JFK Assassination Documents to be released this year

[Fiver]

That is not the point at all.

The point is that he got the colour badly wrong.

He said not only that the jacket was brown but that it was tan.

You are wrong about the jacket - again.


Mr. BALL. What kind--when you talked to the police officers before you saw this man, did you give them a description of the clothing he had on?
Mr. CALLAWAY. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. What did you tell them you saw?
Mr. CALLAWAY. I told them he had some dark trousers and a light tannish gray windbreaker jacket, and I told him that he was fair complexion, dark hair.


As to the other witnesses.
Mr. BELIN. I am between 5' 10" and 5' 11". Closer to 5' 11", I believe.
Mr. BENAVIDES. I would say he was about your size, and he had a light-beige jacket, and was lightweight.
Mr. BELIN. Did it have buttons or a zipper, or do you remember?
Mr. BENAVIDES. It seemed like it was a zipper-type jacket.

Mr. BELIN. Do you remember what he had on?
Mrs. DAVIS. He had on a light-brown-tan jacket..

Mr. BALL. How was this man dressed that had the pistol in his hand?
Mr. GUINYARD. He had on a pair of black britches and a brown shirt and a lithe sort of light-gray-looking jacket.

Mr. BALL. Did you recognize him from his clothing?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had on a light short jacket, dark trousers. I looked at his clothing, but I looked at his face, too.
Mr. BALL. Did he have the same clothing on that the man had that you saw shoot the officer?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had, these dark trousers on.
Mr. BALL. Did he have a jacket or a shirt? The man that you saw shoot Officer Tippit and run away, did you notice if he had a jacket on?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had a jacket on when he done it.
Mr. BALL. What kind of a jacket, what general color of jacket?
Mrs. MARKHAM. It was a short jacket open in the front, kind of a grayish tan.

Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this now. When you first saw this man, had the police car stopped or not?
Mr. SCOGGINS. Yes; he stopped. When I saw he stopped, then I looked to see why he was stopping, you see, and I saw this man with a light-colored jacket on.

Mr. BALL. What kind of clothes did he have on when he shot the officer?
Mr. SMITH. He had on dark pants--just a minute. He had on dark pants and a sport coat of some kind. I can't really remember very well.
Mr. BALL. I will show you a coat----
Mr. SMITH. This looks like it.
Mr. BALL. This is Commission's Exhibit 162, a grey, zippered jacket. Have you ever seen this before?
Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir; that looks like what he had on. A jacket.
Mr. BALL. That is the jacket he had on?
Mr. SMITH. Yes.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Nuts isn't it. Although I said I'd had enough of this thread (hence my return to trying to implicate Bury for every ripper letter ever written) I feel obliged to highlight what are ridiculous points.

Are you saying that there are some letters that Bury didn’t write? They must have been written by Monty (not Caz’s cat)

[caz]

I refer to witnesses' descriptions of Tippit's killer given in # 1005.

One witness said he was short and stocky with bushy hair, another that he had curly hair and a ruddy complexion, another that he had black wavy hair with a white jacket, another that he had dark hair with a sport coat, another that he was aged no more than 20 years, another that he was wearing a darkish-brown jacket, and another that he was aged about 30.

That makes seven witnesses who gave descriptions of the murderer which cannot be descriptions of Oswald.

At about the time of the Tippit shooting, he was buying popcorn in a movie theater, according to a member of the theater's staff.

Oswald did not murder Tippit.

So the guy who did murder Tippit was short and stocky, with bushy, curly and wavy, black and dark hair, and was wearing a white sport coat and darkish-brown jacket, and he was about 30 but no more than 20.

He must have got away because there was nothing unusual about him.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Hi Herlock,

In a recent documentary, it was said that JFK himself insisted on giving the waiting crowds in Dallas an unrestricted view of himself and Jackie, who at the time was on a par with the popularity that Princess Diana would one day enjoy, and the interest in seeing Jackie and what outfit she was wearing was off the scale. JFK himself made a tongue-in-cheek comment similar to one made in the 1980s by Prince Charles, suggesting that the crowds were there more to see his wife.

