Why Buck's Row?

[Joshua Rogan]

Most intriguing...but according to this site, the first of the warehouses in Backchurch Lane weren't built until 1889. Too late for Stride, but maybe ok for the Pinchin St torso...?

http://theloom-e1.com/building/the-history/

[jerryd]

Most intriguing...but according to this site, the first of the warehouses in Backchurch Lane weren't built until 1889. Too late for Stride, but maybe ok for the Pinchin St torso...?

http://theloom-e1.com/building/the-history/

The 1889 building was at 101 Backchurch Lane on the west side of the road and slightly north.

[jerryd]

The article does appear to have both buildings built in 1889, but, it still peaks my interest a lot.

[Elamarna]

Funny, Joshua.

After further review, one of the Browne and Eagle warehouses at 74 Backchurch Lane appears to have been directly across the street from the Pinchin arch. Two bodies found directly across from a Browne and Eagle wool warehouse.

See post #4 (Edward Stow) for Goad map showing the warehouse. http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?t=12731. It was indeed, RIGHT across the street from where the torso was deposited in Pinchin street. The plot thickens!

It certainly does, this sounds very interesting.
Joshua and i spent a whole afternoon this year ruling out a tea warehouse in buck row, we never considered, well i certainly did not, looking at what was there and seeing if there were any links to other points of interest.


steve

[Elamarna]

Most intriguing...but according to this site, the first of the warehouses in Backchurch Lane weren't built until 1889. Too late for Stride, but maybe ok for the Pinchin St torso...?

http://theloom-e1.com/building/the-history/

well spotted

Steve

[Joshua Rogan]

The article does appear to have both buildings built in 1889, but, it still peaks my interest a lot.

Another website has the two built "between the late 1880's and the turn of the century". I'm not sure how long it took the Victorians to throw up a couple of warehouses, and also not sure if the date given refers to the official opening date or the laying of the first stone, or somewhere between. They could have been building sites...like the New Scotlad Yard building?
Is it my imagination, or does the 1890 Goad map show the warehouse in place opposite the archway, but the (I think) 1894 OS map still shows housing?

[Joshua Rogan]

It certainly does, this sounds very interesting.
Joshua and i spent a whole afternoon this year ruling out a tea warehouse in buck row, we never considered, well i certainly did not, looking at what was there and seeing if there were any links to other points of interest.

Yeah, we missed a trick there Steve. Either that, or someone was pulling the wool over our eyes...

Anyway, there does seem to be a warehouse connection, whatever they stored. Although I suspect it could be the same connection as the railway connection.... Warehouses generally being situated near railway lines.

[jerryd]

https://surveyoflondon.org/map/features/tagged/Browne%20Eagle/

I believe this was the first of the two warehouses belonging to Browne and Eagle. During the Pinchin Street investigation a blood stained piece of cloth was found in Hooper Street. The other warehouse would later be between Forbes and Backchurch Lane; Ellen and Pinchin.

[jerryd]

Sounds like Browne and Eagle used Holland and Hannen for different construction jobs since at least 1875. Browne and Eagle had another site in 1875 on Great Alie Street that Holland and Hannen built a chimney-shaft for. They also did work in the British Museum in 1891.

Holland and Hannen were an approved government contractor in 1888 and did work on the new police building in Woolwich in 1908. Maybe they were involved in the construction of New Scotland Yard? Should we be looking for a construction worker, working for Holland and Hannen, who, at the very least, may have dumped two torsos (Pinchin and Whitehall).

[Pcdunn]

On the contrary, his general MO was to first strangle from the front until dead or near dead, then slash their throat - hence the lack of arterial spray - and then mutilate.

I suppose I need to return to the books and study more, Hair Bear. I do know there is an infernal lot of discussion about how Liz Stride was attacked on this site, but you did say "general MO."

[jerryd]

Jerry

do we know if anyone we know is linked to them at all?

might be worth a check i guess?


Steve

Sadler said he worked at Browne and Eagle in Buck's Row but the firm did not have knowledge of it.

[Hair Bear]

I suppose I need to return to the books and study more, Hair Bear. I do know there is an infernal lot of discussion about how Liz Stride was attacked on this site, but you did say "general MO."

As I'm sure you are aware, some would argue that Stride was actually killed by someone other than the Ripper.

[Hair Bear]

The location of the first canonical murder has always slightly puzzled me.
The murder of Nichols has all the characteristics of a "blitz" attack.

The attack was carried out in the middle of a street with a very real chance of being seen by local residents, people coming to and from work at all hours of the day.

Is it possible that the murderer only felt confident enough to carry out the attack because he was very close to his place of residence, and could be home within a matter of seconds of committing the murder?

I like to think that it wasn't near his place of residence (though concede I may be wrong). I also like the blitz-style attack, but I'm not so sure. Nichols known movements place her further West of the crime scene. It's also clear that she touted for business along Whitechapel road. I get the impression that her plan was to repeatedly wander East along Whitechapel and then back again, only moving off Whitechapel once she was at Osborn Street. I think she met the Ripper whilst she was as far East as she was moving, and they walked to Buck's Row. Notice that the murder took place in front of the gates and not a house. I think that they walked to that point, and the Ripper would have looked behind him towards White's Row, looked in front of him towards Brady street, have seen nobody, so then decided to kill her. He then took off back towards White's Row, escaping down the street they probably came up (Court), at which point Cross was entering Buck's Row.

[Jon Guy]

I like to think that it wasn't near his place of residence (though concede I may be wrong). I also like the blitz-style attack, but I'm not so sure. Nichols known movements place her further West of the crime scene. It's also clear that she touted for business along Whitechapel road. I get the impression that her plan was to repeatedly wander East along Whitechapel and then back again, only moving off Whitechapel once she was at Osborn Street. I think she met the Ripper whilst she was as far East as she was moving, and they walked to Buck's Row. Notice that the murder took place in front of the gates and not a house. I think that they walked to that point, and the Ripper would have looked behind him towards White's Row, looked in front of him towards Brady street, have seen nobody, so then decided to kill her.

He then took off back towards White's Row, escaping down the street they probably came up (Court), at which point Cross was entering Buck's Row.

Interesting post.
I think that from the Bakers Row/ Whites Row area the Ripper walked up Hanbury Street.
For the obvious reason that a week later and at about that time he was to be found at the top of end of Hanbury Street, where he met Chapman.

[Pcdunn]

As I'm sure you are aware, some would argue that Stride was actually killed by someone other than the Ripper.

Some do, yes. The police of the time thought she was a Ripper victim.