Riiight

[Ally]

[QUOTE=celee;n778508][QUOTE=Ally;n778504]

Ally this is the last time I am corresponding with you. I worry about your mental health. The parents do have rights. I know liberals hate that but that is the way it goes. Obviously, a Doctor in ITALY was willing to treat the baby.

And do you know what the treatment was? A series of operations that would not save the child's life, just prolong it for an "indefinite period". The doctors, all of them agreed, it was a hopeless case. So basically cut the kid open, operate on him, for completely useless measures, just because the parents couldn't accept the kid was not going to live.

That's not medically necessary that's just barbaric.

The parents who probably are Christians, I know liberals hate that, wanted to give their child every chance to live maybe they even prayed to God, I bet your head is about to explode.

I do always find it amusing that people think it's god's will whether someone lives or dies and doctor's have **** all to do with it, but demand that people be hooked up to medical machines for unending amounts of time just in case God was you know...busy for the first eighteen months they were praying for a miracle. If God wants the kid to live, god will intervene when he's pulled off the machine, no? Or when the mother drives up to the abortion clinic, no? It's always funny how people always SAY that only God has the right to choose who lives and dies, and yet they do every thing possible to take that choice out of God's hands when it comes right down to it, don't they?

There is a big difference between wanting to fight for the life of your child and abusing the child.

Cutting a child open for no purpose except to prolong their suffering and having them be hooked up to machines, rotting away in a bed because you can't accept reality isn't fighting for your child. It's living in a world of delusion and abusing your child because you can't accept that sometimes, life is **** and unfair. That doesn't give you the right to prolong your child's agony because you can't let go. It's barbaric and it's cruel.

Oh and to be clear, I don't blame the parents for being insane, it's idiots like you who back them in their insanity and use their unhinged grief and use it as a political weapon who I have an issue with. They have an excuse for being stupid. They're insane with grief. You don't.

[rjpalmer]

Celee -- No offense, but you sound exactly like my uncle. It is painfully obvious to me that you are just repeating all the same talking points fed to you by Tucker Carlson, etc. I know this, because your diatribes are the exactly the same as his (my uncle's) almost word for word. Had you been actually reading widely and coming up with your own ideas, there would be some divergence of thought. But there isn't. I have nothing against you personally--I don't even know you and you'd probably be a good and honest neighbor--but you are toeing a warped party line that has been fed to you, and that's a scary thing.

In regard to Swalwell, your insinuations are entirely ridiculous and unfair. Yours is the narrative of Fox News. This Chinese operative targeted Swalwell and other up-and-coming politicians. I think he may have gone on a couple of dinner dates with her. The thing is, he didn't know she was a spy. He was the 'mark.' You seriously don't think that detail is relevant? When he found out she was suspected of being a spy, he dropped her like a ton of bricks and fully cooperated with the F.B.I. and revealed everything he knew. There was no wrongdoing and no evidence he ever told her anything worthwhile.

This is the polar opposite of Paul Manafort knowingly working with the Ruskies and illegally giving them polling data, etc. -All of which was PROVEN by a bi-partisan Senate Committee. The two cases are not even in the same political universe, despite what you've been fed.

The thing is, you're being played, old boy, but you won't ever believe me, just as my uncle will never believe me. He's a good guy in many ways, but he's just regurgitating, without even any attempt at skepticism, all the fake news being fed to him by Rupert Murdoch & Company. They are Libertarians out go gain as much power and wealth as they can gain, society and government be damned. What I would calmly say to you is that you are blaming the wrong people for the country's woes, but--again--you won't believe me.

Good luck, but I've said all I care to say. You're going to have to work it out for yourself.

[Ally]

I agree with everything Ally said in post #73 but I just wanted to point out, in case anyone misunderstands, the first part that’s been attributed to me was actually a quote from celee. I know that Ally knows this but I just thought I’d point it out in case anyone else thought it confusing. It’s just a typing error.

Yes, apologies, I didn't catch that, I will edit it to clear up the confusion!