JFK felt it would be disrespectful to all the people who had come to see the couple, to hide away inside a car with no open top, surrounded by his security people, as if they were in fear of the local population.

He made himself a target for Oswald by making himself accessible to everyone else.

Perhaps JFK was in on the conspiracy too, and was tired of living with a woman who stole the limelight.

Love,

Caz
X

Hi Caz,

Yes JFK was ‘in on it too’ but it’s worse than that…

Lee Harvey Oswald actually committed suicide. On the day that he killed Oswald he went to the Western Union office to mail some money to one of his dancers Karen Carlin who had bills to pay and Ruby had closed his club as a mark of respect. His transaction was timed and we know the time that Oswald was shot. It left Ruby around 4 minutes to get from the Western Union office (where he had no way of knowing if he’d get stuck in a queue or not. As the police were bringing Oswald down he complained of being cold so one of the officers had to go back up to get Oswald’s sweater. This was a delay caused by Oswald himself. If he hadn’t have requested this sweater then he’d have been in the van and driving away before Ruby arrived. Therefore, according to our unfriendly neighbourhood conspiracy theorists, Lee Harvey Oswald was a part to his own murder.

Why wouldn’t he be?

[Herlock Sholmes]

So the guy who did murder Tippit was short and stocky, with bushy, curly and wavy, black and dark hair, and was wearing a white sport coat and darkish-brown jacket, and he was about 30 but no more than 20.

He must have got away because there was nothing unusual about him.

It’s simply selective witness quoting Caz.

[Herlock Sholmes]

The evidence presented here:

https://spartacus-educational.com/JFKcraigR.htm

shows Craig in an entirely different light to the cowardly attack perpetrated by our resident serial character assassin.

I wonder why a man who owned two pistols would buy a shotgun solely for the purpose of committing suicide.

Well, well, I’m accused of being a ‘serial character assassin’ after his partner in crime has spent the last few pages assassinating the characters of Kellerman and Greer. And how he and his pals continue to assassinate the characters of Drs Humes, Boswell and Frinck. And of Ruth Paine. And of Buell Frazier and his sister. Oh….and Earl Warren and the other commissioners and counsels. And the 8 pathologists at the HSCA. And Lyndon Johnson. And the military. And the CIA. And the FBI. Not a bad list there.

And to finish off……comments about Craig from two of the most revered of conspiracy theorists.


Harold Weisberg:

[I]“Roger Craig may be a brave guy and all of that, but he is also full of what is generally reserved for toilets. I have gone over his annotation of his testimony, as printed, and his account of the changes is utterly impossible. I spent too many years working with court reporters, particularly, the firm the Commission used, to find it possible to credit this in any way. More, have traced that testimony all the way from Dallas to the Government Printing Office, and it is printed as it was taken down, I have copies of the typescript sent to the GPO, and I have the letter of transmittal to DC the bills for taking it, the whole story. Roger is, despite Penn's [Penn Jones] great love for him, at best simply wrong, in the newer areas, what he embellished his original testimony with. Now I have met Roger, and he is a fine looking, clean-cut kind of guy who appears to be truthful, serious and all that-just like dozens of guys I once guarded in an Army locked ward in a large mental institution. He does not impress me as the kind of guy who is out to make trouble. But he is.”


Mary Ferrell:

“I knew Roger Craig for several years before his death. It is my belief that Roger was a very sick young man. He had made a name for himself as a very promising young law enforcement officer. When he came forward with some of the "stories" he told following the events of that November weekend, he believed that he would be offered a great deal of money and, possibly, speaking engagements. I am very sorry to say that I am one of the few conspiracy nuts who never believed Roger Craig.




When Roger made a number of speeches about the fact that "they" prevented him from getting a job, I talked my husband into giving him a job. Roger did not want to work. He wanted people to give him money because he had "seen something or other."




