Why Didn't the Police Have Schwartz and/or Lawende Take a Look at Hutchinson?

[DJA]

Doubt Sutton committed more than 5 murders in 1888.

[Batman]

Sutton's comments are worth reading.

You know I remember reading years ago a very good argument why JtR wasn't medically aware and only remembered it recently.

He failed amputation attempts.

One could say this was due to lack of time.

Yet with MJK the same failures are present, as well as successes.

It also puts JtR at odds with the torsos. If he was so proficient at amputations there then why not with the C5?

Also, we can't really call the amputations, amputations in the medical sense, because... well... it's not how amputations were done and by 1888 amputation surgery was well understood. Yet the signs of the attempts are there, especially with MJK.

[Sam Flynn]

Okay, I chose to give him the benefit of a doubt there, but so he was 53. Donīt you find that a bit old?
And why would a pathologist who has spent many, many years in the autopsy room cutting up people, suddenly turn to killing and eviscerating women out in the streets? Wouldnīt he have had his fill long since? What would be his motivation?

What has any of this to do with the subject of this thread?

[DJA]

Okay, I chose to give him the benefit of a doubt there, but so he was 53. Donīt you find that a bit old?
And why would a pathologist who has spent many, many years in the autopsy room cutting up people, suddenly turn to killing and eviscerating women out in the streets? Wouldnīt he have had his fill long since? What would be his motivation?

Blackmail.

[DJA]

Sutton is claimed to have examined the Lusk kidney by Major Smith.

https://academic.oup.com/ndt/article/23/10/3343/1850338

Sutton's comments are worth reading.

[Fisherman]

Sutton is claimed to have examined the Lusk kidney by Major Smith.

https://academic.oup.com/ndt/article/23/10/3343/1850338

There was a Mr Openshaw attending Suttons funeral, actually. But how that makes him the Ripper...?

[Fisherman]

53 actually.

Okay, I chose to give him the benefit of a doubt there, but so he was 53. Donīt you find that a bit old?
And why would a pathologist who has spent many, many years in the autopsy room cutting up people, suddenly turn to killing and eviscerating women out in the streets? Wouldnīt he have had his fill long since? What would be his motivation?

[Batman]

Sutton is claimed to have examined the Lusk kidney by Major Smith.

https://academic.oup.com/ndt/article/23/10/3343/1850338

[DJA]

A pathologist? Who didnīt get his fill of cutting up bodies at work? And who was 52 at the time of the murders?

There is a lengthy obituary from the British Medical Journal about Sutton, who died in 1891, here:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...273228/?page=3

53 actually.

[Darryl Kenyon]

You could get a quart of ale in a pewter vessel by bringing your own and getting a discount. The same with returning a pewter jug back to a pub [discount on next drink]. Since these were in common supply it didn't have to be the same alehouse as you bought it from.
Blotchy could have done either.

[Fisherman]

I believe Nichols and Chapman were murdered by a pathologist on his way home from London Hospital.

A pathologist? Who didnīt get his fill of cutting up bodies at work? And who was 52 at the time of the murders?

There is a lengthy obituary from the British Medical Journal about Sutton, who died in 1891, here:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...273228/?page=3

[DJA]

Henry Gawen Sutton,MB.

Nichols and Eddowes were his inpatients from December 1867.

Expert in the hereditary disease that was obvious due to Stride's bottom lip,hence the cachous.

Chest expert. TB. Chapman.

Vestry medical officer to Mary Ann Kelly's church when she was a young girl.

Moved next door to William Gull after completing studies and gaining postions.

[Roy Corduroy]

What is the name of your doctor please?

Roy

[DJA]

I am Islington born. I grew up in London.

Are you familiar with Finsbury Square?

I believe Nichols and Chapman were murdered by a pathologist on his way home from London Hospital.

Forget your heat maps for the moment

[Batman]

We also have a killer who has changed his M.O., allowing himself to be seen face to face by a witness in the company of his next victim.
This is a problem in my view.

One could look at the extent of MJK's injuries and conclude this required an environment which gave her murderer time and security, which is what that room provided. He simply could not do this on the street because he wouldn't have the time. So one could say that the M.O change was inevitable.

Serial Killers make mistakes. That is why they get caught. They do get seen. An M.O. change would be a good time to find mistakes.

Generally, killers who prey on the vulnerable, in this case drunken women, are not known to be so brave when confronted with men.

Notice that in Hutchinson's story, JtR spends some time chatting with MJK at the entrance to Miller's court after he has seen him. It may be during this time that he is judging the situation, possibly asking MJK about the man he has just seen. Either way, we know how it ended if this is what was happening.

I doubt Astrachan was the killer anyway. I think he was there because this was his neighborhood. He was not afraid because he was part of the criminal element.

I don't think there is a lot of difference between this man and the other descriptions of JtR except for attire and few inches more.

On another tack.....Hutchinson said he thought he saw him in the Petticoat Lane (the market), so maybe Astrachan was a confidence trickster or petty thief, just like Isaacs.
The Petticoat Lane market did include Goulston Street (the Graffiti?). I have not heard anyone else mention this - coincidence?

This is the kind of thing I find most interesting. Little subtle connections like this and the Chandlery on Thrawl St.