The broken window

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

Illustrated Police News, 17th November 1888—

Another account says that she had a little boy, aged about six or seven years, living with her, and latterly she had been in narrow straits, so much so that she is reported to have stated to a companion that she would make away with herself, as she could not bear to see her boy starving . . . Soon after they [Kelly and the companion] parted a man who is described as respectably dressed came up and spoke to the murdered woman Kelly, and offered her some money. The man then acompanied the woman home to her lodgings, and the little boy was removed from the room and taken to a neighbour's house. Nothing more was seen of the woman until Friday morning, when, it is stated, the little boy was sent back into the house, and subsequently dispatched on an errand by the man who was in the house with his mother.

Regards,

Simon

[DJA]

Hi John Guy,

I understand he was a "General Practitioner - Surgeon."

Regards,

Simon

He had witnessed many dissections apparently.

Makes sense.

[Robert St Devil]

Hi Simon.

The boy doesn't need to be an invention, just another case of mistaken identity.

The Star, on Friday night wrote:
"..she lived in the room in which she has been murdered, with a man and her little son - about 10 or 11 years old."

They also add:
" The woman appears to have lived in the house where she slept last night with her mother and a man who passed as her husband. She had one child."

So now there's not only a son but a mother too, and now the boy is 10 or 11, not 6 or 7.

The Echo, also on Friday night wrote:
"The woman was found lying either in the second floor front room or in the passage leading to it.."

They also add:
"...The lad who went up to the woman's room to collect the rent,.."

They seem to believe the victims room was upstairs.
So who lived upstairs with her mother and son?

Yet the location of the body also seems confused:
"..the dead body of a woman was found in an untenanted outhouse or shed in Dorset-court"

It might be reasonable to ask if there was a woman and child, living with her mother upstairs, whom some Court residents believed was the victim.
There are many rooms in Millers Court for which we have no known occupants at the time of the murder.

Echo also wrote that McCarthys son entered her room and found her. Actually it was the Echo sourcing the Press Association. It seems to be a developing story.

[Wickerman]

Hi Simon.

The boy doesn't need to be an invention, just another case of mistaken identity.

The Star, on Friday night wrote:
"..she lived in the room in which she has been murdered, with a man and her little son - about 10 or 11 years old."

They also add:
" The woman appears to have lived in the house where she slept last night with her mother and a man who passed as her husband. She had one child."

So now there's not only a son but a mother too, and now the boy is 10 or 11, not 6 or 7.

The Echo, also on Friday night wrote:
"The woman was found lying either in the second floor front room or in the passage leading to it.."

They also add:
"...The lad who went up to the woman's room to collect the rent,.."

They seem to believe the victims room was upstairs.
So who lived upstairs with her mother and son?

Yet the location of the body also seems confused:
"..the dead body of a woman was found in an untenanted outhouse or shed in Dorset-court"

It might be reasonable to ask if there was a woman and child, living with her mother upstairs, whom some Court residents believed was the victim.
There are many rooms in Millers Court for which we have no known occupants at the time of the murder.

[David Orsam]

Hi All,

Since 1777, 21 Church Street, Spitalfields [later 27 Fournier Street], had been the address of the London Dispensary, for the provision of free medical attention and medicines.

Yeah, that makes sense, Dr Gabe obviously carried out his medical practice from there for a few years in the early 1880s.

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

Since 1777, 21 Church Street, Spitalfields [later 27 Fournier Street], had been the address of the London Dispensary, for the provision of free medical attention and medicines.



Regards,

Simon

[David Orsam]

If Dr Gabe was brought to Miller's Court to look after a little boy I'm wondering why it was necessary for him to view Kelly's body.

Anyway, one thing to bear in mind - which may or may not be relevant - is that between at least 1880 and 1883 (and possibly up to 1885) Dr Gabe resided at 21 Church Street, Spitalfields, a stone's throw from Dorset Street.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Wickerman,

Are you suggesting the boy was an invention?

Regards,

Simon

[Wickerman]

It's hard to imagine the press failing to mention this boy after the 10th, and into who's care he will be entrusted. That kind of sympathetic appeal cannot fail to draw the readers in.

[Simon Wood]

Hi packers stem,

I would suggest the presence of the six or seven-year-old boy.

Regards,

Simon

[packers stem]

Hi packers stem,

Except for the fact that the doctor was not a gynaecologist.

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon
Happy to bow to your knowledge of Dr.Gabe
Has to be a reason as to why his consultation was required

[Simon Wood]

Hi packers stem,

Except for the fact that the doctor was not a gynaecologist.

Regards,

Simon

[packers stem]

Gynaecologist and paediatrician, Simon

In all liklihood then ,they were checking for signs of pregnancy if there was no child there

[DJA]

Liz Stride, therefore, could have been above average height for a woman, particularly as texts have been inconsistent in stating her height: this site, suggests 5ft 5in, for example, which presumably would have been very tall for a woman.

Reid went the mortuary.

5'2" according to his testimony at the Inquest.

[Phil Carter]

Hello all,

In 2007, Gareth (Sam Flynn) wrote...

"I have no idea whether or not Kelly (or whoever she really was) was pregnant or had a child living with her, but it's always seemed odd to me that one of the seven doctors called to attend her corpse—Dr. J. R. Gabe of Mecklenburgh Square— specialised in paediatrics
......Gabe was a surgeon affiliated to the Society for the Protection [sic. - "prevention"] of Cruelty to Young Children - but whether that made him a "paediatrician" is a moot point. Gabe was certainly called upon by the Society in cases of child abuse in the East End and elsewhere in London. However, although these cases make up the bulk of his entries in the Times, Gabe also testified at inquests into the deaths of late teenagers and adults on occasion - once, in 1890, he gave evidence in a case of wife-murder in Clerkenwell.

Perhaps he was no more a full-time paediatrician than Bagster Phillips was a full-time "forensic pathologist", but - by association with the society to which he was affiliated - one might be forgiven for thinking that he was. Gabe certainly had a degree of experience in examining and describing wounds, and perhaps it was simply in this capacity that he attended Miller's Court."


Phil