University of Idaho Stabbings

[Abby Normal]

just read the affidavit. they found a knife sheath with his dna on it lying on the bed next to two of the victims. his car was caught on video around the house the night of the murders. his cell phone records form previous months show he was around the house at least a dozen times.

so no doubt its this guy and he was casing out, at the very least, that residence.

Interestingly, one of the surviving housemates was woken up during, or shortly after the murders and saw him, in a mask, as he walked right past her to make his escape.

[Damaso Marte]

IMO its unclear to me whether the killer walked past her because she locked herself in her room or if he was truly uninterested in killing her.

They had identified this guy as their prime suspect within 1.5 weeks of the murders and tracked him on his cross-country trip back to PA. Police in Indiana literally pulled him over twice at the FBI's request - ostensibly for minor traffic infractions but in reality so that police could check his hands for defensive wounds.

Great police work all around.

[Ally]

I legitimately can't believe this PhD criminologist student left his freaking sheath at the crime scene. Like... dude.

[Abby Normal]

IMO its unclear to me whether the killer walked past her because she locked herself in her room or if he was truly uninterested in killing her.

They had identified this guy as their prime suspect within 1.5 weeks of the murders and tracked him on his cross-country trip back to PA. Police in Indiana literally pulled him over twice at the FBI's request - ostensibly for minor traffic infractions but in reality so that police could check his hands for defensive wounds.

Great police work all around.

agree. stellar police work.

from what i understand he walked right past her as she stood outside her room, frozen in shock and fear. once he was gone she then went back in and locked herself in her room.

but what i dont understand is why it took so long for her to then call police. weird.

[erobitha]

agree. stellar police work.

from what i understand he walked right past her as she stood outside her room, frozen in shock and fear. once he was gone she then went back in and locked herself in her room.

but what i dont understand is why it took so long for her to then call police. weird.

It was mid-day when they called 911. Why so long?

[rjpalmer]

I legitimately can't believe this PhD criminologist student left his freaking sheath at the crime scene. Like... dude.

Possibly a meaningless detail, but Washington State does not have the death penalty; it was abolished four years ago.

Idaho still has the death penalty.

He crossed state lines to commit a horrific quadruple homicide, which guarantees it will be a capital murder case.

[Ally]

It was mid-day when they called 911. Why so long?

I'm going to take a wildly speculative guess and say "college students" "weekend late saturday night" "substances of an intoxicating variety coursing through the blood" leads to not great judgment and possibly confusion as to what they saw/witnessed. They were all up partying until around 4 am. I sincerely doubt they were in the best frame of mind to begin with. I mean it was a notorious party house, with the police being called to their place a few weeks before ... and none of the people who lived there were home, just people partying IN their house, while they weren't home. So apparently having randoms walk through the house would not have been an unusual occurrence.

Possibly a meaningless detail, but Washington State does not have the death penalty; it was abolished four years ago.

Idaho still has the death penalty.

He crossed state lines to commit a horrific quadruple homicide, which guarantees it will be a capital murder case.

I mean having no fear of death personally, I'd rather die than spend 50 years in a state prison, but that's just me. For most people, I imagine it's the opposite, and the sheer stupid of his choice is boggling.

[Abby Normal]

I'm going to take a wildly speculative guess and say "college students" "weekend late saturday night" "substances of an intoxicating variety coursing through the blood" leads to not great judgment and possibly confusion as to what they saw/witnessed. They were all up partying until around 4 am. I sincerely doubt they were in the best frame of mind to begin with. I mean it was a notorious party house, with the police being called to their place a few weeks before ... and none of the people who lived there were home, just people partying IN their house, while they weren't home. So apparently having randoms walk through the house would not have been an unusual occurrence.



I mean having no fear of death personally, I'd rather die than spend 50 years in a state prison, but that's just me. For most people, I imagine it's the opposite, and the sheer stupid of his choice is boggling.

hi Ally
i thought it was only the male murder victim who didnt live there, and he was with his girlfriend. i was under the impression that all the female murder victims as well as the two surviving people all lived there.

however, i see your first point, having two college age kids i do know when they dont have work or school they can easily sleep till noonish, especially when up late the night before partying. still the one surviving roomate came face to face with the masked intruder, and said herself she was shocked and terrified, so she knew something was amiss almost immediately.

[erobitha]

hi Ally
i thought it was only the male murder victim who didnt live there, and he was with his girlfriend. i was under the impression that all the female murder victims as well as the two surviving people all lived there.

however, i see your first point, having two college age kids i do know when they dont have work or school they can easily sleep till noonish, especially when up late the night before partying. still the one surviving roomate came face to face with the masked intruder, and said herself she was shocked and terrified, so she knew something was amiss almost immediately.

My thoughts exactly. By all accounts they were scared enough to lock themselves into their room but also too scared to call 911 until noon?

It just doesn’t add up.

[Ally]

Hi Abby, I am not sure what your question is to be honest. They did all live there (except the boyfriend). My point was, it was a huge party house, and a couple of weeks prior, there had been a huge party there, where the people who did live there... weren't home. Their house had a numeric lock on the door, and loads of people had access to it, so that people could come and go as they please.

