George William Topping Hutchinson Records

[Lechmere]

And so on to Mile End Road, no. 576 of which thoroughfare Toppy had registered as his, and his good lady wife’s, under the brush address when he got married in May 1898
It is just two doors down from Mile End Tube Station, although this only opened in 1902.
I am slightly sceptical as to whether Toppy actually lived at this address, and if so for how long.
And what do you know – the original property isn’t there! It is a modernish building – now a Paddy Power betting shop (just like the Grave Maurice!) They are getting everywhere.

[Lechmere]

Tonight I was passing through central London and realised it would be a good opportunity to stop off and see if 69 Warren Street is still there (Toppy’s address in 1891).
I pulled in and it is an almost complete street of period property. Brilliant. I pulled in, jumped out and counted the numbers down...
The only building I could see that had been rebuilt was no 69. Typical! Virtually every single building I have ever tried to find has been demolished.
All that can really be determined is that the ‘footprint’ of 69 seems larger than its neighbours. Perhaps because it was a lodging house and the other houses were just houses. It was on the northern side of the street towards the Tottenham Court Road end.

[Malcolm X]

ok lets try again, annoying or what
i am bias towards Hutchinson, but i do have to say that the signatures look similar, but even his own signature looks different from page 2 to 3, because on page 2 he's left out the last G of George, plus no gap between george and hutchinson!

but Signature 3 seals it for me, that is a very close match, only varying slightly due to being nervous, yes i expect GH was probably a nervous wreck whilst writing his signatures

looking again at PAGE 2, that could also be from someone else i suppose, i dont know what went wrong there, but it doesn't really matter because page 3 is so similar to TOPPY below.

this doesn't weaken GH as JTR, just tells me that it was indeed him that was stalking and lurking outside Kelly's, strangely enough it makes him look more guilty!!

what weakens GH, is that he's a Joe Average family guy living in this area ( or close by) all his life, he aint no Chapman, Tumblety etc.

[The Good Michael]

lets compare the signature above to the signature in GH witness statement, the writing in the post above has all been done by GH, because it's all a close match, but this document above does not match the GH witness statement, the G is different and so is the HUTCH part.....

Because it wasn't Hutchinson's signature. It was Sgt Badham's. YOu need to look at the last signature on the statement. It's all on this site if you go back enough, If you are open-minded and have no bias toward Hutchinson either way, you will see that it is one and the same man. I'm afraid you may not see it, however.

Mike

[Malcolm X]

lets compare the signature above to the signature in GH witness statement, the writing in the post above has all been done by GH, because it's all a close match, but this document above does not match the GH witness statement, the G is different and so is the HUTCH part.....

all the other signatures here on this thread have been done by the person filling out the documents, so dont count

in addition and quite a shock to suddenly notice :- the witness signature looks like HEUTCH, that is definitely an E after the H, it looks like he's spelt his name wrong as well !

i've blown it up and marked the E in red, that definitely looks like an E, whatever the case the signatures dont look that similar

[Robert]

Toppy 1911.

[Lechmere]

With Toppy's half brother and a niece

[Robert]

Toppy's dad in 1891 living in Lenham Rd, Lewisham.

[Robert]

Yes Lech, I agree that's the right family.

[Garry Wroe]

Gary I guess you are suggesting that everyone’s handwriting was superficially alike.

Not everyone's, Lechmere, but copybook training certainly appears to have mediated stylistic similarities that I found striking during the years I was researching the archive material.

[Malcolm X]

this GH could indeed be JTR, but he's still around afterwards with no more ripper murders and this is a big problem, plus this guy looks too much like a family man; very much so.

but GH statement is total crap/loaded with anti-semetic comments, and looks very suspicious indeed, so who knows what the hell is going on.

finally, the other Toppy signature thread has been dragging on for ages with nothing really sorted out, so i wish you good luck here !!!!

[Lechmere]

Robert, yes it looks like 11 but if you look closely at the actual document (and my copy) you can see a cross line. George senior’s age look like 24 but it is 44.

Gary I guess you are suggesting that everyone’s handwriting was superficially alike. There is some truth in that but if you take all the renditions of ‘Hutchinson‘ from all the documents so far produced there are very noticeable differences.
For example in the 1871, 1891 and 1901 census, the marriage certificate (not the signature but where it is written above) and the christening form - they do not look similar.

[Robert]

Hi Lech

The 1871 was the one I thought was a bit iffy before. Actually I'm sure it's the right family, but George jnr's age certainly looks like 11, not 4.

[Garry Wroe]

Here's the Toppy entry from post 41:-



Given the similarity between this example and those signatures examined by Frank Leander, is it possible that Toppy went from labourer to plumber to census enumerator?

[Lechmere]

I have seen what I am sure is a misidentification of Toppy’s wifes’ family. I also found this record - of a Florence Jarvis in the 1891 census at 189 Manchester Road, Poplar (actually on the Isle of Dogs). But this Florence’s father was called John (a sawyer) and her mother was called Susan.
As we have seen her parents were William and Clara Jervis and he was a clerk or book keeper.

Robert - you are welcome to post other images up direct!