Jack the Ripper A-Z

[mariab]

Waistcoat made a clever comment that other Americans won't be able to follow?!
(Waistcott's a cheapskate!)

[Into The Abyss]

I recently received my copy of the 2010 edition of this book, which I had eagerly anticipated (having never read the book before) but have to say that I am a tad disappointed, to say the least.

There are so many typos and grammatical errors that I cannot believe that there was any serious proof reading of the tome by anyone whose first language is English. Considering the standing of the authors, Begg, Fido and Skinner, I am really surprised that they allowed this book to appear in its current form with so many mistakes.

There also seem to be errors of fact. One instance will suffice, although there would appear to be a number of others.

Under the heading: Harvey, PC James 964 City (page 201):

"For reasons unknown, the City of London Police had Sussex Constabulary check...."

There was no "Sussex Constabulary" at ANY time. Sussex Police (the Force's current title) was divided into 5 separate and autonomous units in the 19th century - East Sussex, West Sussex, Brighton, Eastbourne and Hastings Constabularies. Presumably it would have been the East Sussex Constabulary to which the initial enquiry about P.C. Harvey was directed, as Ashburnham (where he was born) is situated in a north-east parish of said county.

The entry mentioned immediately goes on to refer to the response received to the City of London enquiry about P.C. Harvey:

"and Portsmouth Police (sic) reported...."!

Thankfully, I obtained the book at half its RRP through Amazon otherwise I would be an even unhappier bunny!

[macknnc]

My Case Closed is holding up much better than my A-Z which is now partially loose leaf.

Was there a hard cover A-Z?

Yep,I've got one...copyright date is 1991, printed in London..

My copy of Cornwell's "Case Closed" is a standard paperback which I got in excellent condition from the local library's sale of non-circulating books for the grand total of .25 cents..apparently no one else wanted to read it either...

[Rob Clack]

I recently received my copy of the 2010 edition of this book, which I had eagerly anticipated (having never read the book before) but have to say that I am a tad disappointed, to say the least.

There are so many typos and grammatical errors that I cannot believe that there was any serious proof reading of the tome by anyone whose first language is English. Considering the standing of the authors, Begg, Fido and Skinner, I am really surprised that they allowed this book to appear in its current form with so many mistakes.

There also seem to be errors of fact. One instance will suffice, although there would appear to be a number of others.

Under the heading: Harvey, PC James 964 City (page 201):

"For reasons unknown, the City of London Police had Sussex Constabulary check...."

There was no "Sussex Constabulary" at ANY time. Sussex Police (the Force's current title) was divided into 5 separate and autonomous units in the 19th century - East Sussex, West Sussex, Brighton, Eastbourne and Hastings Constabularies. Presumably it would have been the East Sussex Constabulary to which the initial enquiry about P.C. Harvey was directed, as Ashburnham (where he was born) is situated in a north-east parish of said county.

The entry mentioned immediately goes on to refer to the response received to the City of London enquiry about P.C. Harvey:

"and Portsmouth Police (sic) reported...."!

Thankfully, I obtained the book at half its RRP through Amazon otherwise I would be an even unhappier bunny!

I don't know enough about the history of the Sussex Police to make comment, but there is a document in P.C Harvey's file stating (as I read it):

The Superintendent
Sussex Constab'
Hailsham

This is the relevant part of the document


All new recruits for the City of London Police had to have check able references which is why Portsmouth Police is mentioned as well as the Borough of Brighton Police.





A detailed history of P.C Harvey was done by me and Neil Bell and appeared in 'Ripperologist' 104

Rob

[Stewart P Evans]

Constabulary

Any organised force of police may be referred to as a 'Constabulary' whereas the official title is another matter. The Suffolk Constabulary is an official force name but that does not bar them from being called Suffolk Police. The scan shown here clearly says Sussex Constab'y even though that was not the official force title. East Sussex as a force existed until April 1943 when it became part of Sussex Combined.

[Rob Clack]

Thank you Stewart.

Regards

Rob

[Sam Flynn]

Here's a few minor errors I picked up on.

Diemschutz - correct spelling is Diemshitz, which I demonstrated to the satisfaction of all a year or two ago.

Not quite to the satisfaction of all, Tom

The name originates in Russia, and the Cyrillic "ДЫМШЫЦ" can be transliterated in a number of ways. The closest, I suppose, would be "Dymschyts", but Dimshitz, Dim$hits, Dymschytz, even Diemschütz (in Germanic orthography) would be legimate approximations.

