate steps to have the neighbourhood searched for the person who committed the murder. Mr. M'Williams, chief of the Detective Department, on arriving shortly afterwards sent men to search in all directions in Spitalfields, both in streets and lodging-houses. Several men were stopped and searched in the streets, without any good result. I have had a house-to-house inquiry made in the vicinity of Mitre-square as to any noises or whether persons were seen in the place; but I have not been able to find any beyond the witnesses who saw a man and woman talking together. "

                    There were several MEN around! The man that Blenkinsop spoke to may have been one of these searchers, but the timing he gave of this encounter was too early.

                    Eddowes and killer were the only couple!


                    Comment


                    • The killer snuk into the warehouse, took off his coat, waited until Watkins had passed, exited via the unlocked door, made sure the square wasn't being used by another couple, ran round to the Duke Street entrance, acquired his victim, took her back into the square and BANG! ........ Then he exited back to St. James Orange Market to wait until he could fill his basket.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by richardnunweek View Post
                        Hi

                        There were several people in the area of the square that evening , around that time, hard to believe that Eddowes, and killer were the only couple.
                        It's hard to believe that the killer would choose a busy square, after being disturbed with Stride.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Leanne View Post
                          The killer snuk into the warehouse, took off his coat, waited until Watkins had passed, exited via the unlocked door, made sure the square wasn't being used by another couple, ran round to the Duke Street entrance, acquired his victim, took her back into the square and BANG! ........ Then he exited back to St. James Orange Market to wait until he could fill his basket.
                          Yep. That's what happened. You solved it Leanne. Case closed. Finally put this mystery to bed.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Leanne View Post

                            PLEASE PLEASE, find me that report. What were these people doing? Waiting for the orange market to begin? waiting for the shops to open?

                            Were all the women wearing clothes similar to Kate's? Where they all waiting for the policeman to pass so they could all use the square?

                            Why did the nightwatchman at
                            Kearley and Long's warehouse leave THE DOOR AJAR?

                            Why did Jack choose a location that was so busy?
                            It is this story. I posted it a while back.
                            The Star
                            Largest Circulation of Any Evening Paper in the Kingdom.
                            LONDON. MONDAY, 1 OCTOBER, 1888.


                            Mrs. Lindsay, who occupies the two front rooms of 11, Duke-street - almost opposite Church-passage, leading to the court - records a strange circumstance, which may or may not have a direct bearing upon the murder. She says that she is a very light sleeper, and is easily awakened by hearing any unusual noise. Early on Sunday morning she says - at what hour she could not specify - she heard the sound of one or two voices in the street below. Prompted by curiosity she looked out of the window just in time to hear a man's voice say, "I am NOT THE MURDERER," uttered apparently in a tone of anger. Surprised on hearing the words, she called her husband, who, with her, saw a man disappearing down the street towards Aldgate. As he passed beneath a lamp she was able to discern that he was a man of average height, dressed in dark clothes, and carrying in his hand an umbrella and a small parcel.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by jerryd View Post
                              As he passed beneath a lamp she was able to discern that he was a man of average height, dressed in dark clothes, and carrying in his hand an umbrella and a small parcel.[/I]
                              So many sightings of a man carrying a small parcel. I guess it wasn't that peculiar back then but still.

                              Comment



                              • Originally posted by Leanne View Post
                                PLEASE PLEASE, find me that report. What were these people doing? Waiting for the orange market to begin? waiting for the shops to open?
                                They were just passing through. Probably after a night out, like Lawende, etc.

                                Blenkinsop was not the watchman of a warehouse, but of some roadworks in St James' Square.

                                Star 1st Oct;
                                "James Blenkingsop, who was on duty as a watchman in St. James's-place (leading to the square), where some street improvements are taking place, states that about half-past one a respectably-dressed man came up to him and said, "Have you seen a man and a woman go through here?" "I didn't take any notice," returned Blenkingsop. "I have seen some people pass.""

                                Most likely the questioner was one of the detectives sent out, trying to establish where and when Kate and her killer had entered Mitre Square, but Blenkinsop was unable to help, and wrongly estimated the time of the encounter

                                Were all the women wearing clothes similar to Kate's? Where they all waiting for the policeman to pass so they could all use the square?
                                There's no mention of women specifically and no descriptions - "I didn't take any notice," returned Blenkingsop. "I have seen some people pass."

                                Why did the nightwatchman at Kearley and Long's warehouse leave THE DOOR AJAR?
                                Times 12 Oct
                                "George James Morris, the next witness called, said he was watchman at Messrs. Kearley and Tonge's tea merchants, in Mitre-square. He went on duty there at 7 o'clock in the evening.
                                THE CORONER. - What happened at a quarter to 2 o'clock? - Police-constable Watkins, who was on the Mitre-square beat, knocked at the door of the warehouse. It was slightly "on the jar." He was then sweeping the steps down towards the door, and as he was doing so the door was pushed. "
                                "There was nothing unusual in his door being open or in his being at work at a quarter to 2 o'clock on Sunday morning.
                                By a juryman. - His door had not been on the jar more than two or three minutes before Watkins called him"

                                So Morris had just opened the door slightly and was sweeping the dirt toward it, and probably out of it if Watkins hadn't arrived.

                                Comment

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