JFK Assassination Documents to be released this year

[Patrick Differ]

Take a trip there Fiver and then tell us it's a poor kill zone.
High Buildings with open windows on 2 sides alone made it so.
I guess if CBS proves something it must be true.

[Herlock Sholmes]

There then follows a list of strawmen, ripe for burning.

It has been pointed out on numerous occasions that the lone gunman theory is a figment of the WC imagination and no more. The assassins in Dealey Plaza set out to kill the POTUS and they succeeded. Why on earth would they care about photographs of the Grassy Knoll or direction of bullets? All they needed was a link to Cuba (Oswald) and a rifle on the 6th floor.

Johnson partly scuppered their plans by steering the lone gunman theory which, in its WC form, depoliticised the crime.

You can’t possibly believe that Cobalt.

You expect everyone to believe that these conspirators took a kind of “hey-Ho, if we get caught out we get caught out who cares” approach then it’s impossible to respond to. Anything can mean anything.

There was no conspiracy. It’s too childish for words.

One disaffected man took his own gun and shot Kennedy. His name was Oswald. He was arrested. The evidence made him the guiltiest criminal in the history of crime. Ruby shot him. Who cares. He murdered Kennedy’s and Tippit. Oswald was a lowlife traitor who deserved the electric chair.

[Herlock Sholmes]

No one needed a ‘kill zone.’ If someone wanted the President dead all they needed to do was to find a good enough marksman and provide him with the best available weapon ( surely not difficult for conspirators that had influence in the CIA, the FBI, the Secret Service, the Military, the police and the medical profession) There is no law that says that assassinations can only occur in Dallas as far as I’m aware so they had their choice of locations and buildings (not difficult for these kind of conspirators that can manage the odd government overthrow or two)

Man in room, car waiting out back, bang, leave building and get into care.

Simples. That they would have instead elected to have gone for an insanely risky, nightmarishly complicated, reliant on luck plan which required more actions post-assassination than were required in the planning of the D-Day landings just can’t be taken seriously. The moon isn’t a spaceship, the Royal Family aren’t shape-shifting aliens and the world isn’t run by mice.

[Fiver]

The answer became obvious in a classic Crossfire arrangement in Daltek, Book Depository and Grassy Knoll. Or at least it became an obvious point of any conspiracy theory of who. Who benefited? That answer became obvious- LBJ, Hoover, CIA, MOB and the Companies who feed the Military Industrial Complex.

Most of those organizations would benefit by betraying the others and most would gain nothing from JFK's death. The Conspiracy also requires the Dallas Police, JFK's personal physician, the US Navy, and dozens of politicians, lawyers, forensics experts, and random civilians who weren't part of any of those organizations. The Conspiracy you describe is too big to succeed.

Setting up a crossfire is great if you want to ensure the target is dead and don't care if everyone knows it was a Conspiracy. Using multiple gunmen is incredibly stupid if you want to frame an individual. You have to keep all the added gunmen from being heard, spotted, or filmed as well as extracting the gunmen, the rifles, and all of the ejected shells. You have to fake eyewitness testimony, photographic evidence, handwriting evidence, fiber evidence, and fingerprint evidence well enough that they will fool techniques that hadn't been invented yet. You have to pray that no extra bullets are found and that all bullets that miss do not hit anyone outside the limo.

Or you could have one skilled gunman with a better rifle.

[Patrick Differ]

I don't believe any of the Doctors at Parkland or Bethesda would disagree that Kennedy suffered a massive head wound.
The Parkland Doctors only had the body for 20 minutes surrounded by chaos. Until a fight broke out over control of the body. I cant imagine that they didnt know he was DOA.

Humes had the body for less than 3 hours and his Autopsy is considered Incomplete by the HCSA. He said he was pressured. Unfortunately he decided not to trace the bullet from the back to the neck. This led to the Single Bullet theory but not necessarily on evidence since Humes failed to complete the step. That is just a fact.

Unfortunately the Parkland Doctors thought the neck wound was an entrance room and they described it as a 1/4 inch round hole. They did not describe it any other way.

This is where angles and geometry and physics matter. It is also where advances in technology matter if there is a desire to explore what Humes did not. The actual path of the bullets. Humes, in fact, was unhappy when he learned the sketches created for his testimony were not based on Autopsy xrays. The sketch artist did not have access.