[Svensson]

And that was a decision made by doctors for medical reasons. Are any of us qualified to comment on medical issues? I’m certainly not. The doctors felt that the baby couldn’t be cured based on medical knowledge.

Speaking as an Englishman though I can tell you that across the board including those on the left and those on the right you will be hard pressed to find anyone over here that doesn’t consider the National Health Service one of our finest achievements and it was achieved by a Socialist government. Like all countries we have things to be proud of and stuff not to be proud of but the NHS is universally revered here. It’s not perfect of course (because it’s run by fallible human beings) but it’s worthy of celebration as an achievement. No one here thinks that if you don’t have cash then tough.

Ill tell what many of my older family members certainly do remember though Celee, it’s their parents not being able to send for a Doctor because they didn’t have cash to pay. How many people died from lack of treatment because they couldn’t afford it? How many illnesses went undiagnosed? How many babies died? Now everyone gets health treatment from the Prime Minister (or Idiot as most of us call him) down to someone sleeping rough.

If anyone does decry the NHS it’s always, and I mean always, someone who is a) on the right, and b) comfortably off financially……so basically it’s “I’m alright Jack.”

Gee, you could almost say that we have the FREEDOM to call a doctor when we need one

[rjpalmer]

The United States started to go down the drain intellectually when Ronald Reagan deregulated the FCC and scrapped the Fairness Doctrine.

This paved the way for entirely partisan news organizations that were no longer in the business of fairly reporting the news but were instead 24/7 propaganda machines.

If there was a conspiracy, it was a conspiracy among the ultra-rich Libertarians. Wreck Lyndon Johnson's 'Great Society' and replace it with out-and-out feudalism.

[Svensson]

That is very interesting RJ

Gen. Washington made the controversial decision to order the mass inoculation of his soldiers, an effort to combat spread of the disease that was at the time a major deterrent to enlistments and posed the risk of debilitating his army.

Tucker Carlson, 24:7

Celee, this is why it's important to list your sources. AFAIK, most of your sources are Fox, OAN, Newsmax or even worse. You have to realise that their opinions are not facts. This thread is about facts. Now are you game or not?

[celee]

In regard to Swalwell, your insinuations are entirely ridiculous and unfair. Yours is the narrative of Fox News. This Chinese operative targeted Swalwell and other up-and-coming politicians. I think he may have gone on a couple of dinner dates with her. The thing is, he didn't know she was a spy. He was the 'mark.' You seriously don't think that detail is relevant? When he found out she was suspected of being a spy, he dropped her like a ton of bricks and fully cooperated with the F.B.I. and revealed everything he knew. There was no wrongdoing and no evidence he ever told her anything worthwhile.

This is the polar opposite of Paul Manafort knowingly working with the Ruskies and illegally giving them polling data, etc. -All of which was PROVEN by a bi-partisan Senate Committee. The two cases are not even in the same political universe, despite what you've been fed.

The thing is, you're being played, old boy, but you won't ever believe me, just as my uncle will never believe me. He's a good guy in many ways, but he's just regurgitating, without even any attempt at skepticism, all the fake news being fed to him by Rupert Murdoch & Company. They are Libertarians out go gain as much power and wealth as they can gain, society and government be damned. What I would calmly say to you is that you are blaming the wrong people for the country's woes, but--again--you won't believe me.

Good luck, but I've said all I care to say. You're going to have to work it out for yourself.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for keeping it polite.

My comments about Swalwell were part of a larger discussion. My point was it is very hypocritical that people go crazy when Don Jr. has dinner with a Russian and completely ignore the fact that Swalwell was dating a Chinese spy. His family still were in touch with her until the story broke. I am not advocating to impeach the man but perhaps removing him from the intel committee would be good. Marjorie Taylor Green was removed from the committee because she posted a Qanon comment. Seriously you can not see the double standard? Adam Shift forged text and presented them as evidence to the January 6th committee. He was not removed from the committee. Nobody, not even Democrats, dispute that Swalwell slept with a Chinese spy and Shift forged text. The double standard is crazy. Joe Biden has been accused of sexual assault. He has made several racist comments and his family has business ties to Russia, China, and Ukraine. We now know for a fact that HUNTER'S laptop was not Russian misinformation. Facts, that is why I sound like your Uncle, facts are easy to repeat. I pointed out the corruption on the left responding to someone who said all Trump supporters deserve no respect because they support a bad person. I feel most politicians are corrupt Republicans and Democrats because power corrupts. President Trump might not be a compassionate man. I watched a documentary where he had a man evicted from his land because he wanted to build a golf course. However, Democrat politicians are just as bad as Republicans. So, nobody should make the argument Trump supporters do not deserve respect for voting for a bad person when the choice was between Clinton Biden and Trump.

