Serial Killers, A pattern???

[corey123]

Hello Corey. Well, if Liz was soliciting, it is usually thought that she did so near the gates. OK. If Jack met her there, we need a forensics reconstruction to show how they wound up 10 feet away, Liz on her side, with cachous between her left thumb and forefinger, and none spilled.

The speculation is that her assailant was just behind her and to one side. He pulled her from behind by her scarf and cut her throat as she fell. Now, given her body position, she was exiting the yard.

You will notice that some of these elements CANNOT go together.

The best.
LC

Hello Lynn,

A revival of a post from a year ago.( ).

I might have an answer to this(not saying I just figured this out). What if Liz Stride is at the gate. A man silently exits from the kitchen door of the club into the yard. He pulls her by her scarf 10 ft into the yard and then slices her throat in mid fall. He undoes one button on her chemise and this is when Louis Deimshitz walks in.

Just a fair forensic reconstruction my friend.

Cheers.

p.s This can work both ways if you know what I mean.

[corey123]

If anyone didn't get to see the addition about Monomania, I am sorry, it disapeared off the boards for no appearent reason???

[corey123]

Monomania

Hello all,



I am sure you have heard that Narcissism may have been apart of a social disorder group called Monomania.

Here is the basics of that group(classified as, like Narcissism, as a type A personality)

In psychiatry, monomania (from Greek monos, one, and mania, mania) is a type of paranoia in which the patient has only one idea or type of ideas. Emotional monomania is that in which the patient is obsessed with only one emotion or several related to it; intellectual monomania is that which is related to only one kind of delirious idea or ideas.

In colloquial terms, monomania is often attached to subcultures that to the general public appear esoteric. However, the differences between monomania and passion can be very subtle and difficult to recognize.

[edit] Types of monomania
Following list is derived from The Psychiatric, Psychogenic and Somatopsychic Disorders Handbook.[1]

Capgras delusion: Delusion that an impostor has been substituted for a significant person in the patient's life.
de Clerambault's syndrome (erotomania): Delusion that a man or woman is in love with the patient. This can occur without reinforcement or even acquaintanceship with the love object.
Fregoli's illusion: Delusion that a tormenting individual is changing his appearance to resemble different persons in the patient's life.
Genital retraction syndrome: Delusion that the penis is being retracted into the body.
Wendigo (Wihtigo): Fear that one is being tormented by a demon who devours people. Alternatively the patient can take on the characteristics of the windigo. (Seen only in isolated members of the Algonquin Indian nations of Canada and the USA.)
Demonomania Delusion that one is possessed by demons.
[edit] Monomania in literature
The 19th century writer Edgar Allan Poe would often write tales in which the narrator and protagonist would suffer some form of monomania, becoming excessively fixated on an idea, an urge, an object, or a person, often to the point of mental and/or physical destruction. Poe uses the theme of monomania in:

"The Black Cat" (a man fears his cat and kills it, adopts another cat, kills his wife, and is then punished by the cat)
"The Oval Portrait" (about a painter who is obsessed with painting his wife)
"Berenice" (about a madman who wants to marry his sick cousin only for her beautiful teeth)
"The Masque of the Red Death" (a prince fears a terrible disease but finally gets ill from the red death and dies)
"The Tell-Tale Heart" (a madman is obsessed with an elderly man's eye)
"The Fall of the House of Usher" (The main character Usher is obsessed with the fear of death)
It is said[by whom?] that Flaubert's hatred of the bourgeois and their bêtise (willful idiocy), that began in his childhood, developed into a kind of monomania.

It is monomania from which Flaubert's tragic heroine Madame Bovary suffers; in her case it takes the form of an incessant guilt and fear of discovery. The same monomaniacal fear is explored in great depth in M. E. Braddon's novel, Lady Audley's Secret, through the protagonist Robert Audley, whom the guilty woman accuses of monomania in his relentless attempt to prove her guilt. She describes monomania thus:

What is one of the strangest diagnostics of madness--what is the first appalling sign of mental aberration? The mind becomes stationary; the brain stagnates; the even current of reflection is interrupted; the thinking power of the brain resolves itself into a monotone. As the waters of a tideless pool putrefy by reason of their stagnation, the mind becomes turbid and corrupt through lack of action; and the perpetual reflection upon one subject resolves itself into monomania.
In Crime and Punishment, by the renowned Russian novelist Fyodor Dostoevsky, the main character, Raskolnikov, is said to be a monomaniac on numerous occasions.

In Moby-Dick by Herman Melville (1851), Captain Ahab is a monomaniac, as shown by his quest to kill Moby Dick. One particular situation where he is shown as a monomaniac is in the crew's first encounter with the whale, stating "in his narrow-flowing monomania, not one jot of Ahab's broad madness had been left behind; so in that broad madness, not one jot of his great natural intellect had perished.”[citation needed]

In Emily Brontë's Wuthering Heights, Heathcliff is described as a monomaniac, obsessing over his reunion with Cathy in the final chapters of the novel.