I am not saying she wasn't shocked to have a guy in the house at 4 am, but also... it wasn't unusual. So not knowing what was going on, and probably under the influence of things, she probably went back to her room, locked the door and proceeded to sleep off the combined effects of the evening. Considering the people constantly going in and out of the house it wasn't unusual to have randoms in their house, and her first thought probably wasn't "knife wielding murderer". And yes, he was masked ... the lower part of his face. Like a covid mask. I can see a lot of ways a not so bright, sleep-deprived, possibly inebriated person could rationalize that there was nothing "wrong-wrong" when people were constantly walking in and out of their house because they gave out the key code to everyone and their second cousin.

[Abby Normal]

Hi Abby, I am not sure what your question is to be honest. They did all live there (except the boyfriend). My point was, it was a huge party house, and a couple of weeks prior, there had been a huge party there, where the people who did live there... weren't home. Their house had a numeric lock on the door, and loads of people had access to it, so that people could come and go as they please.

I am not saying she wasn't shocked to have a guy in the house at 4 am, but also... it wasn't unusual. So not knowing what was going on, and probably under the influence of things, she probably went back to her room, locked the door and proceeded to sleep off the combined effects of the evening. Considering the people constantly going in and out of the house it wasn't unusual to have randoms in their house, and her first thought probably wasn't "knife wielding murderer". And yes, he was masked ... the lower part of his face. Like a covid mask. I can see a lot of ways a not so bright, sleep-deprived, possibly inebriated person could rationalize that there was nothing "wrong-wrong" when people were constantly walking in and out of their house because they gave out the key code to everyone and their second cousin.

got it. i misunderstood you..I thought you were talking about the night of the murder when you said none of the people lived there. and i thought he was wearing a ski mask. my bad.

however she did say she was frozen in shock as he walked by, so it sounds like she knew something was very amiss. but i see your point. maybe at the time she was shocked, but had no clue how bad it really was... maybe just shocked that a stranger was in the house, so went back and fell back asleep. and of course, being drunk may have something to do with her behavior too.

[Ally]

... maybe just shocked that a stranger was in the house, so went back and fell back asleep. and of course, being drunk may have something to do with her behavior too.

And of course to take that one step further, he did walk right past her as if he didn't see her. Which everyone views as suspicious, I don't particularly as it's possible that he was in the grip of a massive adrenaline surge, and tunnel vision had him focusing on the door and "escape" having done what he'd come to do. It's entirely possible he never actually saw her. Adrenaline is proven to narrow your field of vision to whatever you are focused on to the exclusion of external factors. I believe it's actually possible he didn't see her, even as he walked right past her. I mean, he forgot his KNIFE SHEATH. Which means he was walking out of there with an unsheathed, bloody knife and didn't seem to grasp that he'd left without what he came in with, which appears to be tunnel "escape once it's over" vision to me.

So she's tired, drunk, possibly high and a guy walks right past her like she's not there. I can totally see her questioning reality and being like...well did that really happen and rationalizing like, "well if he were really a threat, he clearly wouldn't have just ignored me and walked out like nothing, so ... lock the door because regardless she was shocked and scared, but rationalizing it like, well if he had bad intentions, he wouldn't have just ignored me and walked out.

People always think they know how they would respond in these situations. And unless you've ever been in one, you really don't. There is no "normal" response to something like this. There's about 5 dozen normal responses and you don't know what yours will be til you are confronted by it.

[Joshua Rogan]

I've heard reports that his phone pinged outside the house around 9am following the murders, so perhaps he was contemplating going back inside to retrieve the sheath, and/or wondering why the heck the place wasn't covered in cop cars and crime scene tape if he knew he'd been seen.

[Abby Normal]

And of course to take that one step further, he did walk right past her as if he didn't see her. Which everyone views as suspicious, I don't particularly as it's possible that he was in the grip of a massive adrenaline surge, and tunnel vision had him focusing on the door and "escape" having done what he'd come to do. It's entirely possible he never actually saw her. Adrenaline is proven to narrow your field of vision to whatever you are focused on to the exclusion of external factors. I believe it's actually possible he didn't see her, even as he walked right past her. I mean, he forgot his KNIFE SHEATH. Which means he was walking out of there with an unsheathed, bloody knife and didn't seem to grasp that he'd left without what he came in with, which appears to be tunnel "escape once it's over" vision to me.

So she's tired, drunk, possibly high and a guy walks right past her like she's not there. I can totally see her questioning reality and being like...well did that really happen and rationalizing like, "well if he were really a threat, he clearly wouldn't have just ignored me and walked out like nothing, so ... lock the door because regardless she was shocked and scared, but rationalizing it like, well if he had bad intentions, he wouldn't have just ignored me and walked out.

People always think they know how they would respond in these situations. And unless you've ever been in one, you really don't. There is no "normal" response to something like this. There's about 5 dozen normal responses and you don't know what yours will be til you are confronted by it.

totally agree, good talk.

[Abby Normal]

I've heard reports that his phone pinged outside the house around 9am following the murders, so perhaps he was contemplating going back inside to retrieve the sheath, and/or wondering why the heck the place wasn't covered in cop cars and crime scene tape if he knew he'd been seen.

the location if the sheath is interesting because it was found next to the girls on the third floor..so they were probably murdered first, and points to them being targeted.

Im wondering how he could have found out where they lived? it seems he didnt follow them home that night, but drove there after they were already home.

anyone have a clue how he found out where they lived??