The first issue with the Single Bullet, the result of Humes not taking the step, is alignment in the car between Kennedy and Connally. They are in line across the horizontal plane of the car door. However, the 6th floor is 6 stories up on the vertical and another 60 feet on the horizontal from the edge of the Book Depository. So the shooter is pointing down on the target and to the left at an acute angle with the car travelling 11 mph.

The bullet strikes Kennedy in the back below and to the right of the exit wound. According to Humes sketches. The bullet is in alignment anatomically how? The entrance wound is offset by at least 2 inches to the right of the exit and then exits as a round hole.?

The bullet then manages to hit Connallys under his right armpit. With Connally sitting directly in front of Kennedy on a horizontal plane? If the bullet exited Kennedy out the throat continuing downward it would hit Connally in the back. Connally would need to be 10 inches to Kennedys left to make this work! The sketches Humes used in his testimony were not based on evidence. Even if Kennedy were aligned perfectly along a vertical plane with the 6th floor, the Connally armpit does not work because the Zapruder film proves the alignment.

So the public is asked to believe in Single bullet perfect alignment theory when there was no perfect alignment whatsoever.

The problem I have with the head shot is basic physics and the debis field. The film I sight was the one Geraldo Rivera showed to the public for the first time in 1975. That was 12 years later.
Their reaction was the same as everyone else the first time and without any other knowledge you see a head explode in the front and snapped back and to the left. The film shows no explosion or spark in the back of the head eventhoughit hits bone, but there is a hole in the back. In this case though it fragments into pieces as large as 1/4 inch. Geraldo and Godfrey Cambridge see and say the same thing - the neck and head shots are entrance wounds.

The head shot can be explained by Newton which is also satisfied by the path of the debris field, up and to the left and back. At least that is what the Zapruder film shows in the frames 313 and several more.

However the WC, based on sketches not based on evidence which Humes admits.

Was the head shot basic physics or was it something else? Neck muscles, brain compression, goat experiments?

I would like to see the rebuttal of the science portion with alignments and physics and not subjective WC testimony They were incomplete.

[Herlock Sholmes]

The HSCA confirmed the autopsy results. They only went with a ‘conspiracy’ verdict due to the dodgy dictabelt recording. Now we know that those sound recordings are nonsense the HSCA would have undoubtedly gone for a Lone Gunman.

The opinions of the Parklands doctors on wounds are entirely irrelevant. The opinions that count are the pathologists. That’s how it works.

The single bullet is a fact not a theory. Conspiracy theorists have a vanishing bullet which they can’t explain.

17 pathologists confirmed all shots from the rear. Why are people still arguing? They are wrong. There should be no discussion. Humes, Boswell, Finck…shots from behind…confirmed by photographs…confirmed by x-rays…confirmed by the Zapruder film. I think that any author that writes about conspiracy should be sued for Libel or defamation of character. It’s time this vindictive campaign of lies ended. The world has humoured conspiracy authors for far too long. Groden, Lane, Garrison, Livingston, Stone. All complete charlatans. Roger Craig, Beverly Oliver, Ed Hoffman, Gordon Turner, Roger Craig all liars. Not mistaken…liars.

How anyone can take a pro-conspiracy standpoint utterly beggars belief.

[Fiver]

The other angle would be from a perch on the 6th floor to Kennedys head and back/throat exit to Connally for a total of 7 entrances and 7 exits, including bone but somehow comes out pristine. Unlike the same jacketed bullet that hits the head that fragments into pieces no larger than a quarter of an inch and most 1 or 2 millimeters in size.

Where do you get 7 entrances and 7 exits? The Single Bullet inflicted 4 wounds - JFK's neck, Connally's chest, Connally's wrist, and Connaly's thigh. It's not pristine, either, and neutron scanning done years later matched the stretcher billet to the fragments found in Connally's wrist.

As to why the bullet to the head shattered, lets look at the testimony of a Parkland Doctor.

