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Is Kosminski still the best suspect we have?

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  • Originally posted by The Baron View Post
    Hi Simon,

    He was identified by a fellow jew witness who is unknown to us, there is a good case for Schwarz being the witness.

    I have a great respect for chief inspector Donald Swanson, when he says Kosminski was the suspect, then Kosminski was the suspect.

    I understand your take on Anderson, but that is not enough to rule out this identification,



    The Baron
    The whole ID procedure as described which you seem to want to accept is totally flawed !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    here is the guidelines for ID parades in Victorian Times


    Identification of Prisoners.-1. It is of the utmost importance that the identification of a person who may be charged with a criminal offence should be conducted in the fairest possible manner.

    2. With this end in view the following procedure should be observed :
    (a) The officer in charge of the case against the prisoner, although present, should take no part in the particular proceedings connected with the identification, which should be carried out by the officer on duty in charge of the station or court.
    (b) The witnesses should not be allowed to see the accused before he is placed with others for the purpose of identification, nor should they be shown photographs of him or verbal or written descriptions.
    (c) The accused should be placed among a number of persons (not police)—eight or more, of similar age, height, general appearance, and class of life. He should be invited to stand where he pleases among them, and to change his position after each witness has been called in. He should be asked if he has any objection to any of the persons present, or the arrangements made, and, if he wishes, his solicitor or a friend actually in attendance may be allowed to be present.
    (d) The witnesses should be brought in one by one, and be directed to touch the person they identify. On leaving they should not be allowed to communicate with any other witness in waiting.
    (e) Every circumstance attending the identification should be carefully noted by the officer carrying it out, and whether the accused be identified or not, care being taken that when a witness fails to identify the fact should be as carefully recorded with name and address as in the contrary case—the object being that no subsequent allegation of unfairness can lie.
    (f) Any statement made by the person suspected must be recorded at once and read over to the officer in charge of the case in the presence of the prisoner, who should be invited to sign it.
    www.trevormarriott.co.uk
    Last edited by Trevor Marriott; 02-18-2022, 08:43 AM.

    Comment


    • Hi Simon,

      you know as I know that Swanson is not a liar, thats why you tend to disaprove that he wrote those marginals.

      I on the other hand fully accept them.


      Hi Fishy,

      well I can tell if it is a woman only by looking at her hands and fingers, besides, MJK was positively ifentified by her friend.



      The Baron

      Comment


      • Originally posted by The Baron View Post
        Hi Simon,

        you know as I know that Swanson is not a liar, thats why you tend to disaprove that he wrote those marginals.The Baron
        Everything about and connected to the marginalia is also flawed.

        www.trevormarriott.co.uk
        Last edited by Trevor Marriott; 02-18-2022, 01:38 PM.

        Comment


        • Hi Baron,

          I know no such thing. For all you know, Swanson may have been a liar.

          His old master certainly was.

          Regards,

          Simon
          Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

          Comment


          • "May have been a liar" is a wishful thinking and doesn't jive either, Simon.

            Whether his master was a liar doesn't automatically make Swanson a liar too the way you want us to believe.


            The Baron

            Comment


            • Hi Baron,

              On Page 138 of TLSOMOL, Anderson wrote—"I will merely add that the only person who ever had a good view of the murderer unhesitatingly identified the suspect the instant he was confronted with him; but he refused to give evidence against him."

              There was no mention of either the suspect or witness being a Jew.

              But Swanson had added in pencil, "because the suspect was also a Jew and also because his evidence would convict the suspect and witness would be the means of murderer being hanged which he did not wish to be left on his mind. D.S.S."

              From where had Swanson got this piece of information?

              It had previously appeared in a footnote to Anderson's March 1910 instalment of TLSOMOL in Blackwood's magazine—

              "I will only add that when the individual whom we suspected was caged in an asylum, the only person who had ever had a good view of the murderer at once identified him; but when he learned that the suspect was a fellow-Jew he declined to swear to him."