PS: Hello, Tom

[mariab]

In German in would be spelled correctly “Diemschutz“, as “Schütz“ combined with another name before it traditionally looses its Umlaut, and becomes “bla-schutz“. Obviously the anglicized version would loose the German “c“ in “sch“ and become “sh“, as in “Diemshitz“.

[Sam Flynn]

In German in would be spelled correctly “Diemschutz“, as “Schütz“ combined with another name before it traditionally looses its Umlaut, and becomes “bla-schutz“.

If it were a German name, I'd fully agree with you, Maria - but it's not. To be clear, my point was more about transliteration than "proper spelling". Bottom line is, the English alphabet can't render "ДЫМШЫЦ" correctly, as there are subtleties in the pronunciation that English doesn't adequately cater for.

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Sam. Good to see you after your prolonged absence. Regarding the Diemster, accepted variations are to be found in almost every name...there are numerous variations of my own surname, in fact. However, my family spells it 'Wescott', so because a single journal (Ripperologist) screwed up and spelled it 'Westcott', does not mean that they are correct. That's what we find in the case of Diemshitz...ONE newspaper spells it Diemschutz...one, that being the Times. Nowhere else. All the legit sources spell it Diemshitz...plain and simple.

Begg and co. also spell William Wess' name as 'West, William'. Why? Because the Times did, although he NEVER gave his name as West. It's not about unlauts, or Germanic, or Russian, it's about documented fact.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Sam Flynn]

Hi Sam. Good to see you after your prolonged absence.

Thanks, Tom - good to talk to you again

It's not about unlauts, or Germanic, or Russian, it's about documented fact.

It's all about spelling, umlauts, German, Russian... and the singular inadequacy of our noble English alphabet to render these pesky Johnny-foreigner names correctly.

At least the "Diemschutz" version, with or without umlaut, spares poor old LD from the dubious posterity (posteriority?) of having the "$hitz" for all time.

I think I'll take a leaf out of your book, however, and stick with the pet-name of "Diemster" from now on

[The Grave Maurice]

Sam!!! I was beginning to think that you had lost your fingers in some sort of freak industrial chutney accident. It's so nice to have you back. I imagine that the collective IQ of these boards has just gone up by several points.

[mariab]

To Sam Flynn:
Absolutely, it's not a German name. I was simply making a point that “Schütz“ in Germanic languages either comes alone, or becomes “something-schutz“ when combined. I assume it's a question of commodity, as it's harder to pronounce “schütz“ in combined syllables (even for the Germans!), so the “ü“ becomes “u“. I'm very aware that language is a continuously and naturally shifting, changing entity, and names in families change from generation to generation, for all kinds of different, almost always practical reasons.
Is the original name really Russian, or Jewish? Because it certainly doesn't sound Russian...
To Tom Wescott:
But did you notice, Tom, that the anglicized version, “Diemshitz“, immediately dropped the “sch“ (apart from in one single newspaper, The Times)? Documented fact usually coincides with linguistic commodity, because no one in England would spare the time to spell “sch“ as “sh“ – and why should they?
(As long as they didn't call him “Dumbsh*t“...)
I thought your real name was Waistcoat – or Red Demon?
I hear that my real name in Ripperology should have been Maria Birkwood. It seems like I've disappointed many people for not having been the reincarnation of her.

[Johnr]

The A to Z of (Published material about) JTR

Firstly, my single copy of the current A to Z is on order, ( it will not be released by Macmillan in Australia till October).

Secondly, in advance, and based entirely on the thoughtful and constructive criticisms on this thread, I'd like to congratulate Poul Biggs, Martyn Feedo, and Keef Skyner for taking on the heroic and thankless task of bringing their valuable volume up to date.

"Everyone wants to whip the horse, yet no-one wants to handle the reins".

Lastly, I wonder if I might make a suggestion:

If the Illustrious Troika should be brave enough to do a further volume, down the track, why not get the publisher to set up a closed web site - or advanced purchase website - on which the entire book is placed,
and subscribers can point out the errors -or perceived errors- before the book is launched onto the marketplace?
This is a raw idea: others might use their expertise to refine it, but basically,
I see all these experts helping now, when their input earlier could have obviated the bloopers.

I am sincere in my praise of the authors.And can offer one consolation.When journalists steal their hard-won discoveries for their own, at least the cleverly and deliberately planted mistakes will mean we can identify where they stole their material from!

Well Done those Three!

JOHN RIFFULS.

[Chris]

Sam!!! I was beginning to think that you had lost your fingers in some sort of freak industrial chutney accident.

Or even accidentally padlocked yourself inside a sports bag ...