I have made enemies because I have continued to say that I have never really believed him.”

[caz]

There's nothing superfluous about a suspect providing good evidence he was on the ground floor at 12.23. It ties in with an earlier witness seeing him as well. For the case against Oswald to stick it is necessary to put him on the 6th floor with a rifle at 12.30. In fact Oswald with a rifle anywhere in the building at any time that day would have been good enough. As Curry acknowledged this was never done. That is the elephant in the room.

The closest they managed was the Brennan ID which has been well aired over the years.

As you know well from the A6 Case there is no requirement for a suspect to produce an alibi. If Oswald was not seen anywhere at 12.30 then it does not automatically follow he was shooting the president on the 6th floor.

No, cobalt, but nobody else could have arranged for Oswald to have been on his own and unobserved - as he undoubtedly was - when the shots were heard. And that would have been essential to any plan to set him up as a lone assassin. It would have been down to sheer bloody luck that he chose to do a disappearing act when the shots were being fired.

What's even worse, is that the actual gunman/men, and any other conspirators not in a position to observe Oswald at the time, could have had no idea if the plan stood any chance of working until it could be established after the event that their 'patsy' had played his unwitting part to perfection and made himself scarce at the critical moment.

All that planning would have been useless if their chosen 'patsy' was having a conversation with two or three fellow workers over lunch, when they were rudely interrupted by the crack of gunfire. But the conspirators wouldn't have known until it was too late for any plan B. Silencing Oswald's lunch companions, once they had identified themselves and provided his rock solid alibi, would hardly have been a piece of cake.

Love,

Caz
X

[PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR 1]

So the guy who did murder Tippit was short and stocky, with bushy, curly and wavy, black and dark hair, and was wearing a white sport coat and darkish-brown jacket, and he was about 30 but no more than 20.

He must have got away because there was nothing unusual about him.

I don't understand your response, except that I sense it must be sarcastic.

Would you please answer my point directly?

I made the point that seven - a majority - of the witnesses cited by the police to the shooting, or aftermath of the shooting, of Tippit gave descriptions of the murderer which cannot be descriptions of Oswald.

That is, I suggest, a damning fact.

Do you dispute it?

[PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR 1]

I have read the comments posted today.

I noted last night that there were 143 visitors to the website at one moment, with only one member logged in (and it was not I!).

They may have noticed some of the words used here about people who do not accept the Warren Commission findings and Single Bullet Theory.

One of them is the word hypocrisy.

I and others have been accused of cherry-picking evidence, i.e. we choose which evidence we like and disregard what we do not like.

I would say that is unfair, because in most cases, and certainly in the most important ones, the evidence is not really evidence.

I would draw readers' attention to the following examples of supporters of the Warren Commission Report and Single Bullet Theory doing exactly what they complain about.

Jesse Curry stated categorically that he never could have proven that Oswald was standing behind the Sniper's Nest on the sixth floor with a rifle in his hand as the motorcade passed by.

Posters here claim it is proven that Oswald did stand there at that time with a rifle in his hand and one has actually called Curry a moron.

Dr Humes, during the postmortem, calculated the angle of entry of the bullet that entered Kennedy's back as 45-60 degrees.

Posters here claim that he didn't know what he was doing or was just guessing or was somehow incapable of estimating the angle correctly and that he was out by as much as 43 degrees.

I suppose Humes was another moron.

Secret Service Agent Clint Hill testified that Kennedy's back wound was about six inches below the neckline and that the right side of the back of his head was blown away and lying on the back seat of the vehicle.

I cannot remember what adjectives were used to discredit Hill, but posters made it plain that he was not, in their views, a credible witness.

FBI agents Sibert and O'Neill wrote reports with diagrams, showing the back wound at a much lower level than the throat wound, concluding that the two wounds could not have been caused by the same bullet.

