EU Vote

[caz]

No one knows what the world will look like ten years, or even five years from now - least of all Governments. Mr Cameron didn't even know that his own people were going to vote Leave.

Hi Robert,

Well he must have had an inkling, surely? Didn't he dangle the referendum like a carrot, to help him win the last general election? Only those who wanted to leave the EU would have wanted or needed this particular carrot, so he must have anticipated it would be a popular move with the electorate, and therefore a good career move for himself. But then he had the uphill task of trying to convince everyone who may only have voted for him so they could vote to leave the EU that actually doing so would be very much against their best interests and those of their country.

If Cameron had genuinely felt all along that it would be much better for us all to remain in the EU, regardless of 'popular' opinion, why did he promise a referendum in the first place, if it wasn't just a cynical ploy to get himself one more spell in Number 10 with Larry the cat?

Love,

Caz
X

[Svensson]

I, as a consumer, don't want to buy good that have been crated in sweat-shops

Then don't buy them.

But you forgot to add 'and I'm going to make damn sure that no one else buys them either.'

It is very tempting to add this in fact. One part of me feels that we should quite rightly stop everyone from buying sweat-shop stuff, the other part of me recognises that this is not something that can reasonably be imposed on others. So what are we left with? We can incenticise sweat-shop economies to stop some of these practices. Stick and carrot maybe. But I feel that some principles need to be upheld otherwise it's a free-for-all where parts of society are continuously exploited with no possibility to a better life.

[Robert]

Hi Caz

I don't think he had any inkling at all - if he had, he would never have called the referendum in the first place. I think he wanted to nobble UKIP by removing their raison d'etre. A win would have meant burying the issue for the next 40 years. I think he calculated that the same Project Fear that worked on the Scots, would work on the whole UK. According to an account I read, he and his aides were still in confident mood when they sat down to watch the TV coverage. It was only when the first results started to come in that the atmosphere turned sombre.

[Robert]

Hi Svensson

One problem I have is that it's for these countries themselves to decide their own labour laws. Some of these countries - I suspect most - don't hold the same western values as us, don't have economies like ours, and are generally different from us. How can we just tell them what to do (even if it is dressed up as stick and carrot)? I myself would not want to buy clothing that some poor sod has been paid a pittance to make. But what if by doing that I help to shut down the sweatshop because it isn't selling its stuff? The poor sod will then have no income at all, because he'll be out of work. You can see how long it's taken for Europe to form some kind of union, with all the problems of reconciling different national interests, and you yourself admit that the time has come to call a halt to integration. That's with European countries who share a bedrock of values, even though there are marked differences between them. Now jump across to India and China. Different world.

[John G]

Hi John

Re the article(s) :

No one knows what the world will look like ten years, or even five years from now - least of all Governments. Mr Cameron didn't even know that his own people were going to vote Leave. Nor did the other EU bigwigs, for whom the result was apparently a profound shock. However, as a general principle, I think that tariffs are wrong. They're a sort of fraud on the consumer, and they encourage business inefficiency. If I wanted to go all internationalist and Guardian on you, I could even say that they're unfair to countries which aren't in the Cosy Club. It's up to British business to make good products, seek out markets and sell to them. I may be old-fashioned, but there you go.

Hello Robert,

Yes, I would send to agree with you about tariffs in general. However, the point is that if other nations apply tariffs to British goods then Britain is absolutely entitled to retaliate, particularly if the alternative is that an entire industry is eliminated.

[John G]

Hi Robert,

Well he must have had an inkling, surely? Didn't he dangle the referendum like a carrot, to help him win the last general election? Only those who wanted to leave the EU would have wanted or needed this particular carrot, so he must have anticipated it would be a popular move with the electorate, and therefore a good career move for himself. But then he had the uphill task of trying to convince everyone who may only have voted for him so they could vote to leave the EU that actually doing so would be very much against their best interests and those of their country.

If Cameron had genuinely felt all along that it would be much better for us all to remain in the EU, regardless of 'popular' opinion, why did he promise a referendum in the first place, if it wasn't just a cynical ploy to get himself one more spell in Number 10 with Larry the cat?

Love,

Caz
X

Of course it all went wrong when Boris Johnson decided to back the Brexit campaign, despite previously saying "I'm not an outer." Then again, after the result was declared he didn't appear very jubilant- in fact, he looked more like someone about to attend a funeral! Which, I think,tells you everything you need to know about his actual motives.

[Robert]

Johnson is a clown and he should have been made conservative party chairman, where his job would have been to seek publicity, crack some jokes and raise party morale.

[caz]

Hi Robert,

Maybe Theresa thought it was high time Boris should be made to earn his keep! I do hope he actually has to do some work in this new role.

Love,

Caz
X

[Robert]

I'd like to see the whole lot of them do some work, Caz, and I'm sure we'll see a new era of industriousness and extra effort....just as soon as the next recess is over.

http://www.parliament.uk/about/faqs/house-of-commons-faqs/business-faq-page/recess-dates/

[Svensson]

doesn't automatically mean that they don't do any work in their constituencies during these recess times

[caz]

Hi Caz

I don't think he had any inkling at all - if he had, he would never have called the referendum in the first place. I think he wanted to nobble UKIP by removing their raison d'etre. A win would have meant burying the issue for the next 40 years. I think he calculated that the same Project Fear that worked on the Scots, would work on the whole UK. According to an account I read, he and his aides were still in confident mood when they sat down to watch the TV coverage. It was only when the first results started to come in that the atmosphere turned sombre.

In that case Cameron really did shoot himself in the foot, didn't he? He promised a referendum to fix what he didn't consider to be broke, imagining that most of the electorate were as happy with the way things were and would vote accordingly?

If he had promised a referendum on whether to carry on taxing booze and fags or not, would he have believed he only needed to scare us with the disastrous health consequences to get a nice fat majority voting to carry on as before?

Love,

Caz
X

[Robert]

He's arrogant enough to try it, Caz.

[caz]

doesn't automatically mean that they don't do any work in their constituencies during these recess times

I don't know if that would apply to the likes of Boris though. One of his former constituents was on the radio last week complaining that he used to do sod all as their MP and "took the piss".

When I was working in a Home Office department in the late eighties, I never knew anyone so busy on a daily basis, and so dedicated to representing his constituents as Jeremy Corbyn, even though I wasn't a fan of his politics.

Love,

Caz
X

[Robert]

Corbyn's in the unfortunate position of being in charge of a party whose MPs have by and large gone on strike. I hope said MPs are not drawing their salary.

[Mayerling]

Hello Robert,

Yes, I would send to agree with you about tariffs in general. However, the point is that if other nations apply tariffs to British goods then Britain is absolutely entitled to retaliate, particularly if the alternative is that an entire industry is eliminated.

I can see that it would be fair, but John it would be disastrous. Economic Historians will tell you that one reason the Great Depression lasted so long was the tariff walls that came up around the globe in the wake of the U.S. Smoot - Hawley Tariff of 1930 (one of the most misguided ideas in our history). The other tariff walls were built against us in retaliation.

Jeff