Liz Stride Re-Enactment

[mariab]

I completely agree with C.D. and Monty here. There are too many possible scenarios, and I believe it's impossible to commit to any of them. In fact, I'm even unable to decide if Schwartz's tale is (partly) true or a total fabrication, although I'm currently trying to help people research this (in all kinds of different directions). And I'm not saying at all that your reenactment of the murder is not plausible, Lynn. Especially your positioning yourselves pertaining to the wall appear to have been “historically correct“. The 2 problems I have with your video clip is 1) I couldn't see what exactly you were doing to her with the knife, as you had both your backs turned to the camera, and 2) I strongly assume that Stride's head was lifted from the ground, most probably by her scarf, when he finished her off.
Lynn Cates wrote:
Ummm, how does one cut her throat whilst lying on the ground, artery TOWARDS the ground?
Easy: By lifting it up, and the scarf she was wearing must have come pretty handy for this.
Sorry, Lynn, no garden hose or garden. I only have a (relatively spacious) balcony in Berlin, and I used to have cool, wild flowers (daisies, poppies, and hortensias) but in the last 2 years I've been travelling non stop, so “the well has gone dry“. But I have chestnut trees almost coming in from my windows, and this in downtown Berlin! (But in a very green neighborhood.)

[lynn cates]

may the Schwartz be with you

Hello Monty. Yes, I am aware of the implications of Schwartz's story. If Schwartz is telling the truth (which I altogether doubt), then the fracas looks like a domestic affair. Indeed, my good friend Fish is banking on all this.

What I really would like to see is, not necessarily a commitment to a particular view, but rather a THOROUGH re-enactment of the main possible views. Then (as is fashionable with people in my curious profession) we could compare and contrast them.

Cheers.
LC

[Monty]

Hello Monty.

"I don't think they were gazing eastward Lynn, something else was on the agenda."

Quite possibly. All I can say is, "Let's see your version." I shall be delighted to review it.

Cheers.
LC

Im merely pointing out that the conclusion Stride was exiting the yard when attacked, based on body position etc, is open to question.

Schwartz tallies with an attack starting in the street and possibly ceasing where Stride was found.

I cannot commit to any scenario really, neither can anyone else.

Monty

[lynn cates]

ira--peccatum mortem

Hello CD.

"With no argument and no indication that Liz had been slapped around or stabbed anywhere else, we are pretty much forced to accept that her killer acted on the spur of the moment. Sort of zero to sixty in the anger department or perhaps a case of demonic possession. Now either he hid his seething rage from Liz or she was too naive to see it and went willingly with this man into a dark corner of the yard. Throw in the police report saying that they could not find anyone who might want to do such a thing and that is a scenario that I find very hard to accept."

Yes, CD, that is right. And I was bothered by that for a long time. Why would he get so angry so soon? Did she insult him?

But now it is just obvious that it was an assassination. (Think like Sir Charles thought in his October 12th memo.)

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

review

Hello Monty.

"I don't think they were gazing eastward Lynn, something else was on the agenda."

Quite possibly. All I can say is, "Let's see your version." I shall be delighted to review it.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

tagging

Hello Fish. Yes, possibly.

Thank God spray paint were not yet invented.

Cheers.
LC

[c.d.]

Hello (again) CD.

"I didn't see any sort of argument in the video. Was there a reason for that?"

Absolutely. Apart from IS's porky, I see no reason to assume an argument. There is absolutely NO corroboration for such.

Cheers.
LC

Hi Lynn,

With no argument and no indication that Liz had been slapped around or stabbed anywhere else, we are pretty much forced to accept that her killer acted on the spur of the moment. Sort of zero to sixty in the anger department or perhaps a case of demonic possession. Now either he hid his seething rage from Liz or she was too naive to see it and went willingly with this man into a dark corner of the yard. Throw in the police report saying that they could not find anyone who might want to do such a thing and that is a scenario that I find very hard to accept.

c.d.

[Monty]

Hello Monty.

"Nor is it confirmation she was exiting the yard."

True. She could be merely standing there gazing eastward whilst her assailant did the same just to the west of her.

But the trick is to dovetail that with the traditional take. Regrettably, not possible.

Cheers.
LC

I dont think they were gazing eastward Lynn, something else was on the agenda.

Monty

[Fisherman]

Come to think of it, Lynn; what if Liz was the one out scribbling messages on the East end walls that night? Maybe that was what she was doing, facing the wall, just a few inches away from it! And maybe her killer was the enraged owner of the clubhouse, who had his premises written on?

Maybe C D is right - maybe there ARE many possibilities ...

The best,
Fisherman

[lynn cates]

dovetail

Hello Monty.

"Nor is it confirmation she was exiting the yard."

True. She could be merely standing there gazing eastward whilst her assailant did the same just to the west of her.

But the trick is to dovetail that with the traditional take. Regrettably, not possible.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

demo

Hello CD.

"there are just too many possibilities."

Granted. But my claim is that they all come up short. Why not spend a lazy afternoon with a friend and try a demo of some of the possibilities? I'm sure we'd all LOVE to see some of them!

Cheers.
LC

[Monty]

Hello Monty. If she were not exiting the yard, then at least she was facing east. Not exactly congruent with entering the yard with a client.

Cheers.
LC

Nor is it confirmation she was exiting the yard.

Monty

[c.d.]

Hello CD. According to conventional wisdom, she was behind the gate performing her operation. She finishes.

You're suggesting--what? She walks out from behind the gate, takes 2 or 3 steps towards the door, reverses, takes out a cachous, and then the poor (glassy eyed) devil musters up enough strength to kill Liz, but then proceed to Mitre sq for a repeat?

Hmmm. You must be quite young, virile and energetic, sir.

Cheers.
LC

She could have been grabbed from behind and attacked as she was exiting or her killer could have called to her so that she turned to face him. Again, there are just too many possibilities.

As to the young, virile and energetic -- well, yes.

c.d.

[lynn cates]

compassing remarks

Hello Monty. If she were not exiting the yard, then at least she was facing east. Not exactly congruent with entering the yard with a client.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

ah! to be young

Hello CD. According to conventional wisdom, she was behind the gate performing her operation. She finishes.

You're suggesting--what? She walks out from behind the gate, takes 2 or 3 steps towards the door, reverses, takes out a cachous, and then the poor (glassy eyed) devil musters up enough strength to kill Liz, but then proceed to Mitre sq for a repeat?

Hmmm. You must be quite young, virile and energetic, sir.

Cheers.
LC