Packer and Schwartz

[c.d.]

Hello CD.

"If Swanson allows for the possibility of another killer besides the B.S. man, I would expect that he took all times into consideration before making that statement."

Of course. But there are other considerations besides bare time. For example, does a lady pick herself up, dust herself off, and then meet a chap (who had remained hidden) and walk with him into a dark passageway, turn around, and pull out the cachous?

Cheers.
LC

Hello Lynn,

Hmmmm....sounds to me like you are describing a lady who was soliciting but of course we know that simply can't be now could it?

c.d.

[c.d.]

"If I was eating candy and had it in my fist and someone came and pushed me...I wouldn't just drop the candy...I would probably make a fist and clench the candy while defending myself. I'm pretty sure my first instinct is...don't drop the the candy."

Hello Rocky,

That would seem to imply that you had time to give the decision conscious thought and that as you were falling you opted to chance a broken wrist in order to protect the candy. Also, if you were being dragged, I would suspect that rather than have your hand in a fist you would have it open in order to push your assailant away.

c.d.

[RockySullivan]

"If I was eating candy and had it in my fist and someone came and pushed me...I wouldn't just drop the candy...I would probably make a fist and clench the candy while defending myself. I'm pretty sure my first instinct is...don't drop the the candy."

Hello Rocky,

That would seem to imply that you had time to give the decision conscious thought and that as you were falling you opted to chance a broken wrist in order to protect the candy. Also, if you were being dragged, I would suspect that rather than have your hand in a fist you would have it open in order to push your assailant away.

c.d.

Hi cd, I've def wiped out holding candy before..and my instinct is to clench and hold on to the candy without even thinking

[Jeff Leahy]

Hi John and Karsten

Firstly I'm now in agreement with Karsten that Schwartz wasn't the Seaside home witness..

However I'm not certain that Schwartz did not see the murder and that BSM and the man seen by Marshal and Smith whereunto all one and the same.

Thats because Schwartz POV was almost entirely of the suspects shoulders. Schwartz never has a good view of Stride as as he crosses the road BSM is always between Schwartz and Stride with his back to Schwartz

The only real question is did Schwartz get a good view of the mans face when he turned and shouted Lipski

I will off corse do the courtesy of answering Johns post in full, I hope he'll bear with me why I upload some POV's that make it clearer what each person saw. Obviously I can only estimate some of these I can't no for certain at what point schwartz crossed the road I can only estimate, I trust you think that reasonable

I'm also trying to finish some work for Jon Rees so it might take a little time, I'll do my best..

Hopefully this diagram will start that thought process

Many thanks

Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

Strides POV of the approaching BSM and Schwartz... Its a long walk and BSM has his back to schwartz the whole time...

[John G]

If I was eating candy and had it in my fist and someone came and pushed me...I wouldn't just drop the candy...I would probably make a fist and clench the candy while defending myself. I'm pretty sure my first instinct is...don't drop the the candy

I'm guessing your something of an exception! Natural human instinct when falling is to throw out your arms and stick your hands out to protect the head, which is why there are so many broken wrists from rollerblading and skateboarding. Nor does it explain why Stride's hand wasn't bruised or grazed.

By the way, I once fell backwards after slipping on the ice-I threw out by arms and spread my fingers, and as a consequence I ended up with a dislocated shoulder.

There is also no evidence that Stride was given any opportunity to defend herself, or made any attempt to do so. She certainly did not seem to get involved in a boxing match with BS man!

[Varqm]

Great pictures.

[Jeff Leahy]

Of course the question is? When BSM turns and shouts lipski, was he on the pavement and thus in Light as depicted here?

or was he closer into the yard and thus in shaddow?

Yours Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

Sorry they didn't upload will try again and will answer you later John but need to start work...Jef

[Jeff Leahy]

Great pictures.

Thanks Varqm

If any one wishes to see more then Jon Rees will be playing a specially edited version at his 'The murders and Mystery of Jack the Ripper' I believe in Swansea Wales 29th Oct?

Yours Jeff

[John G]

Hi John and Karsten

Firstly I'm now in agreement with Karsten that Schwartz wasn't the Seaside home witness..

However I'm not certain that Schwartz did not see the murder and that BSM and the man seen by Marshal and Smith whereunto all one and the same.

Thats because Schwartz POV was almost entirely of the suspects shoulders. Schwartz never has a good view of Stride as as he crosses the road BSM is always between Schwartz and Stride with his back to Schwartz

The only real question is did Schwartz get a good view of the mans face when he turned and shouted Lipski

I will off corse do the courtesy of answering Johns post in full, I hope he'll bear with me why I upload some POV's that make it clearer what each person saw. Obviously I can only estimate some of these I can't no for certain at what point schwartz crossed the road I can only estimate, I trust you think that reasonable

I'm also trying to finish some work for Jon Rees so it might take a little time, I'll do my best..

Hopefully this diagram will start that thought process

Many thanks

Jeff

Hello Jeff,

Thanks for this. Excellent diagram. It also appears to me, from the diagram, that Schwartz didn't get a good look of Stride either, more of a sideways glance.

[lynn cates]

yes

Hello John.

"In any event, it seems to me that removing Schwartz from the equation means things make much more sense. And recapping on the weaknesses of his evidence: the virtually insurmountable cachous problem, which by itself is virtually fatal to the theory Stride was killed by BS Man; Stride's clothes not damaged or creased; flower remaining intact during at least two assaults; no bruising or grazing to Stride's skin, despite being thrown onto the pavement; no one else sees or hears the altercation, despite Stride screaming three times, including Mrs D, sat in the kitchen with the window open, or Mortimer, who nonetheless manages to hear passing footsteps; no likely explanation as to how BS man manages to subsequently persuade Stride to enter a pitch black narrow passageway with him, I.e. after just assaulting her; and major inconsistencies between the police and newspaper accounts."

Precisely. These are the main reasons I soured on Israel's story.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

congrats

Hello Jeff.

"I spent some time trying to reconstruct Stride's murder and generally dragging my poor long suffering girlfriend around by a neck scarf.. Needless to say I failed.."

First, I congratulate you on your attempt. Second, the failure is not to be wondered at--Schwartz's story simply CANNOT hold up.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

Master the possibilities.

Hello CD. thanks.

"Hmmmm....sounds to me like you are describing a lady who was soliciting but of course we know that simply can't be now could it?"

Of course it could--lack of evidence notwithstanding.

And we KNOW that Victorian prostitutes MUST have candy before fulfilling contracts, right?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

in the clench

Hello Rocky.

"my instinct is to clench and hold on to the candy without even thinking"

Of course, she was "clenching" it between thumb and forefinger.

Cheers.
LC