Nicola Bulley, what does everybody think?

[JeffHamm]

Hmm, but so many circumstances appeared to speak against suicide, especially a planned suicide. An autopsy might clarify things, or even add to the mystery?

Yes, nothing is ruled out completely until the autopsy, but it is looking more planned based on the incomplete information we have. But incomplete is incomplete, and if the autopsy does find evidence of suspicious injuries then once again I will change my personal evaluation.

Yes, and I'm surprised how many media outlets refer to that bench as "her last known location", or "the last place she was seen", yet she was never seen by that bench by anyone, at anytime.

Yes, I agree. The last place I am aware she was seen is in a field some distance away. I was thinking that would be an important search location if there was foul play I am sure the police did search that location, I just haven't seen any papers mention it.

That's another point the police are going to be crucified for.
Unless it's eventual putrefaction has caused it to surface?

Bodies in water eventually fill will gas as early decomposition progresses, which brings them to the surface.

Ok, so if she did commit suicide, why leave the phone on the bench?
If she was the type of person to be overly concerned about trivia, I might expect her to tie the dog up to prevent it following her, but it was loose.
This case still has questions to resolve, maybe the autopsy will provide some answers.

I suppose she could have tied the dog up and it eventually got loose. Leaving the phone might have been to help locate her (if she entered there and somehow drifted as far as she did), or she may have left it as she didn't want to hear familiar work voices as she made her last walk? We will never truly know. Of course, if it turns out there was foul play, a lot of other explanations arise

The whole thing is a sad affair, can you imagine what the father is going to tell the girls?

I can't imagine. No matter the final outcome of the autopsy it is a tragedy for them all.

- Jeff

[Dickere]

Here in UK, we use the term post-mortem, not autopsy.

[Aethelwulf]

Thanks, yes, there is a weir in the small town where I grew up, the flow over the top is never deep. That's the whole point, to slow the river down or even stop it if there's a mill built beside the river, as was the case in our town. The weir acted like a dam while the mill was in operation, when the mill gate was closed the water would flow over the weir barely an inch or so deep. Unless it was thaw season, or a major storm - neither are the case in this mystery.
Lots of rubbish collect at the weir, objects too heavy to flow over in shallow water, they just get caught there or sink to the bottom over time.
Maybe the rise you mention was sufficient to lift the body up, and over?

There has also been a trend of increasingly high tides this week. It's a range of around 3m at the coast but it'll be quite a bit less than that 10 miles inland. Maybe the small rainfall peak and higher tides have been enough to mover her.

[Darryl Kenyon]

I still feel that the dog could have ran off chasing another animal , Nicola put the phone down in a second panicking followed Willow further downstream lost sight of him and slipped off the river bank while looking perhaps injuring herself as she did.

Regards Darryl

[caz]

Your opinion Caz, and one I wager is based on limited knowledge of Nicola Bulley’s full personal circumstance, and includes her family who are also impacted.

Yes, grossly unfair and, more importantly, incorrect.

Misogyny runs through all of society, to point a finger at one organisation shows a lack of comprehension of that fact. We see it in Westminster, in the work place, here, everywhere, including the police. However to only draw focus on the latter kinda smacks of the blinkered and simplistic agenda ministers would rather the public adopt than the bigger picture in all of this.

If the personal information was withheld to come out at a later stage (which, according to her family, would happen via unscrupulous profiteers), I feel the criticism would have been as equally vehement.

Damed if you do…

Monty

Apologies, Monty, my post was insensitive. That poor family - I can't imagine what they must be going through. They did say that Nicola would not have wanted that much detail about her personal life to be made public, but it was arguably better coming from the police than from trolls on social media. I still feel mistakes were made over how much was revealed and when - both about Nicola herself and the direction the investigation was going from the outset, which only seemed to make the rampant speculation worse. It was never going to help find Nicola, safe or otherwise. A mother with young children and a strong swimmer, walking the family dog by a slow-moving river suddenly vanished for no apparent reason, and the police, while keeping an open mind, initially said they favoured an accident over a voluntary disappearing act, or anyone else being involved. They also said that Nicola had no health concerns. Many people, including the family, were naturally sceptical about an accidental drowning, which may have been why the police felt obliged to reveal the possibility of suicide, due to her being classed as high risk from the start.

The dive search team were only looking in the water itself, as their speciality, while the police were also searching by the river banks and elsewhere in the general area. I have no criticism of either group, as the discovery of a body yesterday by a pair of dog walkers does in no way imply it would have been in the same place all along, or easy to find any sooner.

I do take your point about misogyny running through all of society, but one more wrong does not make a right, and it's no comfort to know that the police can at times be as susceptible to it as any other section of the community. It was not my intention to single out the police as worse than anyone else in the way they deal with vulnerable women, but this case does invite many people in higher places - not just meddlesome ratbags like me - to make a few 'could do better in future' noises, in the way sensitive cases like this one are handled. The police cannot be expected to control unfettered speculation on social media, but there are always lessons to learn about how best to react to it.

Hope you are safe and well, Monty.

Love,

Caz
X

[caz]

Press conference due to be held by Lancashire Police at 5.30 today - an hour from now.

