The meaning of the GSG wording

[Steven Russell]

Does no-one else think DC Halse's version reliable?

Best wishes,
Steve.

[Stephen Thomas]

I ain't never thought that Okies didn't have no culture.

Nice one, Hunter

And the Okies are not the men to be blamed for nothing

[Hunter]

I ain't never thought that Okies didn't have no culture.

[Tom_Wescott]

The club was generaly referred to as the Berner Street club, or the Commercial Road club, by those connected to it in some way. Of course, I'm not suggesting the killer had to have been connected to it in any way, or that even if he DID know of the coloquial terms applied to the club, that he would assume the investigators would know them all. If his intent was to place blame on the club men, then he must have been disappointed by what he read in the press, yet he made no attempt to communicate to say it wasn't him.

As for double-negatives, of course they reflect education. They do not reflect cunning, cleverness, or street smarts, though. Handwriting also reflects education, and the handwriting of the graffiti and the double-negative stand in contrast to each other. I come from Oklahoma, so if there's one thing I know first hand, it's undereducated people butchering the English language. I'm no Shakespeare, but when you've lived in a culture-free zone most of your life, it's hard for even a semi-educated man such as myself not to get lazy in his speech. But writing is always another thing. I might say 'ain't', but it never occurs for me to write it. If I do, it's intentional.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Hunter]

- but then, what about the rainy conditions that make it impossible to write with chalk? Etc., etc., etc.

I hope you can all understand my thoughts - I think I do myself!
Love
Carol

Hi Carol,

Your thoughts are understood and greatly appreciated. One aspect of the bricks and the rainy night... The lower part of the fascia and wall consisted of hard fired glazed bricks... a kind of water table brick that repelled water. Depending on the wind the fascia would have been protected to some degree by the archway itself.

[Steven Russell]

I expect members just called it The Club or The International or something like that.

Best wishes,
Steve.

[Wickerman]

Hello Tom,

That is an interesting theory. How was the club normally referred to? Would someone say "are you going to the IWMES meeting tonight?" That seems a bit of a mouthfull.

c.d.

Good point, we could look through the Census records for the Official address but I think it was actually known as, International Workers Educational Club. The fact that the members may have been predominantly Jewish is perhaps the reason many are accustomed to prefixing the name with "Jewish".
Other groups also held meetings there, branches of the Socialist League is one example.
It might have been known simply as the Socialist Club?

Jon

[Carol]

Hi Abby and everyone else!

I'm really disappointed that we actually don't know at what height on the wall the graffiti was written! Although from what Wickerman has said then a policeman thought it would have been rubbed off by people's shoulders if it had been written earlier. I've just been checking lengths (shoulder to eyes, shoulder to top of head etc.) and the writer would have been approximately 5'4" (162 cm) tall if he/she was standing at the time of writing. I used myself as the 'pattern' and deducted 2" off my height of 5'10" to make 5'8" as the average height of any man having a shoulder that might have rubbed up against the graffiti.

This is what I think (at the moment!) that 'The Jewes are the men that will not be blamed for nothing' means:

I think it was written in a defiant way - the writer implying that if the Jews are going to be blamed for anything at all, then it will be for something worth blaming them for.

The more I think about it the more I think that JTR didn't write it. For a start, if it was such a wet night and the walls of the archway were even a little wet, then chalk would have been impossible to use. You can't use chalk on a wet surface, it just slips and will refuse to write. This I know from my ill-spent 1950's childhood. So I think the graffiti was already there. BUT had he seen the graffiti there on his way home after the second murder, perhaps while hiding in the shadows of the archway while he got his breath back, thought what a good opportunity to put out a false clue, and laid the piece of apron on the ground for good measure.

One more thing - would someone who had recently murdered two women be in a state of mind to think up a sentence that was intended to implicate the Jewish community AND be able to write it so neatly? Unless he had thought up the sentence earlier and taken a piece of chalk with him, just in case he had the opportunity to write it somewhere - but then, what about the rainy conditions that make it impossible to write with chalk? Etc., etc., etc.

