Probibility of Martha Tabram Being a JtR Victim

[Harry D]

I'm not convinced by that.

I wonder why

[John Wheat]

There are plenty of reasons though, John, both external and internal to justify that. It might be connected to the gap from the last murder.

I'm not convinced by that.

[Harry D]

Much more likely. The time frame coupled with a serious toning down with no apparent reason rules McKenzie out.

There are plenty of reasons though, John, both external and internal to justify that. It might be connected to the gap from the last murder.

[John Wheat]

Was Tabram less or more likely a Ripper victim than Alice McKenzie?

Much more likely. The time frame coupled with a serious toning down with no apparent reason rules McKenzie out.

[Harry D]

There's enough variation in Tabram's murder with the frenzied stabbing and focus on the upper-torso as opposed to the abdomen/reproductive area, to rule her out. It's exactly the type of occupational hazard for a prostitute who pissed off a punter with a short fuse.

[Sam Flynn]

To think the rippers mature MO sprung fully formed with Nichols beggars belief!

I don't see why not, but if there was an incremental build-up, I don't envisage the preceding step as a 39-stab frenzy overwhelmingly focused on the upper body.

[Sam Flynn]

One man's minutiæ is another one's details

[Abby Normal]

Thirty nine stabs is pretty darned extreme in my book. Imagine taking a knife and repeatedly plunging it into someone's body:

Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump!

Compare and contrast with a cut throat and a few cuts to the abdomen. Oh, and no damage whatsoever to the chest or stomach.

You've still got a touch of HOGS (Holmgren's Over-Generalisation Syndrome), I see

The Devle's in the details.

and I see you still have SOMMS (Sams Over Minutia Minimalist Syndrome)! ; )

[Sam Flynn]

HI Sam
Ive seen you post this sort of thing before and I just don't get it. more extreme?

Thirty nine stabs is pretty darned extreme in my book. Imagine taking a knife and repeatedly plunging it into someone's body:

Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump! Whump!

Compare and contrast with a cut throat and a few cuts to the abdomen. Oh, and no damage whatsoever to the chest or stomach.

Nichols-stabbed, neck targeted/ripped. abdomen/lower parts ripped

You've still got a touch of HOGS (Holmgren's Over-Generalisation Syndrome), I see

The Devle's in the details.

[Abby Normal]

If anything, what happened to Martha Tabram was far, far more extreme than what happened to all the Ripper victims apart from Kelly. It's not so much an escalation as a deceleration, allied to a radical change of technique.

HI Sam
Ive seen you post this sort of thing before and I just don't get it. more extreme? deceleration? no.

Especially if you factor in Millwood who in all likelihood was an early ripper victim.

millwood-stabbed, stabbed in lower parts

tabram-stabbed, stabbed in lower parts, neck targeted

Nichols-stabbed, neck targeted/ripped. abdomen/lower parts ripped


To think the rippers mature MO sprung fully formed with Nichols beggars belief!

[Sam Flynn]

If anything, what happened to Martha Tabram was far, far more extreme than what happened to all the Ripper victims apart from Kelly. It's not so much an escalation as a deceleration, allied to a radical change of technique.

[Abby Normal]

Was Tabram less or more likely a Ripper victim than Alice McKenzie?

the same. they were both killed by the ripper. see raised skirt to expose the abdomen.

and I agree with everyone that Tabram to Nichols is an evolution by the ripper- changing knives, learning what he wants to do and do it more efficiently. Its classic serial killer escalation.

[Harry D]

Was Tabram less or more likely a Ripper victim than Alice McKenzie?

[harry]

What was evident in all the crimes ,was an intent to kill.I am of the opinion that a repeat killer might have had a reason to act differently,perhaps due to circumstances only he was aware of.So I see no reason why Tabram and Nichols couldn't have been killed by the same person.

[MrBarnett]

I’ve always been struck by the similarity between the attack on Tabram and the one reportedly carried out by the blind lace seller near Spitalfields Market on the morning of the Chapman murder.

The victim was felled by a blow and repeatedly stabbed by her assailant, with a particular focus on her neck. This was in broad daylight, and if the crowd hadn’t overpowered the man, there may well have been another corpse in the morgue with contused wounds and multiple stabs.

Interestingly, a few years later Pearly Poll would go on to marry a blind seller of laces, a ‘vicious’ man with at least one conviction for assaulting a young girl. A man who, although blind, was recorded as being a wood carver, and since he was of no fixed abode, presumably carried the tools of his trade around with him.

He was later diagnosed with ‘mania’ (whatever that means) and spent his final years in mental asylums.

If the Spitalfields attacker was the man who became Poll’s husband and who may well have known her in 1888, he would surely be a person of interest.

But whether or no, it seems there was at least one man in the East End who presumably wasn’t the Ripper, but who was temperamentally capable of carrying out a similar attack to that on Tabram.