Love,

Caz
X

[Ms Diddles]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/feb/20/nicola-bulley-identified-as-body-recovered-from-lancashire-river?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

I guess that once it was announced that a body had been found, this was pretty much inevitable.

Bloody shame.

The family have revealed that Sky and ITV had both tried to contact them directly after it was announced that a body had been found.

Their statement takes no prisoners.

Quite rightly so.

[Monty]

Apologies, Monty, my post was insensitive. That poor family - I can't imagine what they must be going through. They did say that Nicola would not have wanted that much detail about her personal life to be made public, but it was arguably better coming from the police than from trolls on social media. I still feel mistakes were made over how much was revealed and when - both about Nicola herself and the direction the investigation was going from the outset, which only seemed to make the rampant speculation worse. It was never going to help find Nicola, safe or otherwise. A mother with young children and a strong swimmer, walking the family dog by a slow-moving river suddenly vanished for no apparent reason, and the police, while keeping an open mind, initially said they favoured an accident over a voluntary disappearing act, or anyone else being involved. They also said that Nicola had no health concerns. Many people, including the family, were naturally sceptical about an accidental drowning, which may have been why the police felt obliged to reveal the possibility of suicide, due to her being classed as high risk from the start.

The dive search team were only looking in the water itself, as their speciality, while the police were also searching by the river banks and elsewhere in the general area. I have no criticism of either group, as the discovery of a body yesterday by a pair of dog walkers does in no way imply it would have been in the same place all along, or easy to find any sooner.

I do take your point about misogyny running through all of society, but one more wrong does not make a right, and it's no comfort to know that the police can at times be as susceptible to it as any other section of the community. It was not my intention to single out the police as worse than anyone else in the way they deal with vulnerable women, but this case does invite many people in higher places - not just meddlesome ratbags like me - to make a few 'could do better in future' noises, in the way sensitive cases like this one are handled. The police cannot be expected to control unfettered speculation on social media, but there are always lessons to learn about how best to react to it.

Hope you are safe and well, Monty.

Love,

Caz
X

Apologies not needed Caz,

It’s been a terrible few weeks for the family, who should be the main focus.

If we should take anything from this it is not to take anything for granted, cherish loved ones and just be considerate to all.

God knows the world can be a bad enough place as it is, however we can all do better in making it a little more brighter.

x

[Wickerman]

Here in UK, we use the term post-mortem, not autopsy.

Yes you do, the trouble I find with that is, any investigation on that body whether it be limited to the fingernails or the entire corpse, is called a post-mortem, there's no difference in terminology. Whereas Autopsy means the one final authoritative investigation, as opposed to a simple post-mortem.

[Wickerman]

This gets worse....now psychic/medium says he led police to Nicola's body?

https://www.newsnow.co.uk/h/UK/Nicola+Bulley

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/medium-who-found-nicola-bulleys-29267880

[caz]

Apologies not needed Caz,

It’s been a terrible few weeks for the family, who should be the main focus.

If we should take anything from this it is not to take anything for granted, cherish loved ones and just be considerate to all.

God knows the world can be a bad enough place as it is, however we can all do better in making it a little more brighter.

x

Nice one, Monty.

As far as not taking anything for granted goes, I was disappointed by a crass, poorly worded comment by the presenter of the itv news last evening, to the effect that at least Nicola's family now know what happened to her - which takes no account of how she ended up in the river, and is yet to be established by the coroner, assuming that will even be possible after this length of time.

Love,

Caz
X

[JeffHamm]

I still feel that the dog could have ran off chasing another animal , Nicola put the phone down in a second panicking followed Willow further downstream lost sight of him and slipped off the river bank while looking perhaps injuring herself as she did.

Regards Darryl

That is entirely possible, though one would expect a fall to place her very near the edge of the river, in which case she wouldn't be expected to move from there as the flow in the shallow edge area wouldn't be enough to move her. However, if the river is like a cannal, and is very deep right at the edge, that would be a different story and make your suggestion well worth considering further. It all comes down to the specifics of the river. - Jeff

[Pcdunn]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/20/uk/uk-nicola-bulley-body-identified-intl/index.html

From CNN website: Confirmation of body's identity as missing mother Nicola Bulley by authorities, family statement blames "armchair detectives" and public speculation.

Such a sad accidental fatality.

[JeffHamm]

That is entirely possible, though one would expect a fall to place her very near the edge of the river, in which case she wouldn't be expected to move from there as the flow in the shallow edge area wouldn't be enough to move her. However, if the river is like a cannal, and is very deep right at the edge, that would be a different story and make your suggestion well worth considering further. It all comes down to the specifics of the river. - Jeff

Also, of course, there would be signs of a head injury as for this scenario she has to have been unconcious after the fall And if there are such signs, they have to differentiate that from foul play. There will be lots of horrible things for the family to still go through, no matter what path gets followed

- Jeff

[Abby Normal]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/20/uk/uk...ntl/index.html

From CNN website: Confirmation of body's identity as missing mother Nicola Bulley by authorities, family statement blames "armchair detectives" and public speculation.

Such a sad accidental fatality.

accidental? I dont think we know enough at this point do we?