As to Mr. SPECTER - What definition of "tangential" did you make at that time?
Dr. CLARK - As I remember, I defined the word "tangential" as being---striking an object obliquely, not squarely or head on.
Mr. SPECTER - Will you describe at this time in somewhat greater detail the consequences of a tangential wound as contrasted with another type of a striking?
Dr. CLARK - Let me begin by saying that the damage suffered by an organ when struck by a bullet or other missile---
Mr. SPECTER - May the record show that I interrupted the deposition for about 2 minutes to ascertain what our afternoon schedule would be here because the regular administration office ordinarily closes at 12 o'clock, which was just about 15 minutes ago, and then we resumed the deposition of Dr. Clark as he was discussing the concept of tangential and other types of striking. Go ahead, Doctor.
Dr. CLARK - The effects of any missile striking an organ or a function of the energy which is shed by the missile in passing through this organ when a bullet strikes the head, if it is able to pass through rapidly without shedding any energy into the brain, little damage results, other than that part of the brain which is directly penetrated by the missile. However, if it strikes the skull at an angle, it must then penetrate much more bone than normal, therefore, is likely to shed more energy, striking the brain a more powerful blow. Secondly, in striking the bone in this manner, it may cause pieces of the bone to be blown into the brain and thus act as secondary missiles. Finally, the bullet itself may be deformed and deflected so that it would go through or penetrate parts of the brain, not in the usual direct line it was proceeding.
Mr. SPECTER - Now, referring back to the press conference, did you define a tangential wound at that time?
Dr. CLARK - Yes.

As to the stretcher bullet, it would have passed through the soft tissue of JFK's neck. Testing has shown this would result in a slowed down, tumbling bullet, which if was at the correct angle when it struck Connally, would act and appear in a manner similar to the stretcher bullet.

[Patrick Differ]

The 7 entrances and exits include the clothing as a layer. I guess you can discount the clothing but it is still considered a layer of resistance and that's how it I'd described.

Geometry, Angles, Physics ??

[FISHY1118]

The single bullet is a theory not a fact .


A very poor one at that .

[FISHY1118]

And Alex Jones believed that the Sandy Hook massacre was a conspiracy. Do you believe that he was right just because he said it and some people agreed with it.

Just providing the evidence that proves the ''fake autopy'' photos , the Warren Commission lies , cover ups and conspiracy. .You do what you like .

[FISHY1118]

Perhaps Fishy can give us an approximated time of when he will have finished posting the entire content of Gil Jesus’ website onto this thread and we can all just come back when he’s done? With other posters of both sides trying to actually discuss the case, you know…using our own thoughts, we are perhaps in danger of slowing down Fishy’s important project. When he’s finished perhaps I’ll begin cut and pasting Vince Bugliosi’s book? At 1600 pages though I’m unsure how long it will take…a couple of years at least. Then perhaps I’ll go over and clog up one of the ripper threads by cutting and pasting the entire Sourcebook or Sugden. Perhaps we can start a new thread ‘cut and pasting’ corner?

Someone makes a point or asks a question and someone replies with a direct answer (if it was in response to a question) or they give their own thoughts (if it was in response to a point)

Is this too much to expect?

Its called ''Evidence'' Herlock , remember ''you asked'' for Actual Evidence .. you got it [and will continue to get ] .I cant help it if makes a mockery of your theory of the lone gunman . Your problem, not mind .

For god sake why would you ever want to post anything from that phoney bugliosi ? i,ve shown you he was a fraud but you ignored it as usual. your problem again , not mind.

ACTUAL EVIDENCE .

[Herlock Sholmes]

Just providing the evidence that proves the ''fake autopy'' photos , the Warren Commission lies , cover ups and conspiracy. .You do what you like .

There is no evidence a ‘fake autopsy.’ You are simply shouting ‘fake’ at everything. And of course you asked questions which I have answered but I’ve asked questions which you ignore. A very familiar situation. I’ll ask again…

Why do you state the Parkland doctors as evidence of a ‘fake’ autopsy and accuse me, wrongly, of calling them liars, but you ignore those doctors that saw a wound at the side of Kennedy’s head and not the back? Why do you favour one group. If it’s because there is a majority my follow-up question is ‘why do you not follow the majority that thought the shots came from the direction of the TSBS? Why don’t you follow the majority who thought that there were only three shots? Why don’t you follow the majority that say that the President’s brain was present?

Conspiracy theorists work backwards. The rest of us work logically. A few people in Dealey Plaza gave an opinion on a split second, highly traumatic incident when there were more concerned with avoiding being shot and some of the Parkland doctors gave an opinion on a part of the Presidents body that couldn’t be seen, and in a highly traumatic situation where their focus was entirely on the throat and chest.

