John Richardson

[FISHY1118]

The stain on the bricks below the window in the previous pic. shows the outline of a curved canopy that covered the cellar steps - something like this.

Firstly thats not the canopy that was there in 1888 ,as we have two contemporary illustrations/ Drawing that show something much smaller and more open and easier to see under to check a lock.

Also that photo is roughly 75 years after the murder , those marks on the wall could have been made by one or even two previous style canopies , you need to provide evidence those marks were made by the canopy that was There in 1888

[FISHY1118]

There is a simple explanation Richardson gave his evidence on day 2 of the inquest after giving his evidence and his recovery of the knife he would no doubt have been released by the coroner which meant he could leave the proceedings

Chandler gave his evidence on day 3 and so would not have been privy to what Richardson had said on day two. That is why we have the question asked of him about Richardson's movements.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Good point.

[FISHY1118]

Why would Richardson need to walk down the house steps and over to the cellar steps in the yard ?, if by his own testimony he said this to the coroner .

Daily News
United Kingdom
13 September 1888


[Coroner,] Did you go into the yard at all?-Not at all, sir.!!!!!!!!!!!

I thought you went there to see that the cellar was all right?- [Richardson] Yes; ''but you don't need to go into the yard'' to see that. You can ''see the padlock'' of the cellar door ''from the back door steps.''!!!!!!!!!!



Now look again what the coroner says after he ask Richardson ''did you go into the yard'' ? ''No sir '' , i thought you went there to see the cellar was ok ?

His telling Richardson that in his opinion the cellar door is in the yard ! . Richardson then confirms this to the the coroner with his next statement, he very well knows the cellar is in fact in the yard, thats why he told the coroner ''but you don't need to go into the yard'' to see that.
.

So Wick, Has not Richardson told the Coroner one thing and done another ?[what you have suggested] Is this not the very essence of what myself and others have been saying about witness testimony being uncertain , unreliable ,ambiguious and unsafe to rely on to confirm an accurate t.o.d one way or the other ?

Richardson did not go into the yard , he did not walk down the back door steps face the cellar door and then look at the lock .

To suggest otherwise is ridiculous .

[GBinOz]

It certainly is an eye opener reading the different interpretations of the perceived meanings of what was said. Looking at the photo provided by Hair Bear, I would have said that the woman is standing in the house and the man is standing on the top step. But that is not how Richardson described the steps.

Daily News 13 Sep:
Did you go into the yard at all?-Not at all, sir.

I thought you went there to see that the cellar was all right?-Yes; but you don't need to go into the yard to see that. You can see the padlock of the cellar door from the back door steps.

And that was the sole object you had in going there?-Yes, sir.

Did you sit on the top step?-No, the second step.

The first three lines are what he told Chandler and the press on the day, and is definitive. He didn't go into the yard at all because his regular and repetitive task of checking the lock could be achieved from the back door steps. If that was not possible because of the cellar cover, then both he and his mother were lying. If that was "the sole object he had in going there", then he would have only to have opened the door, put one or both feet on the major step and crouched down while steadying his balance using the door and the door jamb. He would have had his back towards the body with the door in between.

The last line is, IMO, an augmentation that was "recalled' two days after the event.

JMO.

Cheers, George

[GBinOz]

I think that religious mania would be on the part of the killer, not his mother. Not that I think that would be a factor either way in this case.

Hi LC,

I might raise the example of Deeming, whose mother was intensely religious and impressed those beliefs onto the young Frederick to the point where even after her death her ghost was instructing him in his murderous pursuits.

Cheers, George

[GBinOz]

The stain on the bricks below the window in the previous pic. shows the outline of a curved canopy that covered the cellar steps - something like this.

Hi Jon,

The yard end of that canopy seems to be somewhat low to be allowing entry in an upright position? Unless of course the cellar steps extended a lot further into the yard.

Cheers, George

[FISHY1118]

It certainly is an eye opener reading the different interpretations of the perceived meanings of what was said. Looking at the photo provided by Hair Bear, I would have said that the woman is standing in the house and the man is standing on the top step. But that is not how Richardson described the steps.

Daily News 13 Sep:
Did you go into the yard at all?-Not at all, sir.

I thought you went there to see that the cellar was all right?-Yes; but you don't need to go into the yard to see that. You can see the padlock of the cellar door from the back door steps.