              So at best, all the page 138 marginalia tells us is that retired Chief Inspector Swanson remembered the March 1910 Blackwood's article and pencilled in the information missing from the published volume.

              Regards,

              Simon
              Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

              Comment


              • Thanks Simon,

                Did the March 1910 Blackwood's article tells us that:

                "And after this identification which suspect knew, no other murder of this kind took place in London...after the suspect had been identified at the Seaside Home where he had been sent by us with difficulty in order to subject him to identification, and he knew he was identified. On suspect's return to his brother's house in Whitechapel he was watched by police (City CID) by day & night. In a very short time the suspect with his hands tied behind his back, he was sent to Stepney Workhouse and then to ColneyHatch and died shortly afterwards - Kosminski was the suspect"


                Sorry Simon, but your theory makes no sense, Swanson is the winning card here!



                The Baron

                Comment


                • Hi Baron,

                  No, it didn't. What a surprise!

                  Donald Swanson, or, most probably, someone on his behalf, conjured this Seaside Home crap out of thin air to bamboozle a gullible Ripperological audience.

                  Good luck with your winning cards.

                  Regards,

                  Simon
                  Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                    ​​​​
                    Donald Swanson, or, most probably, someone on his behalf, conjured this Seaside Home crap out of thin air to bamboozle a gullible Ripperological audience.


                    Simon, you can see that you are the one here who is conjuring an alternative scenarios out of thin air.

                    ​​​​

                    The Baron

                    Comment


                    • Hi Baron,

                      What I see is no better than a lynch mob, a band of people who, without a scrap of evidence, are doing their damnedest to safeguard the reputations of two high-ranking LVP policemen by helping to pin a series of murders on an innocent man.

                      Regards,

                      Simon
                      Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                      Comment


                      • A contemporary working class suspect. Yes, Kosminski is the best of an admittedly bad bunch of suspects.

                        Comment


                        • Do you know of a better suspect?

                          Who killed those women Simon?!

                          Don't you agree he could have been a mentaly sick local person?!

                          Don't you agree he hadn't been caught maybe because those who saw him or knew of his guilt didn't talk?!

                          Don't you agree he could have been a jew in a crowded jewish neihborhood?!

                          Swanson didn't give his first name, Anderson didn't even mention Kosminsk, Macnaughten agreed he is a strong suspect with many sircumstances surrounding him.

                          ​​​​​
                          He is the best suspect that we have, if all the police of the time were a band of liars, then what else do we have here to discover?!



                          The Baron

                          Comment


                          • Hi Baron,

                            Oh Boy, now you're really stretching.

                            You'll need to do better, like offering some proof.

                            Regards,

                            Simon
                            Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                            Comment


                            • There is no proof against anyone, and if you will not accept evidence from the police, I doubt you will accepet anything at all.

                              He got away with his crimes, right Simon?!


                              The Baron

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by The Baron View Post
                                Do you know of a better suspect?

                                Who killed those women Simon?!

                                Don't you agree he could have been a mentaly sick local person?!

                                Don't you agree he hadn't been caught maybe because those who saw him or knew of his guilt didn't talk?!

                                Don't you agree he could have been a jew in a crowded jewish neihborhood?!

                                Swanson didn't give his first name, Anderson didn't even mention Kosminsk, Macnaughten agreed he is a strong suspect with many sircumstances surrounding him.

                                ​​​​​
                                He is the best suspect that we have, if all the police of the time were a band of liars, then what else do we have here to discover?!



                                The Baron
                                But Macnaghten who was Swansons immediate superior makes no mention of any such ID parade in his later memorandum, and in a second memorandum having initially mentioned the name Kosminski as a likely suspect then states that he exonarates Kosminski. hardly corroboration of the marginalia, in fact quite the opposite

                                I think you should be looking at who actually wrote the marginalia and when it was written!

                                www.trevormarriott

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