Against this we have the people in Dealey Plaza who disagreed with your witnesses, Parkland doctors who disagreed with your Parkland doctors (plus one of the two senior doctors [working at Kennedy’s head] who ‘absolutely’ accepted that they could have been wrong) along with 17 pathologists, autopsy photos independently checked by numerous experts with no evidence of fakery, x-rays independently checked by numerous experts with no evidence of fakers, the Zapruder film independently checked by numerous by numerous experts with no evidence of tampering. Simply shouting ‘fake’ at everything is playground stuff.

What are the chances of any reply (never mind a valid one) to the above? I won’t hold my breath.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Head Games : The deliberate and fraudulent coverup of President Kennedy's head wound --- Part II


ACTUAL EVIDENCE . OF THE FAKERY OF THE AUTOPSY PHOTOS , WOW ALL THESE PEOPLE WERE LIARS , IDIOTS , MISTAKEN , OR NEVER EXISTED ACCORDING TO THE LONE GUNMAN GANG .


The morgue witnesses

Several witnesses who were present at Bethesda and saw the President's head wound described it as a massive wound to the right rear of the skull.

Chester Boyers was a Chief Petty Officer in charge of the Pathology Department at Bethesda. He told the HSCA in 1978 that "there was a large wound to the right side and towards the rear of the head". ( ARRB MD 62 )

Boyers was never called by the Warren Commission.

One of the autopsists, Dr. J. Thornton Boswell, told the HSCA that "the wound was fairly low in the back of the head and that the bone was completely gone above the entry wound." ( ARRB MD 26 )

Dr. Boswell's Warren Commission testimony covered just a single page ( 2 H 377 ) and he was never asked to describe the wounds he saw.

Tom Robinson was the mortician whose job it was to prepare the body for burial. He was present during the examination of it. He told the HSCA that it was at "the base of the head, where most of the damage was done." Robinson described the wound in the back of the head as "ragged", about three inches in diameter and circular.

Tom Robinson was never called before the Warren Commission.

Floyd Riebe was a photographer who took pictures at the autopsy. He told the ARRB in 1997 that, "the right side in the back was gone. Just a big gaping hole with fragments of scalp and bone hanging in it." ( ARRB interview of Floyd Riebe, 5/7/97 )

Floyd Riebe was never called before the Warren Commission.

FBI agent Frank O'Neill told the ARRB that there was a "massive wound" in the rear of the head and there was bone missing. He stated that a portion of the skull was taken into the autopsy room as the autopsy progressed and that this piece was "found on the car floor in Dallas by one of the Secret Service agents." ( ARRB interview of Frank O'Neill, 9/12/97 )

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/FBI-man-saw-Massive-wound-in-right-rear-of-JFK-skull.mp4

O'Neill's recollection of a piece of skull recovered from the back of the limousine corroborates Secret Service agent Clint Hill's description of a piece of Kennedy's skull lying on the rear seat. ( 2 H 141 )

Frank O'Neill was never called before the Warren Commission.

Secret Service agent Roy Kellerman, who rode in the front seat of the limo, saw Kennedy's head wound at Bethesda. He estimated the diameter at about 5 inches, located at the rear portion of the right side of the head. He said that it was "to the left of the ear and a little high" and testified that that part of the skull was "removed", clarifying that by "removed" that it was "absent when I saw him." ( 2 H 80-81 )

Jerrol Custer was the X-ray technician who took the x-rays of the President's body. He described the head wound as a "king sized hole...I could put my hands together and place my hands in the skull". ( ARRB interview of Jerrol Custer, 10/28/97 )

Jerrol Custer was never called before the Warren Commission.

In this essay, I've been able to document 19 witnesses who have claimed to have seen an enormous wound at the rear of the President's skull consistent with a wound of exit.

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/BE4_HI.jpg

But the autopsy photo of the back of the head shows no such massive wound and there may have been a reason for that.


The autopsy photos: evidence of fakery


Witnesses claimed to have seen two different sets of autopsy photos after the autopsy. In one set, it is reported that there was an entry wound in the front of the head at the hairline and a massive exit wound at the rear. In the other, a small neat wound in the rear of the head and a blasted out "flap" on the right side.

The Warren Commission never published the autopsy photos. Instead, they published drawings to illlustrate the path of the bullet and its effects. For this they called on medical illustrator named Harold Rydberg, Head of Bethesda's Medical Illustration Department.