Your Uncle sounds like a fine man. You base your comment on the fact you do not trust FOX news and immediately dismiss anything Tucker Carlson reports as fake or propaganda. Of course, there is a huge problem with the media in America. We have two news sources liberal and conservative there is no none bias reporting anymore. Somebody posted a comment above that Trump supporters have been brainwashed by the media, FOX news. Well, it could be that Trump haters have been brainwashed by the liberal media. How many narratives have turned out to be false that the liberal media was reporting about Trump?

A not so polite person once said "Tell an uninformed person they are smart and they will believe anything they are told." There is an arrogance and snobbery with liberals that has been nurtured by the mainstream liberal media. Examine the terms. What would you rather be liberal or conservative? The word liberal suggests open-minded acceptance. Conservative suggests closed-mindedness unwilling to change. I would rather be called liberal. Progressive, who does not want to be progressive suggesting a person is forward-thinking. Do you ever wonder why liberals are called Progressive? The Democrat party markets itself to uninformed Americans. So they believe the news source that tells them they are smart and progressive. FOX news followers are hicks' knuckle-dragging cavemen who are conservative and backward. Because of the progressive belief that they are smarter, they have lost the ability to coexist or respect anyone with a different point of view. So instead of being progressive, they are actually narrow-minded unaccepting neo-Nazis. Of course, I am not including everyone who identifies with the Democrat party. You seem like a nice person.

I do not know what the answer is. America is so divided. Any suggestions? I cast my vote because of policies. Right now, to me, Republican policies are better for America. I think every American should respect each other and listen. I am open to changing my mind if there is a persuasive argument. I actually blame the media for dividing and destroying my country. America has become very tribal and patriotism is seen as bad racist a symbol of the oppressive white patriarchy. People are shamed for loving their country. This is scary because love of country and identifying as American was a common love that bound all Americans together. White, black, gay or straight, man or women, immigrant etc...

[Herlock Sholmes]

Yes, apologies, I didn't catch that, I will edit it to clear up the confusion!

No problem Ally.

[Svensson]

What's your source on Adam Schiff forging an email, sms, any kind of docs?

[celee]

Tucker Carlson, 24:7

Celee, this is why it's important to list your sources. AFAIK, most of your sources are Fox, OAN, Newsmax or even worse. You have to realise that their opinions are not facts. This thread is about facts. Now are you game or not?

Svensson that is a million-dollar problem. The media. America no longer has nonbias reporting. Nobody really trusts the media. I do not trust CNN, MSNBC, CBS, ABC, OR NBC news. I do not trust FOX news. I just watch all news and then make up my mind. Literally, all I watch is news and football. How do you know what news source to trust everything is so bias?

[celee]

What's your source on Adam Schiff forging an email, sms, any kind of docs?

It has been all over the news. Liberal news sources defend it they do not deny he did it.

[Svensson]

It has been all over the news. Liberal news sources defend it they do not deny he did it.

I never heard of this. Provide me with just ONE link please.

[Varqm]

That thousands and thousands of lives could have been saved by an early tackling of the virus, while Trump acted like a clown - inject disinfectant, even Dr. Deborah Birx the coordinator of the White House's coronavirus task force agrees, was\is not an issue. It did not even register. It's about fracking. LOL. It's like talking to the wall.

[Varqm]

Science is as important as laws and freedom. The gov't has to mandate vaccinations since it's their jobs to save lives.

[Svensson]

How's that search for a link suggesting Adam Schoff has faked docs coming along..?