Hutchinson and antisemitism ?? A possibility?

[FrankO]

Probably because the former really isn't that important. The police weren't after a chronology of a day in the life of George Hutchinson, they wanted a description of the man that was seen with Kelly and how the two of them were behaving together, and on that subject, Hutchinson was very thorough.

I should have expressed myself better, Adam. What I meant was something I wrote in an earlier post: compared to all the relative trouble Hutchinson took, his reason for doing what he did was rather vague and thin.

Like Best & Gardner in Stride’s case, Hutchinson was just surprised to see such a well dressed man in Kelly’s company. Unlike Hutchinson, Best & Gardner didn’t take any action. Lawende’s companion Levy seems to have harbored some unclear suspicions against the couple at the entrance to Mitre Square, but didn’t even take the trouble of looking at them.

If Hutchinson would have felt Kelly was in danger of some sort and had expressed why he felt this way, then it would have been easier to swallow why he did what he did.

I'm not quite sure how wandering the streets all night would indicate that Hutchinson did infact have money?

That's because you overlook a step. Hutchinson tells us that the reason why he walked about all night is that his usual digs was closed. Which infers he went there with money in his pocket to try and get a bed, but found it to be closed.

As for the 3 days....again, it's not a long time, and there could have been any number of perfectly reasonable explanations for this. It's not like he came forward a year later and said "Oh, I just remembered...."

I agree that in general 3 days isn’t particularly long – I believe Mrs. Long in Chapman’s case only came forward after 3 days too.

Hutchinson however isn’t the average witness for reasons I, and others, have mentioned before.

But let’s look at it this way. Hutchinson’s account paints a picture of an upstanding citizen who wants to help the police in catching a killer, right? If you agree, then you’ll probably also agree that it’s a small and logical step to say that he actively watched Kelly’s punter and memorized as much as he could about him for the purpose of doing something good with it when that proved necessary. So, looking at it from this perspective, 3 days is rather long.

Cheers,
Frank

[Fleetwood Mac]

But let’s look at it this way. Hutchinson’s account paints a picture of an upstanding citizen who wants to help the police in catching a killer, right?

Cheers,
Frank

Not necessarily.

Didn't Hutchinson say something like: "I've given Mary money from time to time"? If so - he is certainly putting himself forward as a benevolent man....being suspicious you could argue that he's planting a seed in the minds of the polis....being kind you could argue he's no more of a sad man wanting to be admired.

[FrankO]

Didn't Hutchinson say something like: "I've given Mary money from time to time"? If so - he is certainly putting himself forward as a benevolent man....

Something that might neutralize what you're saying here, at least to some extent, is that this wasn't in the original statement he made. He first made his statement, and was then interrogated by Abberline. During this interrogation he informed Abberline that he had occasionally given her a few shillings, quite possibly in answer to some question.

Cheers,
Frank

[Observer]

Hi Macca

Answer me this, lets suppose Hutchinson was making up the part of his statement where he sees Mary Kelly and Mr A, and there are very good reasons to doubt his story, what was Hutchinson doing standing opposite Millers court very shortly before Mary Kelly's murder?

If we look at his statement he's implying that it was Kelly herself, and the man who had picked her up that led him into Dorset Street. What if this part of his statement is fiction? His reason for being in Dorset Street evaporates. Where does this leave him? It leaves him needing to explain his presence there, he needs to give an alternative reason for being there.

Given the above is what really happened that morning how do you suppose he came to be there? If the above is reality then his presence there is very suspicious indeed. In my opinion suspicious enough to warrant complicity in the murder of Mary Kelly.

Observer

[Fleetwood Mac]

Hi Macca

Answer me this, lets suppose Hutchinson was making up the part of his statement where he sees Mary Kelly and Mr A, and there are very good reasons to doubt his story, what was Hutchinson doing standing opposite Millers court very shortly before Mary Kelly's murder?

If we look at his statement he's implying that it was Kelly herself, and the man who had picked her up that led him into Dorset Street. What if this part of his statement is fiction, his reason for being in Dorset Street evaporates, where does this leave him? It leaves him needing to explain his presence there, he needs to give an alternative reason for being there.

Given the above is what really happened that morning how do you suppose he came to be there? If the above is reality then his presence there is very suspicious indeed, in my opinion suspicious enough to warrant complicity in the murder of Mary Kelly.

Observer

Hi Observer....

Well let's assume he's lying.

There were people who went to the polis shop claiming to be Jack the Ripper.....it isn't inconceivable that Hutchinson wasn't attention seeking too...though stopping short of claiming to be the murderer....just saying he was there for a spot of quick and easy misplaced fame.

Observer - doesn't matter how much you offer plausibles - there are alternative plausibles. Sorry mate - in the queue behind Blotchy and McCarthy. And McCarthy ain't that good a suspect....which tells a story about Hutchinson.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Something that might neutralize what you're saying here, at least to some extent, is that this wasn't in the original statement he made. He first made his statement, and was then interrogated by Abberline. During this interrogation he informed Abberline that he had occasionally given her a few shillings, quite possibly in answer to some question.

Cheers,
Frank

True enough - I have a feeling you may know the question - but if not it could have been: "did you see much of Kelly?"...answer..."yeah now and again and used to give her a few quid from time to time".

And from this you could argue that there aren't many blokes wandering the streets doling out money to acquaintenaces. Which would make him a) telling the truth b) a total fantasist needing some attention c) the killer deliberately misleading the police into thining he was benevolent toward Mary Kelly.

Still leaves us nowhere and doesn't make Hutchinson the prime suspect.

[Observer]

Attention seeking? Are you saying that he was not the man sighted in Dorset street?

[Fleetwood Mac]

Attention seeking? Are you saying that he was not the man sighted in Dorset street?

May not have been...could have read about it and decided to claim it was him.

[Observer]

And how did he do this? He presented himself at the police station before the first edition of the evening papers hit the streets, this has been established by the way.

[Fleetwood Mac]

And how did he do this? He presented himself at the police station before the first edition of the evening papers hit the streets, this has been established by the way.

Established eh? Well that means he's less likely in my eyes....because it would mean he didn't come forward because he knew he'd been seen....so you're relying on the description of the witness matching Hutchinson and something unusual about Hutchinson rendering it likely that it was him.

[Observer]

What about the fact that he realised he's been seen by Sarah Lewis, and knew fine well she would have given evidence at the inquest? In short he knew that he had been seen

[Fleetwood Mac]

What about the fact that he realised he's been seen by Sarah Lewis, and knew fine well she would have given evidence at the inquest? In short he knew that he had been seen

How did he realise he'd been seen then?

[Observer]

Oh come off it. He's standing directly opposite Sarah Lewis no more than 15 feet away peering towards Millers Court, he knew that Lewis observed him.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Oh come off it. He's standing directly opposite Sarah Lewis no more than 15 feet away peering towards Millers Court, he knew that Lewis observed him.

And he knew he'd been seen....so he goes and kills someone? You'd have to be keen on having your life prematurely ended by means of the noose?

[Observer]

Eddowes killer knew full well that he'd been seen by Lawende and company, but he still murdered Eddowes. Elizabeth Long literally walked past Chapman and a man she was talking to very very shortly before her murder, but he still killed her. This killer took risks believe me.