The Marvel Comics supervillain Bullseye is a professional assassin who obsesses over his targets. In one of his more recent appearances, he was revealed to be a monomaniac.

In the novel Lucien De Rubempre by Honoré de Balzac, the title character is referred to as a monomaniac.

[edit] References
^ A. J. Giannini, H. R. Black, R. L. Goettsche. 1978. The Psychiatric, Psychogenic and Somatopsychic Disorders Handbook. New Hyde Park, NY: Medical Examination Publishing Co.
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monomania"

Heres a reference of it used during the Whitechapel murders.

DR. FORBES WINSLOW'S OPINION

Dr. Forbes Winslow, the eminent specialist in lunacy cases, said to our representative; I am more certain than even that these murders are being committed by a homicidal maniac, and there is no moral doubt in my mind that the assassin in each case is the same man. I have carefully read the reports in the morning papers, and they confirm me in the opinion which I had previously formed. While I am clearly of opinion that the murderer is a homicidal maniac, I also believe him to be a mono-maniac, no I see no reason why he should not, excepting, at the periods when the fit is upon him, exhibit a cool and rational exterior. I have here, in my book - a work on psychology - a case in which a man had a lust for blood, as in this case, and he was generally a person of bland and pleasant exterior. In all probability the whole of the murders had been committed by the same hand, but I may point out that the imitative faculty is very strong in persons of unsound mind, and that is the reason why there has been a sort of epidemic of these crimes. We shall probably find that a good many knives will be displayed to people within the next few weeks. Still all the evidence that is forthcoming up to the present moment shows clearly enough that the Whitechapel crimes have been perpetrated by the same hand. My idea is that under the circumstances the police ought to employ, for the protection of the neigbourhood, and with the view of detecting the criminal, a number of officers who have been in the habit of guarding lunatics - that is to say, warders from asylums and other persons who have had charge of the insane. These men, if properly disposed in the neigbourhood, would assuredly note any person who was of unsound mind. I have sent a letter embodying this suggestion to Sir Charles warren, but I have received only a formal communication acknowledging its receipt. It is not easy to prevail upon the police to accept a suggestion from outside sources. This I discovered the other day when a man in emulation of the Whitechapel murder drew a knife and sharpened it in the presence of a relative of mine at Brighton under circumstances which have been published in the newspapers. When I made a statement to the police on that occasion they thought very little of it indeed. I attach not the least importance to the American physiologist story. It is a theory which is utterly untenable, and I should think there were very few medical men who ever entertained it seriously. All that has recently happened appears to me to be a strong confirmation of the views which I have previously given expression to upon the subject. The murderer is a homicidal monomaniac of infinite cunning, and I fear he will not be brought to justice unless he be caught while engaging in the consummation of one of his awful crimes.

Yours truly

[corey123]

Changes

Hello all who participated in this thread and all of casebook,

This thread has lain dorment for a month or two and its time to re-open it.

I have a serious point to tell. We are changing, the casebook is changing. The certanty of this case is very weak right now. Everything is being doubted. The victims, weather it was one killer or a conspiracy of all sorts, the names of the victims, even weather the photos are who we think they are.

Change is in the air, yet we ignore it and go along with our usual debates. We need to know, what will we do if that change is too drastic? Change is here and the question is what will it bring with it?

A new theory? Or a piece of evidence to discredit 122 years of well spent research? Many will be drastically altered by the latter. Many who have spent decades of research, may realize they were all wrong.

That theory is that the murders were a coverup. A conspiracy or smoke-screen by the CID.

A few have challenged the idea of a serial killer at work in 1888 and many of those few have left the boards. Does that not supprise us? We take little notice of what may happen. We need to be able to warn new users and guests of what may happen.

I am writing this, to, like many times before, challenge the challengers.

Those few present us with a possible senerio, and most reject it. The reason for that, is none of them have even given a shed of evidence to suggest it is true, but they continue to proceed with it. Why?

Why take the hardest route in "Ripperology"? Why try to dismiss 122 years of investigation?

There are some MAJOR difficulties in the "fenian/CID coverup" theory.

The CID Coverup.
Here are some conflicting issues with this.
There are some details that the CID would have to know to fake/and or cover up a murder series.

First of all, what would they be covering up? It seems that they are impossing that the CID tryed to cover up Fenian activity and pull the "Serial killer curtain" over it.
If so, how did they do such a good job at fooling later day investigators? they would have needed knowledge about serial killers that would have been pure fiction in 1888. Things such as:

1)The fact that more than most serial killers keep to a certain victim type.
2)The fact that some killers DO take organs and personal possesions as "trophies".
3)They would have to know that killers murder locations have a pattern which, in most cases, when linked form a circle.
4)They would need to know that in murder cases like this, the extent of the injuries increase throughout the spree.
5)They would need to know most of what has been descovered about Killers in the recent past.

When I say they, I mean either the Fenians, or the CID.

Another question then comes up. Why cover it up in the first place?