I cannot recall what adjectives were used by posters to discredit these two FBI agents, but I remember that I was called adjectives suggesting I was something tantamount to an idiot or ignorant or something of that nature and that my argument was not worthy of a reply.

For the purpose of getting the two wounds to line up and thereby sustain the Single Bullet Theory, Kennedy was turned into a momentary hunchback, whose back wound miraculously rose by five to six inches (actually more than that if the angle of entry was as stated by Humes and not the 17 or 18 degrees being claimed).

A witness by the name of Burroughs, who said he sold popcorn to Oswald at about the time that Tippit is known to have been shot, was not - pointed out one of my adversaries - assistant manager in the movie theater but in a much lower position and obviously not qualified to remember whom he was selling popcorn to or when.

All the television and radio reports that the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository was a Mauser, and all the statements made by policemen that it was indeed a Mauser, are all dismissed as wrong.

Roger Craig is dismissed as a liar and fantasist.

Weitzman and Boone, who signed affidavits stating that the rifle was a Mauser, are dismissed as unreliable, mistaken, or unknowledgeable.

I just read now on Quora a comment that neither of them knew their rifles, even though Weitzman owned a shop selling guns and rifles.

Three witnesses in Mexico City who described the man who claimed to be Oswald as having blond hair prove that Oswald was impersonated there.

Our foremost and most vocal advocate of the case against Oswald, who claims that the Mexico witnesses' statements prove Oswald's guilt, stated simply, They were wrong.

I have cited eight witnesses who stated that there was a double shot at the end of the sequence, and six of them testified to the Warren Commission, and three of them were Secret Service Agents.

Their evidence proves that there was a conspiracy because there must have been more than one assassin.

As far as I can remember, such evidence is never addressed by my opponents.

This is what sceptics are up against: a totally contrived reading of the evidence.

Like Earl Warren, his supporters disregard any inconvenient evidence whenever it suits them.

[Aethelwulf]

I have read the comments posted today.

Dr Humes, during the postmortem, calculated the angle of entry of the bullet that entered Kennedy's back as 45-60 degrees.

Posters here claim that he didn't know what he was doing or was just guessing or was somehow incapable of estimating the angle correctly and that he was out by as much as 43 degrees.

As you can see from the oblique aerial photograph, there is nowhere JFK could have been shot from, from behind that would give an angle so steep. Oswald was the closest and at height had the steepest angle, which was only 17 degrees. As a rough estimate, Oswald shot JFK from the 6th floor = 17 degrees, so with JFK fixed at the first shot site, each floor of the TSBD equates roughly to 2.8 degrees (17/6). So, roughly, for 45 to 60 degrees a shooter would need to be equivalent to an imaginary floor 16 to 21, so 2.7 to 3.5 times the elevation of the 6th floor. Where is that building?

Also, we know these bullets can pass undamaged through three feet of pine. A shot would not terminate after a couple on inches.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I have read the comments posted today.

I was just about to make a post by]ut I’ll waste a couple of minutes dismissing this nonsense.

I noted last night that there were 143 visitors to the website at one moment, with only one member logged in (and it was not I!).

They may have noticed some of the words used here about people who do not accept the Warren Commission findings and Single Bullet Theory.

One of them is the word hypocrisy.

Perfectly accurate.

I and others have been accused of cherry-picking evidence, i.e. we choose which evidence we like and disregard what we do not like.

You do.

I would say that is unfair, because in most cases, and certainly in the most important ones, the evidence is not really evidence.

I would draw readers' attention to the following examples of supporters of the Warren Commission Report and Single Bullet Theory doing exactly what they complain about.

Jesse Curry stated categorically that he never could have proven that Oswald was standing behind the Sniper's Nest on the sixth floor with a rifle in his hand as the motorcade passed by.

Then he’s an idiot….Provably Oswald’s gun, provably with Oswald’s prints on it, provably with fibres from Oswald’s shirt on it, there was no one else on the 6th floor, the bullets that killed Kennedy were proven to have come from Oswald’s rifle to the exclusion of all other rifles, he lied about the curtain rods, he fled the building, his rifle at the Paine’s was gone….that’s way more than required and there’s much more.

