Jacob The Ripper?

[Jimi]

Middlesex Street

Hi All
Hi Glen
If you download Google Earth you can actually see 36 Middlesex Street, it has the old butchers window with the hooks outside and everything!
Only it's not
Apparently, from sources who know these things and divulged to Tracy, 36 Middlesex Street was further along towards where Goulston Street is on Chris's map, but on the other side of the road.
While we don't think it was visible by observers opposite Butchers Row, I have speculated whether it was possible for them to watch from the rear of the premises. I hope somebody with more knowledge of the locale could possibly know?
I don't know whether you know, but Jacobs brother Isaac lived in Wentworth Buildings, Goulston Street, (we never put that in the article)
and didn't Jacob say something about Hyman Sampson from Goulston Street.
We are pleased with the feedback that our article has created and many thanks to all for their time and effort in letting us know.
Kewep Well
Neil

[Steven Russell]

Wasn't Jacob Isenschmid a Jew also even though his records state Church of England? Greg

Hello, Greg.
It certainly sounds like a Jewish name doesn't it? But I believe he must have been a gentile as his nickname was "The mad pork butcher."

Best wishes,
Steve.

[GregBaron]

Spying on butchers...

Hi All
Hi Glen
If you download Google Earth you can actually see 36 Middlesex Street, it has the old butchers window with the hooks outside and everything!
Only it's not
Apparently, from sources who know these things and divulged to Tracy, 36 Middlesex Street was further along towards where Goulston Street is on Chris's map, but on the other side of the road.
While we don't think it was visible by observers opposite Butchers Row, I have speculated whether it was possible for them to watch from the rear of the premises. I hope somebody with more knowledge of the locale could possibly know?
I don't know whether you know, but Jacobs brother Isaac lived in Wentworth Buildings, Goulston Street, (we never put that in the article)
and didn't Jacob say something about Hyman Sampson from Goulston Street.
We are pleased with the feedback that our article has created and many thanks to all for their time and effort in letting us know.
Kewep Well
Neil

Thanks for this. I think I will Google Map it when I get a chance. So your saying that 36 Middlesex has moved right? We have some maps wizzes out here that can probably answer your question.

It certainly sounds like a Jewish name doesn't it? But I believe he must have been a gentile as his nickname was "The mad pork butcher."

Good one Steven. Perhaps he just slaughtered them but didn't feed on them?



Greg

[tji]

[QUOTE]

Hi All
Hi Glen

Lol dad,I think you meant Greg? You really need to see about this insomnia, it's starting to affect your brain

If you download Google Earth you can actually see 36 Middlesex Street, it has the old butchers window with the hooks outside and everything!
Only it's not
Apparently, from sources who know these things and divulged to Tracy, 36 Middlesex Street was further along towards where Goulston Street is on Chris's map, but on the other side of the road.

Yeah, we know 36 Middlesex Street in 1888 was 2 houses before Stoney Lane (We can place it from the census and the Old Bailey records. The 36 Middlesex Street of today isn't the same building. (we were under the assumption it was, there goes any hope for a Jacob Levy diary )

I don't know whether you know, but Jacobs brother Isaac lived in Wentworth Buildings, Goulston Street, (we never put that in the article)
and didn't Jacob say something about Hyman Sampson from Goulston Street.

Hyman Sampson if I remember rightly had a shop in Goulston Street (if my map reading is any good round the same areas as the apron was left, but I am truly crap at map reading so that would need double checking if anyone thought it relevant.)

He left Goulston Street it seems when Wentworth buildings were built and moved to Middlesex Street,(round 84 I think), haven't got my notes handy sorry

We are pleased with the feedback that our article has created and many thanks to all for their time and effort in letting us know.

tj

[lynn cates]

Swiss

Hello Greg, Steven. JI was Swiss.

Cheers.
LC

[GregBaron]

Swiss Pork Butcher...

Hello Greg, Steven. JI was Swiss.

Cheers.
LC

Thanks Lynn but I'm confused. Does being Swiss preclude one from being Jewish?



Greg

[Scott Nelson]

Pretty much. But it doesn't preclude the holiness of kosher cheese.

[lynn cates]

religion

Hello Greg. It does if one is protestant.

Cheers.
LC

[Jimi]

Jacobs Madness

Hi All
Hi GREG. (Sorry about that.) Insomnia may be a reason but it's no reason to be impolite.
I would like to point out a possible misconceptoin about Jacob. In 1888 Jacob was disturbed but NOT mad. I believe he was perfectly capable of approaching and soliciting the victims, he was capable of commiting these murders and remaining free.
I think this is one of the reasons he is a much more likely suspect than anyone else out there.
If i may Greg, have you read Scott Nelsons excellent dissertation on The Butchers Row suspect.? It has an in depth account of the locale and possible places that were used as vantage points. good stuff.
Keep Well
Neil

[GregBaron]

Further Details...

Pretty much. But it doesn't preclude the holiness of kosher cheese.

Good one Scott. Well done.

Hello Greg. It does if one is protestant.

Good point Lynn. I like that too. But the Swiss are pacifists, surely JI is a dove rather than a hawk...

Hi All
Hi GREG. (Sorry about that.) Insomnia may be a reason but it's no reason to be impolite.
I would like to point out a possible misconceptoin about Jacob. In 1888 Jacob was disturbed but NOT mad. I believe he was perfectly capable of approaching and soliciting the victims, he was capable of commiting these murders and remaining free.
I think this is one of the reasons he is a much more likely suspect than anyone else out there.
If i may Greg, have you read Scott Nelsons excellent dissertation on The Butchers Row suspect.? It has an in depth account of the locale and possible places that were used as vantage points. good stuff.
Keep Well
Neil

No need to apologize Neil. Posts are informal communications so we allow much leeway...

Rob House made the same argument about Koz's potential lucidity which might have allowed for getting away with the crimes. But I understand your point. Even if later severely mad, he had to have some presence of mind at the time of the crimes.

I believe I might have read Scott's dissertation and why I mentioned from memory a Butcher's row suspect. I might like to reread it however. I'll see if I can find it.

By the way, we know the height and weight of this little fellow, were there any other descriptions from his incarceration like coloring etc.?

Also, and I should reread the article, but how long had JL not been involved in his butchering business when the crimes were committed?



Greg

[lynn cates]

wicked

Hello Greg. He thought himself very wicked, according to Mary.

No doubt he was deeply troubled.

Cheers.
LC

[DVV]

I foresee a butchers war coming on the casebook. Jacob vs Jacob. What's the problem with Tomkins ?

[lynn cates]

Levy

Hello David. No, no war. If one bloke did it all, clearly MY Jacob is off the hook, and Levy may be the best of a bad lot.

I began investigating JI simply because I could see a stark difference in Polly and Annie on the one hand, and Liz, Kate and MJ on the other. Kate was most like the first two but with marked forensic differences. Hence, I looked to see who could have killed Polly and Annie but who was dead or off the street by the end of October. Hence, JI.

Tomkins? Problem? Not sure he had one.

Cheers.
LC

[Robert]

As a matter of fact, I have my eye on a butcher who would have been alive at the right time, and wasn't averse to wielding the bayonet :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/dadsarmy/5210.shtml?page=3

[ChrisGeorge]

As a matter of fact, I have my eye on a butcher who would have been alive at the right time, and wasn't averse to wielding the bayonet :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/dadsarmy/5210.shtml?page=3

Ha ha. Very fine, Robert.

Cheers

Chris