Probibility of Martha Tabram Being a JtR Victim

[Abby Normal]

4 possibilities spring to mind, Curious

Strangled unconscious
Knocked out cold on the head
Hand over the mouth
She did scream

Hi Jon/all
since there was evidence of strangulation-id go with option one.

[Michael W Richards]

A question I raised very early in this thread is that of the question of 2 weapons. I believe that Ive read that multiple stab wounds with more than one weapon is often result of the failure of the first weapon used and another weapon being chosen based on ready availability, not because the attacker had 2 weapons from the start.

Unless we have some wound that reflects that the smaller pen knife broke during the attack, the likelihood that the same offender used another weapon that was not available at the scene is lessened.

We also have evidence that a soldier questioned near the site of the attack said he was waiting for a buddy who went off with a girl, so it seems soldiers were travelling in pairs that night. Which is a reasonable explanation for 2 weapons being readily available at the scene.

[Jon Guy]

It was east of Cannon Street Road, next to Star Street.

Is that close to Star Place, where Tabram once lived, Gary ?

[Jon Guy]

Since the 38 stabs were first, I don't understand why Martha wasn't screaming her head off, do you?

curious

4 possibilities spring to mind, Curious

Strangled unconscious
Knocked out cold on the head
Hand over the mouth
She did scream

[Joshua Rogan]

Since the 38 stabs were first, I don't understand why Martha wasn't screaming her head off, do you?

And since many of the stabs were through her lungs, she would almost certainly have been spraying a mist of blood, if still breathing (which I don't remember the doctor's report saying anything about). Is this evidence that she was already dead?

[curious]

Since the 38 stabs were first, I don't understand why Martha wasn't screaming her head off, do you?

curious

[Sam Flynn]

Oops. This Tabram thread seems to be turning into a Stride thread. Compared to the Canonicals, Martha doesn't get much air-time, so let's get back to her.

[DJA]

Curious how Kidney wanted to change from Dorset Street,as per his testimony,to Devonshire Street again afterwards.

[Jon Guy]

Is this definitely the one Kidney lived in, or could it be the one off Cambridge Heath Road near Lechmere?

Sven Ollsen, Clerk of the Swedish Church, at the inquest:

[Coroner] Where has she been living lately? - I have nothing to show. Two years ago she gave her address as Devonshire-street, Commercial-road.

[Jon Guy]

http://www.jacktherippermap.info/jtrmap25.php

that`s it, nice one, Dave

[DJA]

http://www.jacktherippermap.info/jtrmap25.php

[Joshua Rogan]

It no longer exists, Josh. It's now covered by Watney Market, just off Commercial Road. The map extract below shows Watney Market/Devonshire St over to the right, with Henriques/Berner St on the left.

Gotcha. Is this definitely the one Kidney lived in, or could it be the one off Cambridge Heath Road near Lechmere?

It's certainly an interesting area, although it must be nearly half a mile from Berner St, which is actually about the same distance from Thrawl St too.
In the immediate vicinity of Devonshire Street can be found, in no particular order; Martha St, Ann St, Upper and Lower Chapman St, Mary St, Jane St....it's easy to see where a local killer might have got his inspiration!

[Jon Guy]

Cheers Jon. Just out of interest, is that the Sidney Street of seige fame do you know?

Yes, that`s the one

[Joshua Rogan]

From Paul Daniel`s dissertation "Streets of Whitechapel"

Devonshire Street:
A small street leading southwards off Commercial Road several hundred yards east of Berner Street, (a little south of the London Hospital, and almost opposite Sidney Street

It`s not there anymore

Cheers Jon. Just out of interest, is that the Sidney Street of seige fame do you know?

[Joshua Rogan]

Hi,

It was east of Cannon Street Road, next to Star Street.

Gary

Thanks Gary, I remember it now, it's got a railway underneath!