Posters here claim it is proven that Oswald did stand there at that time with a rifle in his hand and one has actually called Curry a moron.

His prints were there, he hadn’t done any work that morning and Howard Brennan saw a man matching Oswald’s description, Oswald told Giverns at 11.55 that he was staying on the 6th floor.

Dr Humes, during the postmortem, calculated the angle of entry of the bullet that entered Kennedy's back as 45-60 degrees.


Posters here claim that he didn't know what he was doing or was just guessing or was somehow incapable of estimating the angle correctly and that he was out by as much as 43 degrees

I suppose Humes was another moron.

He estimated by sticking an inch or two of his finger into the wound. He shouldn’t have bothered. CT’s jump on this non-point. He was human. He was wrong.

Secret Service Agent Clint Hill testified that Kennedy's back wound was about six inches below the neckline and that the right side of the back of his head was blown away and lying on the back seat of the vehicle.

The Zapruder film, mortuary phots and x-rays prove him wrong. Was he a Pathologist on the side? Oh yeah, conspiracy theorists take the opinions of nurses, police officers and bystanders over the actual experts.

I cannot remember what adjectives were used to discredit Hill, but posters made it plain that he was not, in their views, a credible witness.

FBI agents Sibert and O'Neill wrote reports with diagrams, showing the back wound at a much lower level than the throat wound, concluding that the two wounds could not have been caused by the same bullet.

I cannot recall what adjectives were used by posters to discredit these two FBI agents, but I remember that I was called adjectives suggesting I was something tantamount to an idiot or ignorant or something of that nature and that my argument was not worthy of a reply.

Could you please post their qualifications as Pathologists please. Many thanks.

For the purpose of getting the two wounds to line up and thereby sustain the Single Bullet Theory, Kennedy was turned into a momentary hunchback, whose back wound miraculously rose by five to six inches (actually more than that if the angle of entry was as stated by Humes and not the 17 or 18 degrees being claimed).

Or….that he wore a brace and clothes ride up…..as seen in the Zapruder film.

A witness by the name of Burroughs, who said he sold popcorn to Oswald at about the time that Tippit is known to have been shot, was not - pointed out one of my adversaries - assistant manager in the movie theater but in a much lower position and obviously not qualified to remember whom he was selling popcorn to or when.

And he agreed concurred 100% with the testimony of Brewer and Postal. Read the evidence and not the words of conspiracy theorists.

All the television and radio reports that the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository was a Mauser, and all the statements made by policemen that it was indeed a Mauser, are all dismissed as wrong.

They clearly were wrong. The police themselves explained the error.

Roger Craig is dismissed as a liar and fantasist.

According to conspiracy theorist Royalty Harold Weisberg and Mary Ferrell he was.

Weitzman and Boone, who signed affidavits stating that the rifle was a Mauser, are dismissed as unreliable, mistaken, or unknowledgeable.

Mistaken.

I just read now on Quora a comment that neither of them knew their rifles, even though Weitzman owned a shop selling guns and rifles.

Three witnesses in Mexico City who described the man who claimed to be Oswald as having blond hair prove that Oswald was impersonated there.

Or someone was mistaken for him. Oswald was categorically in Mexico City. The evidence is overwhelming. He said so himself…as did his wife. Grow up.

Our foremost and most vocal advocate of the case against Oswald, who claims that the Mexico witnesses' statements prove Oswald's guilt, stated simply, They were wrong.

Yup. Why is that witnesses you don’t like are ‘wrong’ but none of the witnesses that you like are ever wrong?

I have cited eight witnesses who stated that there was a double shot at the end of the sequence, and six of them testified to the Warren Commission, and three of them were Secret Service Agents.

Meaningless.

Their evidence proves that there was a conspiracy because there must have been more than one assassin.

