What 5 Questions Would You Like Answered?

[Observer]

Hello,

She did rather push to be released, though. It would have made more sense for her to stay where she was until morning. Roof over her head, possibly a cup of tea and slice of bread in the morning. Does look as though she had a rendezvous. Foolish, with a killer around, unless she completely trusted the person she was to meet.

Cheers,
C4

Hi C4

Did she though? At the expense of sailing into uncharted waters, and loathe to suggesting a cover-up. Was she kicked out of the station? Imagine The City Police's situation if it was found that they kicked her out of the cells into the arms of Jack The Ripper.

[Trevor Marriott]

Hello,

She did rather push to be released, though. It would have made more sense for her to stay where she was until morning. Roof over her head, possibly a cup of tea and slice of bread in the morning. Does look as though she had a rendezvous. Foolish, with a killer around, unless she completely trusted the person she was to meet.

Cheers,
C4

I think you can rule out rendezvous first of all she didn't have a watch. then look at inquest testimony

Pc Hutt

I went to her again at half-past twelve, and she then asked when she would be able to get out. I replied: "Shortly." She said, "I am capable of taking care of myself now."
Mr. Crawford: Did she tell you where she was going? - No. About two minutes to one o'clock, when I was taking her out of the cell, she asked me what time it was.

On that basis she was not that desperate to know the time. As she only asked when she was being released. If she has a rendezvous I would have thought she would have asked the time way before then and showed more anxiety to get out.

[Michael W Richards]

I think you can rule out rendezvous first of all she didn't have a watch. then look at inquest testimony

Pc Hutt

I went to her again at half-past twelve, and she then asked when she would be able to get out. I replied: "Shortly." She said, "I am capable of taking care of myself now."
Mr. Crawford: Did she tell you where she was going? - No. About two minutes to one o'clock, when I was taking her out of the cell, she asked me what time it was.

On that basis she was not that desperate to know the time. As she only asked when she was being released. If she has a rendezvous I would have thought she would have asked the time way before then and showed more anxiety to get out.

Not if she had been told to be somewhere at midnight or 1 and that the party she was to meet would be hanging about that area. IF she was told to meet someone there at that time...he, or someone connected with him is likely responsible for Kates murder.....so, is he invested enough in seeing Kate that night that he might stick around and wait for her....particularly if he knew where she had been since 8:30 and that she would be released at some point during the night.

Based on the above.....Kates hand on the chest of Sailor Man....."Im so relieved to see you waited for me, I thought you might have left".

Cheers Trevor

[lynn cates]

pawn

Hello Mac. When did Kelly pawn those boots?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

bordellos, etc.

Hello Colin. Thanks.

I see that, you too, have doubts.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

sensible

Hello Gwyneth.

"She did rather push to be released, though. It would have made more sense for her to stay where she was until morning. Roof over her head, possibly a cup of tea and slice of bread in the morning. Does look as though she had a rendezvous."

Precisely. Haven't I warned you before about making sense? Looks like I must teach you how to wave the hand and offer stale platitudes. (heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[curious4]

Out of custody

Hello Observer,

Yes, I suppose you do have a point. Could be.

Hello Trevor,

No, still think that it sounds more as though she wanted out. Perhaps she could get some idea of the time from church clocks striking the hour nearby? In the normal order of things, wouldn't she have been kept there until the morning? Kelly seemed to have thought so.

Best wishes
C4

[lynn cates]

rendezvous

Hello Trevor. How can rule out rendezvous based solely upon time. What of the expression, "I know where to find you"?

Cheers.
LC

[Trevor Marriott]

Hello Trevor. How can rule out rendezvous based solely upon time. What of the expression, "I know where to find you"?

Cheers.
LC

Where in the darkest part of Mitre Square ?

[Bridewell]

Would she have been willing to sell her honor for a two or three hour doss at four in the morning?

I imagine so. She was very ill - terminally so.

[Trevor Marriott]

Hello Observer,

Yes, I suppose you do have a point. Could be.

Hello Trevor,

No, still think that it sounds more as though she wanted out. Perhaps she could get some idea of the time from church clocks striking the hour nearby? In the normal order of things, wouldn't she have been kept there until the morning? Kelly seemed to have thought so.

Best wishes
C4

Pc Hutts testimony

I was directed by Sergeant Byfield to see if any of the prisoners were fit to be discharged. I found the deceased sober, and after she had given her name and address, she was allowed to leave.

The Foreman: Is it left to you to decide when a prisoner is sober enough to be released or not? - Not to me, but to the inspector or acting inspector on duty.

[Coroner] Is it usual to discharge prisoners who have been locked up for being drunk at all hours of the night? - Certainly.

Nothing there to show she was in a hurry to get out.

[Bridewell]

Hello,

She did rather push to be released, though. It would have made more sense for her to stay where she was until morning. Roof over her head, possibly a cup of tea and slice of bread in the morning. Does look as though she had a rendezvous. Foolish, with a killer around, unless she completely trusted the person she was to meet.

Cheers,
C4

Good point about her not pushing to be released, but I'm sure the police were wise to the ploy. On a Saturday night every effort would have been made to keep as much cell space available as possible.

[Bridewell]

My five questions (trying to avoid too much duplication of what has already been posted):

(As we're not allowed to ask the name of the killer) Which of the many candidates so far proposed as the killer were innocent of any involvement in the killings?
Which, if any, witnesses lied in their inquest testimony / statements to police?
What, if any, were the lies?
Which, if any of them, gave an accurate description of the killer?
Why does the Aberconway version of the MacNaghten Memoranda include a reference to the City PC which is not found in the file copy?

[curious4]

Get out of jail

Hello Trevor,

Got me there I suppose, don't remember reading the bit about the inspector instructing him to check who was fit for release. Does rather weaken my case - providing he wasn't trying to shift the blame for her death on to other shoulders.

Thanks for the excerpt from the police code by the way. Very interesting, I shall put it in a safe place along with the feather duster for future use.

Hello Bridewell,

Yes, your point about clearing the cells for a saturday night had crossed my mind and as my case seems to have been weakened anyway... (weakened, though, not dead yet!)

Hello Lynn,

Many thanks for your kind words. Much more of that and I shall be suffering from hybris!

All good wishes,
C4/Gwyneth

[Observer]

Pc Hutts testimony

I was directed by Sergeant Byfield to see if any of the prisoners were fit to be discharged. I found the deceased sober, and after she had given her name and address, she was allowed to leave.

The Foreman: Is it left to you to decide when a prisoner is sober enough to be released or not? - Not to me, but to the inspector or acting inspector on duty.

[Coroner] Is it usual to discharge prisoners who have been locked up for being drunk at all hours of the night? - Certainly.

Nothing there to show she was in a hurry to get out.

Hi Mr Marriot

Right. So are you of an opinion that Eddowes was gently shown the door so to speak? It was in fact the police who used their initiative to put Eddowes back on the street. It certainly looks that way.

Regards

Observer