Dyatlov Pass incident

[Herlock Sholmes]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I just one-clicked 1079, Kindle Version so I'll give it a go as well.

No problem Filby It’s not what you’d call a ‘light read’ and I don’t know what his theory is but you certainly get a level of confidence that he’s got his facts researched properly.

[Ms Diddles]

It’s a wonder the Soviets ever achieved anything after they had to go through 7 committees, write 3 reports to various authorities and then wait for responses from the Communist Party before they could open a cupboard! You’re certainly not a thicko Ms D it’s just the way that the book is written. More like a textbook or manual rather than a book to engage a reader who hasn’t spent 20 years researching the subject night and day. It needed the manuscript to have been sent to an English speaking non-expert first.

One thing though, when you read about an aspect of the case, like the discovery of the tent or the contents, and it conflicts with something you’ve read in another book I’m already inclined to believe the version in this book.

That's very true!

The research is painstakingly thorough (or one could say painfully thorough!!!!).

I'm closing in on the big denouement and will finish it tonight.

We've veered off into rather more speculative territory now.

I'll not say too much as I don't want to spoil it for you, Barn and Filby.

I'm going to make a prediction here though.

I predict that by page 200+ you are going to be tearing your hair out trying to keep up with all the weird Soviet protocols and bureaucracy.

It was driving me mad last night.

Perhaps it's just me, but I had to keep jump-starting my brain three or four times each paragraph to be able to follow it.

Intriguing and infuriating!

[Ms Diddles]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I just one-clicked 1079, Kindle Version so I'll give it a go as well.

Nice one, Filby!

Let us know what you think when you've read it!

[barnflatwyngarde]

Hi Herlock,

Yep, I would totally concur with your assessment.

I'm on page 215, and I'll warn you that the stodginess continues (and perhaps even increases!), sorry!

There are some fascinating nuggets in there though, so stick with it.

I fear that when I get to the end, I may need to re-read certain bits, as I'm not sure I've really absorbed all the information properly (bamboozled by all the strange Soviet infrastructure and bureaucracy etc).

In places the translation doesn't help.

I suspect the issue is that it's a Russian book written for a Russian audience which presupposes a certain level of familiarity with, and insight into, a society which is completely alien to us as westerners.

TBH I was feeling a bit of a thicko reading it, so I'm delighted and relieved that it's not just me!!!

barnflatwyngarde - How are you getting on with it too?

Hi Ms D, I was a bit late in starting the book, but I'm well into it now.

The authors have clearly attempted to make this book he definitive one on the Dyatlov Pass mystery, the amount of detail is very extensive.
I decided to heed the authors' advice and skip the indented paragraphs.

The one thing that does strike me so far is the fact that there were tensions within the group from the very beginning of the trek.
I have read several books about the case and I don't really remember these tensions being highlighted before, although that may be my faulty recollection.

The trek they were attempting was a brutal one, and I'll be interested if the tensions within the group resurface as the conditions become more challenging.

I'm enjoying it so far.

[barnflatwyngarde]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I just one-clicked 1079, Kindle Version so I'll give it a go as well.

Welcome aboard Filby!

I'll be interested to hear your views about the book.

[Ms Diddles]

Hi Ms D, I was a bit late in starting the book, but I'm well into it now.

The authors have clearly attempted to make this book he definitive one on the Dyatlov Pass mystery, the amount of detail is very extensive.
I decided to heed the authors' advice and skip the indented paragraphs.

The one thing that does strike me so far is the fact that there were tensions within the group from the very beginning of the trek.
I have read several books about the case and I don't really remember these tensions being highlighted before, although that may be my faulty recollection.

The trek they were attempting was a brutal one, and I'll be interested if the tensions within the group resurface as the conditions become more challenging.

I'm enjoying it so far.

Hi Barn!

Glad you're enjoying the book too.

I do recall reading that prior to the trek, Zina had recently split up with Yuri Doroshenko, but I had never seen her various letters to friends before.

It's not touched on in this particular book, but I have read elsewhere that her photograph was found in Dyatlov's wallet when all the belongings were audited, so there was some kind of intrigue going on there.

I also didn't realise that Dyatlov was regarded a bit of an autocrat, or that Aleksander Kolevatov was quite unpopular among the other students.

It certainly all gives an interesting insight into the group dynamic!

[Herlock Sholmes]

Another quibble is the lack of an index.

[Ms Diddles]

Another quibble is the lack of an index.

Agreed!

[Herlock Sholmes]

I think this book might end up at the number two spot on my all time list of ‘hardest to get through books!’

[barnflatwyngarde]

I think this book might end up at the number two spot on my all time list of ‘hardest to get through books!’

I know where you are coming from, and I think that I'm in your tent.

My other difficult book to get through is a Ripper book, but I don't want to upset anyone on these boards by identifying it.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I know where you are coming from, and I think that I'm in your tent.

My other difficult book to get through is a Ripper book, but I don't want to upset anyone on these boards by identifying it.

It’s just a pity that they didn’t take advice before publishing on the books readability. The biog’s that you mentioned within the text would have been better as footnotes for a start and it’s difficult to see how a lot of the information that’s being presented (I’m at page 150 so far) will be relevant in the end so you get the impression of overkill which swamps the reader in an information overload. I’m not for a minute saying that it’s not a worthwhile book (whatever it’s conclusion) because the research appears really detailed. Not enough attention paid to readability though.