Rubbish. A conspiracy has been disproven. You are incapable of assessing evidence. You cherrypick the bits you like.

As far as I can remember, such evidence is never addressed by my opponents.

Assessed, addressed and dismissed.

This is what sceptics are up against: a totally contrived reading of the evidence.

Like Earl Warren, his supporters disregard any inconvenient evidence whenever it suits them.

The irony!

Time wasting nonsense. Typical of a conspiracy fantasist.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I don't understand your response, except that I sense it must be sarcastic.

Would you please answer my point directly?

I made the point that seven - a majority - of the witnesses cited by the police to the shooting, or aftermath of the shooting, of Tippit gave descriptions of the murderer which cannot be descriptions of Oswald.

That is, I suggest, a damning fact.

Do you dispute it?

I’ll see if I can find time over the weekend to put this nonsense to bed.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Lee Bowers: I heard three shots. One, then a slight pause, then two very close together.

Bowers also reported seeing two men standing near the picket fence on the grassy knoll. He added: "These men were the only two strangers in the area. The others were workers whom I knew." Bowers said the two men were there while the shots were fired.

Strange that he didn't see the Pullman Dining car behind the picket fence.

https://spartacus-educational.com/JFKbowers.htm

George appears to have a bee in his bonnet about Carl Desroe. Just a reminder….

Jim Towner, a former military man immediately recognized what his wife described as ‘firecrackers’ as gunshots. He heard three shots which he thought came from the Book Depository. He followed a crowd of spectators to the picket fence and spoke to a black man wearing a white uniform standing on the back of a Pullman dining car. It was Carl Desroe. Desroe responded to questions from the crowd asking if he had observed anyone in the vicinity. “No sir” Desroe said, “I haven’t seen anybody back here and I’ve been back here watching the whole thing.”

I have no information on Towner but he mentions speaking to Carl Desroe. George’s point was to ask how there could have been a Pullman car on a car park? Nothing wrong with asking that. My suggestion was that Towner could have gone over to the railway lines to the left of the car park. Or it could have been that Desroe was standing on the Pullman car and then came over to Desroe. I don’t know the answer but would Towner invent a Pullman Car and place it on a car park? It seems unlikely to say the least doesn’t it?

George, then found some information about him in a book quote in post #599. The quote mentions that Desroe came to light after talking to his pastor years later which of course is always a slight cause for concern (although never to conspiracy theorist who love quoting witnesses who suddenly remember seeing things years later that they never mentioned at the time) No information in that quote discredited Desroe and Towner did mention seeing him. Desroe said that he’d been on the overpass but had been moved on by officers and we know from SM Holland that there were indeed officers up there checking that everyone was authorised to be there (also giving the lie to the CT’s claim that security was lacking unless the police only wanted Kennedy shot by their own man and not some random stranger?)

Deputy Sheriff Eugene Boone also said that he saw a black guy working the Pullmans. So unless it can be shown that Desroe was in fact white we have 2 people who saw a Pullman guard somewhere behind the picket fence at the time of the assassination who saw nothing. If evidence can be found to discredit Desroe as a witness, and I’ve seen nothing as yet, then this neglected witness remains an intriguing one. He wasn’t called by the Warren Commission but I don’t know why not?

…..


George then mentions Lee Bowers. It’s often noted how quickly people arguing on the internet bring up Hitler and Nazi Germany it’s the same here. I’ve been waiting for someone to drag up Lee Bowers and St. George has obliged. In case anyone doesn’t know, Bowers was working in the railway tower at the far side of the car park behind the fence.

George points out his claim to have seen ‘something’ going on near the picket fence at the time of the assassination mentioned in his WC testimony. Sadly though Bowers mentions nothing of this in his police statement on the day of the assassination. Only that the area became crowded after the shots.

https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth337486/

In his WC testimony he said that he’d seen a car driving around which left 8 or 10 minutes before the shots and that the driver:”…seemed to have a Mike or telephone or something that gave the appearance of that at least.”