And that was the sole object you had in going there?-Yes, sir.

Did you sit on the top step?-No, the second step.

The first three lines are what he told Chandler and the press on the day, and is definitive. He didn't go into the yard at all because his regular and repetitive task of checking the lock could be achieved from the back door steps. If that was not possible because of the cellar cover, then both he and his mother were lying. If that was "the sole object he had in going there", then he would have only to have opened the door, put one or both feet on the major step and crouched down while steadying his balance using the door and the door jamb. He would have had his back towards the body with the door in between.

The last line is, IMO, an augmentation that was "recalled' two days after the event.

JMO.

Cheers, George

Exactly George , There can be no mistake what Richardsons intentions were that morning , the coroner makes it abundantly clear when he asked "Was that your sole intention?" Richardson replied "yes"

Cross reference that with what Chandler told the inquest.

Richardson told him he came to the back door to check the cellar lock then went to work. Bingo.

Game over.

[FISHY1118]

It certainly is an eye opener reading the different interpretations of the perceived meanings of what was said. Looking at the photo provided by Hair Bear, I would have said that the woman is standing in the house and the man is standing on the top step. But that is not how Richardson described the steps.

Daily News 13 Sep:
Did you go into the yard at all?-Not at all, sir.

I thought you went there to see that the cellar was all right?-Yes; but you don't need to go into the yard to see that. You can see the padlock of the cellar door from the back door steps.

And that was the sole object you had in going there?-Yes, sir.

Did you sit on the top step?-No, the second step.

The first three lines are what he told Chandler and the press on the day, and is definitive. He didn't go into the yard at all because his regular and repetitive task of checking the lock could be achieved from the back door steps. If that was not possible because of the cellar cover, then both he and his mother were lying. If that was "the sole object he had in going there", then he would have only to have opened the door, put one or both feet on the major step and crouched down while steadying his balance using the door and the door jamb. He would have had his back towards the body with the door in between.

The last line is, IMO, an augmentation that was "recalled' two days after the event.

JMO.

Cheers, George

I agree with you on this point also George ,the women isn't on any step ,she's standing on the floor of the house. The man is standing on the first step of two .

[GBinOz]

I agree with you on this point also George ,the women isn't on any step ,she's standing on the floor of the house. The man is standing on the first step of two .

Hi Fishy,

That bottom step may have even been level with the flagging. Working on the definition of a step as being a means of passing from one level to another, then it could be considered that there was only one step to allow the changing of level from flagging to floor boards. Or to me, at least.

Cheers, George

[Wickerman]

...

In short, that rough orange region is the only location that is consistent with all of the various descriptions we have of where Richardson was when he viewed the lock, it removes the issue of how he could see it with the canopy, it is consistent with his statement that he "did not go out into the yard", and him standing there easily flows into him sitting on the middle step with his feet on the flagstones.

Remember, the idea is to try to make sense of the information we have rather than finding ways to make the information we have look like nonsense.




- Jeff

Thankyou Jeff, explained admirably.

[Lewis C]

Hi LC,

I might raise the example of Deeming, whose mother was intensely religious and impressed those beliefs onto the young Frederick to the point where even after her death her ghost was instructing him in his murderous pursuits.

Cheers, George

That's interesting George, I hadn't heard that before.

[FISHY1118]

Thankyou Jeff, explained admirably.

Except that Richardson own testimony says he did nothing of the sort.

[Wickerman]

Firstly thats not the canopy that was there in 1888 ....

Really?



The contemporary sketch above shows a canopy too high, it obscures the kitchen window.
Whereas we can see in the photo's the stain on the bricks where the curved canopy was attached to the house.

[Wickerman]

Except that Richardson own testimony says he did nothing of the sort.

It isn't his testimony, it is the paraphrase from the reporters present.
We have to sort out what they meant, not what Richardson meant.

The Daily News report of Chandler's testimony provides the most clear example of Richardson's testimony.

Chandler said:
"Witness (Richardson) told him that he did not go to the bottom of the steps leading to the cellar. He went to the top, and looked down."

[Wickerman]

Hi Jon,

The yard end of that canopy seems to be somewhat low to be allowing entry in an upright position? Unless of course the cellar steps extended a lot further into the yard.

Cheers, George

George, the steps must begin under the board with the hole in it.
I wasn't trying to be technically correct, but only show general location for the canopy.