It has been proposed that even the victim photographs have been faked.
On what evidence? That the photo was grainy? That the injuries were different looking? How and why would a 1888 crime detection agency fake photos even if it was a cover-up?
Thats a good question, how could they? I am sure photoshop wasn't availiable yet so we can rule that out. So how?






So many things we just cast aside. What if its true?

I truly doubt it is, but we need to be aware.

If that post was confusing, I apologize. I have had to get up and come back and get up and come back so I didn't post it all at once.

Yours truly

[corey123]

Re-opening for any whos interested.

Thanks

[corey123]

All the major arguers are gone from this thread. Damn.

[j.r-ahde]

Hello Sam!

Indeed. There were thousands of Irish, and many more Nth-generation Irish, living in the East End (and all over London) at the time. Finding Irish connections in Whitechapel is almost as difficult as finding Cantonese connections in Chinatown.

The best way to confirm this is by seeking the needle in a haystack of LVP Mary Kellies!

All the best
Jukka

[Phil Carter]

Indeed. There were thousands of Irish, and many more Nth-generation Irish, living in the East End (and all over London) at the time. Finding Irish connections in Whitechapel is almost as difficult as finding Cantonese connections in Chinatown.

Gareth,

I am SO glad the only Norwegian connection is Fogelma... or Fuglemas, as the correct (Norwegian) spelling should be.... now there's a thing, new title for new book.. Jack The Ripper,from Viking Hell.

Now I know why the pub "The Horn of Plenty" is so ensconced in the case.

best wishes

Phil

[DVV]

Sam,

you know I'm a fan of your puns.
When it comes to Asian metaphor, I confess I didn't expect you at such a level.

You must be waiting for the Si-Fan card.

Amitiés,
David

[Sam Flynn]

Of coarse there we are in agreement. I have noticed the Irish connections in the case. However this could all be coincidental.

Indeed. There were thousands of Irish, and many more Nth-generation Irish, living in the East End (and all over London) at the time. Finding Irish connections in Whitechapel is almost as difficult as finding Cantonese connections in Chinatown.

[corey123]

Phil,

Of coarse there we are in agreement. I have noticed the Irish connections in the case. However this could all be coincidental.

I have recently found something ALL ripperologists have in commen. We all suffer from CRS(cronic "ripper" syndrom) a term coined by Albert Johnson.

Yours truly

[Phil Carter]

Phil,

I know what you guys think.

I have been reminding myself to keep an open mind towards the idea that Fenains at least killed two of them. However I still stick by the fact that it was a serial killer.

If the SD files became open, no matter the outcome, I would rejoice. I want justic for those women, whether it was a serial killer or not.

Your idea is really interesting I must admitt. I have been even doing some work debunking Fenians so I could learn more about them.

When you guys are finished with the idea, please let me know. And to all of you, Lynn, Mike, Joel, and you Phil, feel free to comment any new findings on this thread.

yours truly

Corey,

Thank you for your reply.

It could very well be that a serial killer IS responsible. This I have never denied as we have spoken of before. And should that be so, we are both in agreement..we have the "........................." that did it. Nothing would please me more.

The only certain thing re Irish is the extraordinary amount of Irish connections throughout this series of murders. That is something that is, from my point of view, thought provoking.
best wishes

Phil

[corey123]

Phil,

I know what you guys think.

I have been reminding myself to keep an open mind towards the idea that Fenains at least killed two of them. However I still stick by the fact that it was a serial killer.

If the SD files became open, no matter the outcome, I would rejoice. I want justic for those women, whether it was a serial killer or not.

Your idea is really interesting I must admitt. I have been even doing some work debunking Fenians so I could learn more about them.

When you guys are finished with the idea, please let me know. And to all of you, Lynn, Mike, Joel, and you Phil, feel free to comment any new findings on this thread.

yours truly

[Phil Carter]

David,

That would work wouldnt it.

Well Joel,

Lynn,Phil, and Mike all think so.

Hello Corey,

I do not think the Fenians had something to do with every killing. I think it is possible that they are in some way connected to a couple of them however.
If is important at this point to remember that, as has been stated before, it's an idea in motion. Nothing is definitive, and nothing in the Fenian idea, in response to your comment above, has been shown to have a definitive pattern.

The point with all of this is perhaps that the disparate facts DO have a connection outside what we already are aware of. The pieces are in place, putting them together however is another matter. Whatever we think, at some point believe, I can, speaking for myself, easily change my view. I too look for the fact that would seal the Fenian suggestion. Perhaps it will turn up. Perhaps it will not.
I DO however believe that the entire issue could be answered if the SD Files on Fenian activity were made available for public scrutiny. Then we will know one way or the other.
And should those documents and files reveal nothing? Then so be it. We could cross that idea off the list of possibilities. And that would certainly be a good thing.

I believe in as much the method of narrowing down whilst looking outside the box, as from outside the box expansion of possibilities too. After all, it can't hurt either way can it?

best wishes

Phil

[corey123]

David,

That would work wouldnt it.

Well Joel,

Lynn,Phil, and Mike all think so.