Asked about the gunshots, Bowers said:” The sounds came either from up against the School Depository Building or near the mouth of the triple underpass.”

So not from the picket fence directly in front of him. He was then asked:


Ball: Did you see any activity in this high ground above Elm after the shot?

Bowers: At the time of the shooting there seemed to be some commotion, and immediately following there was a motorcycle policeman who shot nearly all of the way to the top of the incline.

Bowers could describe what he meant by a commotion. He said that earlier he’d seen 2 men in that area. He was then asked:

Ball: Were the two men there at that time?

Bowers: I - as far as I know, one of them was. The other I could not say. The darker dressed man was too hard to distinguish from the trees. The one in the one in the white shirt, yes; I think he was.

He actually knew one of the men.

So he saw two men, still there after the shots, that no one else saw despite the area being flooded with police and the public. He also saw no one escaping. Deputy Sheriff Eugene Boone called up to him and asked him if he’d seen anyone and he said no. Boone also checked the soil behind the fence and saw no prints. The Grassy Knoll gunman clearly hovered.


Then, miracle of miracles, on March 31st, 1966, after talking to conspiracy theorist looney Mark Lane he suddenly remembers seeing a flash of light or smoke. Yeah right.

[Herlock Sholmes]

CLASSIC ALERT!


According to our friends the conspiracy clan the picket fence area on the Grassy Knoll was the ideal spot for an assassins.



”But it was in front of a car park,” I said.

”Not a problem,” they say.


But it gets better….much, much better.


SM Holland interviews by the Warren Commission about that very car park:



Counsel: A parking area for the School Book Depository?


SM Holland: No. It’s a parking area for the Sheriff’s department and people over at the courthouse.


Counsel: I see.


Holland: Sheriff’s department parks in there. District Attorney’s cars park in there.


Lee Bowers said that the area between his tower and the fence: “had been covered by police for some 2 hours.” So way before the motorcade. And that:” Since approximately 10 o’clock in the morning traffic had been cut off into that area so that anyone moving around could actually be observed.”


So to sum up……we don’t just have our conspirators choosing a spot with spectators just feet away many of them with cameras and movie cameras, they choose a spot directly in front of a car park used by the the Sheriff’s office, the Courthouse and the District Attorneys!!!! And a car park that was closed off and patrolled by the police since 10 o’clock that morning.

THERE ISN'T A CONSPIRATOR ON THE PLANET OUTSIDE OF A PADDED CELL WHO WOULD HAVE PLACED A GUNMAN BEHIND THAT FENCE!

R.IP Grassy Knoll gunman

[cobalt]

No, cobalt, but nobody else could have arranged for Oswald to have been on his own and unobserved - as he undoubtedly was - when the shots were heard. And that would have been essential to any plan to set him up as a lone assassin. It would have been down to sheer bloody luck that he chose to do a disappearing act when the shots were being fired.

Hi Caz,

I see your logic there. But the problem remains that we don't know where Oswald claimed to be at the time of the shooting. He must obviously have been asked this at some point during his 12 hours of questioning yet all I have seen are the sketchy notes of Captain Will Fritz which were redrafted some time after Oswald was killed. The 'out front with Bill Shelly' may refer to that but it seems that Fritz's notes are not always in the chronological order of events. After his arrest I doubt that either the DPD or his co-workers were much interested in seeing if Oswald could establish an alibi. Maybe you are right and Oswald had no confirmed alibi for the time but I have explained why I think he had a decent alibi for 12.23 which gave him little time to act.

Even if Oswald had been photographed next to Bill Lovelady in the Altgens photo (some claim that he was) the conspiracy that I think took place could still have been successful. Oswald's role would have been reduced to that of an accomplice who provided the weapon and prepared the sniper's nest. Since nobody saw Oswald fire the shots ( although some are confident Brennan as good as did) then the narrative works just as well.