I hope you can all understand my thoughts - I think I do myself!
Love
Carol

[Ben]

Hi all,

If the killer wrote the GSG, he was probably an uneducated son of the east end. This would not preclude him from being intelligent. Many, if not most, serial killers are endowed with more than sufficient intelligence whilst having a working class background and little education.

All the best,
Ben

[c.d.]

Hello Tom,

That is an interesting theory. How was the club normally referred to? Would someone say "are you going to the IWMES meeting tonight?" That seems a bit of a mouthfull.

c.d.

[Malcolm X]

yea you've goofed there Tom

you can not gauge intelligence from that graffito, because this killer definitely is'nt thick, there are many things with regards to all these murders that reflect intelligence.

i used to think this guy was a real thicky, and very devil may care but he isn't...... he understands human nature perfectly

thus, this guy knows he wont get caught and there are many reasons why he wasn't.

the one thing i notice whilst studying him is :- it's so easy to escape detection and the LIZ STRIDE murder is classic, now he would have realised this too.

you cant read anything more into the Graffito other than, does it refer back to Dutfields and why suddenly attack the Jews if he hasn't ever done so before ?

[Wickerman]

.....the writer would have been working in the relative darkness, in a hurry, with one eye over his shoulder, and using chalk on rough dado no less,

I think the complications which you emphasize only exist because you argue it was written at night. Which goes to show that this graffiti was more likely written in daylight and not associated with the crime.

I don't know that proper structuring was his priority, particularly as he utilized a double-negative to appear less intelligent than he almost certainly was (as gauged by he handwriting).

Ouch!, well there's two things wrong with that..
First.. You might have just offended every Cockney member on Casebook by implying their everyday use of the double-negative is reflective of their intelligence.
Second..I'm surprised you think the use of the double-negative is not common place in Cockney speak.

I think you need to suffer through a few episodes of the Eastenders

Regards, Jon S.

[Steven Russell]

Wording

According to DC Halse:

The Juwes are
not the men that will be blamed for
nothing

This version could read as "The Jews will be blamed, and justifiably so." To my mind, this has less of a flavour of "The Jews will not accept the blame for anything" than does the more famous rendering.

Best wishes,
Steve.

[harry]

I see no need for the killer to step inside the doorway,unless it was to do other than just get rid of the apron piece.

[Monty]

Oh come, play fair. The head of the Ripper investigation, in a report about the Ripper murders, is stating that a piece of writing found over the torn apron of a Ripper victim was intended to ‘throw blame upon the Jews’. Now I would think that if Swanson were suggesting it was to blame the Jews for the rise in tea tax, he would have said as much, considering everything else in the report pertained to the Ripper investigation. The fact that he offered no other elucidation means that his comment referred to the Ripper murders.



I wouldn’t dare say you were lying, I just said that what you posted was not true, as in I was in a position to post relevant material to the contrary of what you stated, and I did just that. The fact that Sir Henry’s words came from his book and not the files probably reflects more on the depletion of the files than it does on Henry’s stance, which clearly is that the graffiti was possibly from the killer.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

No Tom.

Swanson could only describe the writing and its meaning, not that its certainly the killers work. That would be irresponsible policing. He said it as it is, writing to point a finger at the Jews. He doesn't say the killer wrote it.

To be honest Tom, you failed to contradict my position. Smith expressed a personal view, in his book. He wouldn't have laid it down in an official report as it was, and still is, not ascertained fact.

All you did was highlight personal belief of some Officers (which I won't argue with) but present nothing to prove my words are indeed untrue.

So I stand by them.

I failed to quote my source, so here it is, taken from Stewart Evans and Keith Skinners resource bible 'The Ultimate Scourcebook'.

In there you will see that there is no ascertained connection or belief that the killer wrote the wall writing until you reach the very final report on the file, written by Moore on 18th October 1896. He states-

"...it will be remembered that they are practically the same words that were written in chalk, undoubtedly by the murderer, on a wall in Goulston Street"

Monty