My number one btw still gives me nightmares I was having a period of interest in the JFK assassination and I read a book called Best Evidence by David Lifton. 6 or 700 pages I think, of small text all on the premise that Kennedy’s body was operated upon on Airforce One to alter the bullet wounds so as give a false trajectory and so disguise the fact that there were more than one gunman. It was like reading a medical textbook! I stubbornly battled though it; hating every minute of it To de-toxify my brain a had to read PG Wodehouse for a fortnight to bring me back from the brink.

[barnflatwyngarde]

It’s just a pity that they didn’t take advice before publishing on the books readability. The biog’s that you mentioned within the text would have been better as footnotes for a start and it’s difficult to see how a lot of the information that’s being presented (I’m at page 150 so far) will be relevant in the end so you get the impression of overkill which swamps the reader in an information overload. I’m not for a minute saying that it’s not a worthwhile book (whatever it’s conclusion) because the research appears really detailed. Not enough attention paid to readability though.

My number one btw still gives me nightmares I was having a period of interest in the JFK assassination and I read a book called Best Evidence by David Lifton. 6 or 700 pages I think, of small text all on the premise that Kennedy’s body was operated upon on Airforce One to alter the bullet wounds so as give a false trajectory and so disguise the fact that there were more than one gunman. It was like reading a medical textbook! I stubbornly battled though it; hating every minute of it To de-toxify my brain a had to read PG Wodehouse for a fortnight to bring me back from the brink.

That's a coincidence Herlock.

I read Lifton's book for the first time many years ago, and have re-read it several times since. I can still remember the names of the two FBI agents whose testimony forms the basis of the book, agents Sibbert and O'Neill.
Overall I thought that it was an interesting look at one particular aspect of the Kennedy assassination.

If my memory serves me correctly, the term of"best evidence" is an American legal term that refers to the evidence that comes from the state of the body.
If six people say they saw the victim shot from the front, but the wounds on the body say otherwise, then the body evidence trump's everything.

Oops, I'm displaying signs of Liftonesque pedantry.

[Herlock Sholmes]

That's a coincidence Herlock.

I read Lifton's book for the first time many years ago, and have re-read it several times since. I can still remember the names of the two FBI agents whose testimony forms the basis of the book, agents Sibbert and O'Neill.
Overall I thought that it was an interesting look at one particular aspect of the Kennedy assassination.

If my memory serves me correctly, the term of"best evidence" is an American legal term that refers to the evidence that comes from the state of the body.
If six people say they saw the victim shot from the front, but the wounds on the body say otherwise, then the body evidence trump's everything.

Oops, I'm displaying signs of Liftonesque pedantry.

You’ve read it several times?! Barn, there are people who’ve been awarded medals for less. I suppose that it didn’t help that I was reading this during a period of conspiracy-overload. I’d just read Bonar Menninger’s book on the ‘accidental’ fatal shot by a security agent (called Hickey if I remember correctly) so my tolerance levels were low (or lower than usually as some might say)

[Ms Diddles]

It’s just a pity that they didn’t take advice before publishing on the books readability. The biog’s that you mentioned within the text would have been better as footnotes for a start and it’s difficult to see how a lot of the information that’s being presented (I’m at page 150 so far) will be relevant in the end so you get the impression of overkill which swamps the reader in an information overload. I’m not for a minute saying that it’s not a worthwhile book (whatever it’s conclusion) because the research appears really detailed. Not enough attention paid to readability though.

My number one btw still gives me nightmares I was having a period of interest in the JFK assassination and I read a book called Best Evidence by David Lifton. 6 or 700 pages I think, of small text all on the premise that Kennedy’s body was operated upon on Airforce One to alter the bullet wounds so as give a false trajectory and so disguise the fact that there were more than one gunman. It was like reading a medical textbook! I stubbornly battled though it; hating every minute of it To de-toxify my brain a had to read PG Wodehouse for a fortnight to bring me back from the brink.

I finished the book last night!

It was indeed a test of endurance by the end.

I think the issue is that it's just a literal translation of a Russian book, written by a Russian author for a Russian audience.

It could have done with being reformatted and edited for non Russian audiences, with (as you point out) more attention paid to readability and better translation.

I won't say too much until you guys have finished it too, but whilst I get the main thrust of the theory, I fear I have lost many of the relevant details amid the swathes of superfluous stuff.

I should probably go back and re-read certain bits to clarify, but I'll need to psyche myself up for that......

[Herlock Sholmes]

I finished the book last night!

It was indeed a test of endurance by the end.

I think the issue is that it's just a literal translation of a Russian book, written by a Russian author for a Russian audience.

It could have done with being reformatted and edited for non Russian audiences, with (as you point out) more attention paid to readability and better translation.

I won't say too much until you guys have finished it too, but whilst I get the main thrust of the theory, I fear I have lost many of the relevant details amid the swathes of superfluous stuff.

I should probably go back and re-read certain bits to clarify, but I'll need to psyche myself up for that......

Thanks Ms D. I suspected that might be the case just from what I’ve read so far (172 pages) It’s not a book that you could recommend as ‘an enjoyable read.) A real case of ‘too much information,’ most of which could have been kept as footnotes or endnotes.