Cleveland Street Scandal Connection?

[Debra A]

Hi Debs/Sam

Talking of another spooky coincidence regarding identical names but different people, the original article mentioned Charles Hammond as the brothel owner, co-incidentally there is another Charles Hammond who I think is the most likely candidate to be the 'seafarer man' suspect mentioned directly after the Nichols murder. I'll post something on the right thread at some point.

That will be interesting, Mr Mr Lucky. I don't think anyone has identified who the seafaring man was before?

[lynn cates]

Good luck.

Hello Pat. Thanks.

Good luck.

Cheers.
LC

[jerryd]

Hi Lynn Yes slight problem with age in 1881 he was said to be born in 1865 so slightly younger. Could be he was an entertainer for the guests?
The young lad said he was introduced by Thomas Conway didnt he?
Do you know what is known about the said Thomas? I did see he became a female impersonator.
His address was no 2 Cleveland street, do you know what number the scandal was at ?

I did find Catherine Eddowes son in all the census and could not see any connection.
One point, I have known of others that were born c1840s in St George the Martyr and all said they were born in Westminster. I think it covered that area at one time....
Pat

I do see a possible connection Paddy. In the 1891 Census, TC Jr. was living at 19 Parker Street, which happens to be .9 miles from 19 Cleveland Street according to google earth (about a 20 minute walk). A major player in the Cleveland Street Scandal, one Jack Saul, claimed his address, in testimony at the Earnest Parke libel case, was 15 Old Compton Road. This address is .8 miles from 19 Cleveland Street. The distance from TC Jr. to Saul is .5 miles. Saul living to the west. About a 10 minute walk. Incidentally, the distance to Mitre Square from 19 Parker Street is 2.1 miles (43 minute walk).

Jack Saul is a dark character in all this. He was not afraid to expose his homosexuality to anyone. He was a self-proclaimed 'Mary Ann', which is a derogatory term for male prostitute usually dressed in woman's clothing. A transvestite so to speak. He was also involved in the Dublin Castle Scandal and was known by the nickname "Dublin Jack". The Dublin Castle Scandal of 1884 involved very much the same type of important men as Cleveland Street including members of Parliament. It makes me wonder if the two scandals together are part of the reason the RIC, Postmaster General and an MP showed up at Mary Kelly's place.

So, yes, Thomas Conway living on #2 Cleveland Street is an obvious potential candidate for our man, but remember, Herbert Ames was pretty matter of fact that in June of 1888, Thomas Conway was 19 years of age. Not about 19 or looked like 19, he said he was 19. For those reasons I still hold to Kate's son having a possibility of being the connection to Cleveland Street.

[jerryd]

My mistake, 1891 does NOT show young Thomas on Parker Street. I apologize but it does have TC Sr. there. Guess I am done posting til I can read.