Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Jack's Escape from Mitre Square

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • That would be kind of a circuitous route to Goulston Street, no?

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Scott Nelson View Post
      That would be kind of a circuitous route to Goulston Street, no?
      No more than any other from Mitre Square.

      But it's not just how the killer got from that point to eventually reach Goulston Street, but also how they avoided PC Watkins and PC Harvey. This lost passage way may be the answer.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Curious Cat View Post

        No more than any other from Mitre Square.

        But it's not just how the killer got from that point to eventually reach Goulston Street, but also how they avoided PC Watkins and PC Harvey. This lost passage way may be the answer.
        Can you post a map showing the passage? I can't see it on the Goad or 1893 OS map. Does it lead into the churchyard?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post

          Can you post a map showing the passage? I can't see it on the Goad or 1893 OS map. Does it lead into the churchyard?
          It can be clearly seen on this map from 1897:

          http://mapco.net/stanford/stan38.htm


          Also, the entrance on the Leadenhall Street side can be seen in this sketch from 1853:

          https://collage.cityoflondon.gov.uk/...AFq-ypepw/3746


          There's another sketch, this time a panorama, which again shows the Leadenhall Street side of the passage:

          https://collage.cityoflondon.gov.uk/...AFq-ypepw/3737


          Here's a remnant of the entrance on the Mitre Street side today:

          https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.51...4!8i8192?hl=en


          Here's where the entrance on the Leadenhall Street side would've been:

          https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.51...4!8i8192?hl=en


          ^ Hopefully those links work!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Scott Nelson View Post
            That would be kind of a circuitous route to Goulston Street, no?
            Scott, the fact that the apron section, which is what you refer to with the suggestion of Goulston, wasn't seen there for over an hour after Kates murder indicates it was not dropped while fleeing. PC Long was sure "..it was not there". His emphasis leads us to believe that in his own mind at least he felt he had looked at that spot the previous pass. Now whether he would have noticed the writing if it preceded the apron section isn't clear, but I think its fair to accept that the killer was no longer in the process of flight when it was left there.

            Which for me puts more credence in the belief that likely the writing, and the section, were left there purposefully, not casually. Much easier to stuff the rag down into some garbage on the street, down a sewer, into the river, burn it, keep it as a "trophy", or maybe re-use it next time. Leaving it where it would certainly be found, just like the way the killer left the previous victims, seems to me to indicate a communication attempt..probably the only one that is likely from the killer of one of these Canonicals.
            Michael Richards

            Comment


            • So Michael, is it your belief that the killer left the cut piece of apron at the spot as to draw attention to the writing on the wall ? Are you also of the opinion that the murderer wrote said writing ?. just a yes or no will do fine . Thanks

              Comment


              • Originally posted by FISHY1118 View Post
                So Michael, is it your belief that the killer left the cut piece of apron at the spot as to draw attention to the writing on the wall ? Are you also of the opinion that the murderer wrote said writing ?. just a yes or no will do fine . Thanks
                Michaelís post is perfectly clear.

                likely the writing, and the section, were left there purposefully, not casually.
                seems to me to indicate a communication attempt...probably the only one that is likely from the killer of one of these Canonicals
                Regards

                Herlock






                "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

                Comment


                • Originally posted by FISHY1118 View Post
                  So Michael, is it your belief that the killer left the cut piece of apron at the spot as to draw attention to the writing on the wall ? Are you also of the opinion that the murderer wrote said writing ?. just a yes or no will do fine . Thanks
                  Ok, no and yes.
                  Michael Richards

                  Comment


                  • With all due respect, Michaels post is not perfectly clear as to the question i asked. ''likely the writing, and the section, were left there purposefully, not casually''. This only tells me in his opinion they were left there purposely. i asked if he thought one was left there to draw attention to the other . i believe there is a difference . But thanks sherlock for your post, have a nice day . And thank you Michael for your honest reply .

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post

                      Can you post a map showing the passage? I can't see it on the Goad or 1893 OS map. Does it lead into the churchyard?
                      Reckon it was an entrance for horse drawn vehicles complete with parking and access to the large building in Leadenhall Street.
                      My name is Dave. You cannot reach me through Debs email account

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Curious Cat View Post
                        ^ Hopefully those links work!
                        Cracking, ta.

                        Comment


                        • The entrance Curious Cat is speaking about was at #75 Leadenhall Street. It was a trunk wharehouse owned by John Pound. I have included all properties (in green) listed as owned by John Pound in the area. Pound was a luggage and leather goods manufacturer. He was Sheriff of London 1885-86 and Lord Mayor in 1904. He also was the treasurer to the Aldgate Ward Schools which was located at #2, Mitre Street.
                          [see arches on Leadenhall and into a courtyard at #75 on Goads map. The courtyard backs to #36 Mitre Street]





                          There was a report of blood on the door of #36 Mitre Street after the Eddowes murder. There was also a report of a man with blood splashes on his face and collar that bumped into another man while hurrying through Mitre Square at 10 a.m on the morning Mary Kelly was later found murdered.

                          John Pound was partners with a man I have spoken of in the past named Franklin Sydney King. They started an office lease company in Billiter street and Billiter Square not far from this Leadenhall address. King had offices there. King also had an office in Castle Alley. In fact, his doorstep was where Alice McKenzie was found murdered in 1889. FS King's childhood home and business offices of his father, David S. King was at #5, Mitre Street until about 1881 or so. The gate at which Catherine Eddowes was found murdered was the back entrance to #5, Mitre Street. The Kings also had properties in at one time of another at Goulston Court, King Street (St, James Place) and Croydon.

                          Franklin King died in 1892.
                          Last edited by jerryd; 05-28-2019, 09:50 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Looking at the Goads map in my previous post, there are two properties listed as #36 Mitre Street. The one on the right (looking at the map) states "BK. arched". It must have passed through to the courtyard attached to #75 Leadenhall.

                            Comment


                            • Another question if i may please. If it was the murderer who wrote the writing on the wall at Goulston st, ,which by all accounts has been established that he did . With out the bloodstained apron of Eddows next to it, how else would anyone know the writing was from JTR ?. Wouldn't it not be just another piece of graffiti on a wall written by anybody. After all Eddows body lay over a mile away at Mitre square ,without the apron next to it the graffiti would have little if not no significance at all to Eddows murder. Just my humble opinion of course.... . Id be interested in your thoughts on this Michael . Regards .

                              Comment


                              • Footnote.... if the purpose of the apron was to carry the removed organs, the result still would be the same with or without the organs would it not ?

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X