In March 1964, Rydberg had a meeting with Captain John Stover, the Commanding Officer of the Navy Medical School. Stover explained that Drs. Humes and Boswell were about to testify before the Warren Commission. Rydberg was ordered to prepare medical illustrations of the wounds sustained by John F. Kennedy. When he asked Humes why they were not using the photographs taken at the autopsy, he was told they were considered to be "too shocking" and had been sealed by the Federal Bureau of Investigation and were therefore not available for testimony.

Over the weekend of 14th/15th March 1964, Rydberg worked in a small office at Bethesda with Humes and Boswell. Rydberg was not allowed to take in any photographs of John F. Kennedy.

Boswell told him: "that they had no photographs, no X-rays, that I was going to have to do this one verbally... We'll tell you what to draw."

https://spartacus-educational.com/JFKrydbergH.htm

By March, 1964 they DID have the photographs and x-rays for reference so the only reason for not using them was because the autopsists sought to control what the drawings depicted.

Having confidence that the autopsy photos would never be seen by the public, the autopsists then had free reign to depict the wounds however they wanted.

Commission exhibits 385, 386 and 388 are the drawings Rydberg did according to the "memories" of Humes and Boswell.

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/rydberg-drawings.jpg

The drawings, however, do not match the autopsy photos. They show a bullet wound at the base of the neck above the top of the shoulders. The autopsy photo of the back shows a bullet hole below the top of the shoulders.

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/BE5_HI2.jpg

On this basis alone, the value of the Rydberg drawings as evidence is questionable, at best. At worse, they're a deliberate attempt to hide evidence that JFK was shot from the front and that Oswald was not involved in the killing.

The House Select Committee on Assassinations in the 1970s gave us a number of witnesses who had not been called by the Warren Commission.

Some were Bethesda witnesses who have come forward to describe what they saw in the morgue that night. When shown the official autopsy photos, they claimed that the photos did not depict the wound they saw.

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/photos-faked.mp4

Mortician Tom Robinson told the HSCA that there was a wound in the right temple at the hairline, measuring about a quarter of an inch. ( ARRB MD 63, pgs. 2-3 )

Note: this is about the same size hole ( about a quarter of an inch ) described by Dr. Ronald Jones with regard to the throat wound ( 6 H 54 ).

Corroboration for Robinson's observation of an entry wound in the front of the head comes from autopsy attendee James Curtis Jenkins, interviewed by Patrick Bet David:

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/james-curtis-jenkins.mp4

Further corroboration comes from Dennis David, who claimed that a few days after the assassination he saw slides from a video of the autopsy filmed by William Bruce Pitzer that showed an entrance wound in the front of the head and a massive exit wound at the rear.

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/dennis-david.mp4

In addition to this evidence, White House Photographer Joe O'Donnell told the ARRB in 1997 that he saw two sets of photographs in the possession of Robert Knudsen, a Chief photographer for the Navy who was assigned to the White House. ( ARRB MD 231 )

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/joe-odonnell.mp4

More evidence of a wound in the front of the skull comes from an autopsy photo of the back of the skull, showing a massive wound in the right rear and a smaller hole in the front of the head:

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/BE7_HI1.jpg

Evidence of the coverup of that entrance wound in the front of the head comes in the form of one of the autopsy photos, where a black square was added to the photo:

https://gil-jesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/BE3_HI1_2.jpg

Faced with all of this evidence, that at least two shots ( one to the throat and one to the head ) of the same diameter were fired from in front of the President, the House Select Committee simply buried it.


"There is no medical evidence that President Kennedy was hit from the front and to the right".--G. Robert Blakey, Chief Counsel, HSCA.

Thanks for that Gil, and welcome to Casebook

[Herlock Sholmes]

Its called ''Evidence'' Herlock , remember ''you asked'' for Actual Evidence .. you got it [and will continue to get ] .I cant help it if makes a mockery of your theory of the lone gunman . Your problem, not mind .

For god sake why would you ever want to post anything from that phoney bugliosi ? i,ve shown you he was a fraud but you ignored it as usual. your problem again , not mind.

ACTUAL EVIDENCE .

You haven’t produced evidence. You have cut and pasted the opinion of Gil Jesus who is a conspiracy theorist. His opinions are of no importance for obvious reasons.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Just some of the closest witnesses stating where Kennedy’s was hit.