Astrology and Ripperology

[The Good Michael]

I must say it is refreshing to see a discussion on astrology enter its fourth page without anyone mentioning Uranus.

...but then someone did!

I was thinking that Uranus must be the deep, dark root of all astrology.


Han Bong Soo

[Doctor X]

There was a Korean-American Society at university where they did a "banquet" of it--produced at our home.

My toes did curl. Very good though.

Often best not to know how things are made!

So, have I missed any positive arguments for astrology, or are proponents still raving about what a MEANIE I am?

Yours strenuously,

--J.D.

[Doctor X]

I was thinking that Uranus must be the deep, dark root of all astrology.

. . . surrounded by Klingons. . . .

Yours whimsically,

--J.D.

[Vigilantee]

>You cannot fit the disproven into irrelevant ignorance. [What?--Ed.] That physicists have not created a "theory of everything" or know how quantum works with special relativity . . . that ignorance . . . does not make my claim >of being Nicole Kidman's Snuggle-Bunny possible!

The only thing that 'makes' this possible as you put it, is that in another possible world Kidman is nuts and hetrosexual and calls u 'snuggle bunny'.

[Doctor X]

Writing of Klingons. . . .

Yours hygienically,

--J.D.

[Vigilantee]

of course that does not imply Kidman is not heterosexual in the real world as that would logically imply Tom Cruise was gay, and we know thats impossible!

[Doctor X]

Perhaps a bidet would help?

Yours conscientiously,

--J.D.

[Blackkat]

Doctor X:

I do think there is a drastic difference in stating why you think astrology is a bunch of crap, and insulting a posters intelligence. There is no need to insult or offend anyone, by simply stating your point of view. You however were a bit rude. Crime? no not around here, and as you can see no one else is going to call you out for being an ass. To each their own, but ruining a posters thread is MUCH different than joining the thread to throw in your two cents. I'm sure I'm not ignorant as you suggested. However we do speak of that which we know, and so I'm sure you are speaking from experience - "To be ignorant of one's ignorance is the malady of the ignorant."

"He was like a c**k who thought the sun had risen to hear him crow."

"Arrogance and rudeness are training wheels on the bicycle of life -- for weak people who cannot keep their balance without them."



~click~

[Doctor X]

I do think there is a drastic difference in stating why you think astrology is a bunch of crap, and insulting a posters intelligence.

Then that remains your error, an error you are always free to correct.

There is no need to insult or offend anyone, by simply stating your point of view.

It is not a "point of view;" it is reality. Unfortunately, if you find reality "insulting" you will not avoid being "insulted," in your mind, when you insist on ignoring it.

You would have done better to have read the evidence than whine and protest about it.

"Can't help fools."

Yours truly,

--J.D.

[bolo]

Live and let live.

I'm not a supporter or follower of popular astrology and housewife esoterics (or many other belief systems for that matter) at all but somehow I just can't bring myself to fighting over it, I find that rather unproductive.

[Doctor X]

Then why comment?

Yours truly,

--J.D.

[Christine]

The problem I have with astrology is that there's no known method of its action (like gravitational influence, which was mentioned above), it has failed every single controlled test ever devised, and people still try to tell you that if you don't take it seriously it's a sign you have a closed mind.

Believing in things just because they are cool and have an interesting history is not a good way to plan your life. People are actually harmed from these false beliefs...if you don't believe me, I suggest you read through this woman's blog. And you want an astrology specific example, imagine an astrologer casting charts on murder suspects and pointing to the one he thinks is most likely.

[Doctor X]

Indeed, indeed, indeed!

--J.D.

[23Skidoo]

Ok a few points about Astrology first folks.

Astrology is not fatalistic or deterministic, it merely inclines probablistically. The symbolism is also multivalent, by which I mean the same symbol can mean (a limited number of) different things depending on context. While some still seem to believe it causally effects people (whether by gravitation or electromagnetism) this has been shown to be very unlikely, and it also only applies to a narrow range of astrology (astrologers can not only do natal charts, they can do charts of events and even charts of abstractions such as questions, in fact anything existing in time).

Many people now regard astrology as not causal but rather indicative that divination is based on random events that are patterned by certain universal influences that can synchronise them with other random events, hence we read a random pattern of tea leaves and relate it to another random set of events (a live experience).

Planetary cycles are a little less random, but are still rooted in the random event that set up the solar system and so are essentially the same (like a cascade of dominos that keep falling after an initial random event, creating a near permanent act of divination). They differ only in implying a determined cyclic pattern to events, but given the multivalency of the symbols the event series is not fatalistic but rather is a kind of tidal flow (and one that humans can influence through free will). Thus physical events, divinatory signs and astrological aspects are parallel 'random' events with an unknown, acausal, mutual determinate. A kind of non local holographic effect, in which the random subsystems of the cosmos all reflect the same meaningful patterning that influences the cosmos as a whole.

An anecdote might make some of that clearer. A Roman general attempted to kill the Emperor but failed. His astrologer told him he had a good chance of escape, but must travel overland seated on a barrel of water. This was because the chart indicated a risky escape over water, with an uncertain chance of success. It was reasoned that the Emperor's astrologers would read the same signs and conclude an escape by boat into which they would advise all resources focused. The general thus escaped. That probably was an apocryphal tale but is used to teach the principles.

ANYWAY I didn't intend to argue about astrology but rather with it. So I shall continue. Here's some details of an allegedly successful look at serial killers using astrology

http://www.astrologyresearchjournal.org/article82702_1/

And

'Serial killers can be identified through a person's astrological birth chart.

A recent episode of the television program, Unsolved Mysteries, profiled a segment concerning an experiment in astrology. The producers of the show had twenty astrological birth charts from people at random. Included with the twenty astrological charts, the producers put the astrological charts of four serial killers: Jeffrey Dahmer, David Son of Sam Berkowitz, David the Night Stalker Ramirez, and Ed Kemper. These astrological charts were given to Carolyn Reynolds, a well-known astrologer, to see if she can glean any information from them. Without knowing the identity of the people whose charts she was analyzing, Carolyn Reynolds successfully identified the four people as possible serial killers. She was also able to give other specific information about these serial killers that proved correct. She was able to do all this just by analyzing their astrological birth chart.

A similar experiment was done by other people with a different set of people and a different group of serial killers. The astrologer who evaluated their birth charts without knowing who they were, was Edna Rowland, another professional astrologer. They came up with similar results and published their findings in a book entitled, Destined for Murder: Profiles of Six Serial Killers With Astrological Commentary'.

Haven't explored any of this myself, but include it for interest. I shall attempt to find some serial killer charts and have a look.

In the meantime I'm going to create a webpage with the murder and victim charts on. Hopefully finishing sometime later tonite.

23

[23Skidoo]

Dr X mentioned dowsing for the Ripper, thats not as daft as he intended it to be, the US Military dowsed for mines quite successfully during the Vietnam War, and the British Army used map dowsing to successfully locate IRA explosive dumps. The trouble is you need a physical 'signature' like a piece of explosive to 'tune into' to get this to work. So that might be difficult with Jack, maybe a bit of leather apron might help, or a genuine letter.

Again the principle is all similar structures resonate in some way, and random patterns resonate to a dominate influence, like sand on a drum skin.