What EXACTLY did Maurice Lewis say?

[packers stem]

Hi
Pitch and Toss was an illegal game, and I find it hard to fathom that McCarthy would have allowed that to happen on his property.
I believe that Maurice Lewis somewhat confirms the story of women drinking in Ringers, when someone wanted Kelly to come out.
Was Mary Kelly alive that morning in daylight hours.?
Regards Richard.

I really don't think McCarthy would give a rats a**e who was playing pitch and toss and where .... may have asked for a cut though 😁
And anyway , no reason for Lewis to make that up .

[packers stem]

times too tight for Maurice lewis and Maxwell to have been correct IMHO

Why ?
You're presuming the person known as Mary Kelly was killed in 13 rather than the obvious options .
Look at the facts first then worry about the scenario .
The facts suggest that she was alive and well up until 10am
The Bond report suggests a body was found with partly digested fish and chips from the night before (1 to 3 hours digestion time) ..... so rough TOD according to bond between 1 and 4 .
This isn't difficult to work out

[Abby Normal]

Maxwell didn't confuse Kelly with Albrook ,Prater or anybody else for crying out loud .In press interviews she gave on the 9th (Daily news of the 10th amongst others ) she stated "I believe she was of Limerick" ...... should be no doubt whatsoever

No confusion for Maurice Lewis either .
He saw Kelly drinking with Julia and Dan.
This was corroborated by Barnett in his interview in the star of the 10th when he said his brother met up with Kelly that evening after Joe had last seen her .

Lewis would have been well used to seeing Kelly .
If they were playing pitch and toss IN the court then it's safe to suggest it was a favoured location of theirs for playing it .In that case he would have witnessed Kelly coming and going from her room
regularly on various days of playing pitch and toss .
Why on earth anyone would think he would confuse her with Maxwell who lived over the street is beyond me

The big question is who was this Julia who was with Kelly and Dan , and who occasionally slept with Kelly ,and where did she go ?

It wasn't venturney as she was already tucked up in bed at this point and as she had her own room in the court , didn't need to sleep at number 13

times too tight for Maurice lewis and Maxwell to have been correct IMHO

[richardnunweek]

Hi
Pitch and Toss was an illegal game, and I find it hard to fathom that McCarthy would have allowed that to happen on his property.
I believe that Maurice Lewis somewhat confirms the story of women drinking in Ringers, when someone wanted Kelly to come out.
Was Mary Kelly alive that morning in daylight hours.?
Regards Richard.

[Darryl Kenyon]

So in order for Maxwell to be right, Mary would have had to go out onto a busy Commercial St, solicit a client, whilst in a bad state, take the client back to the room, enter the room by putting her hand through the window which leads onto millers Crt. The client then kills Mary, leaves by the door walks up the passage onto Commercial St past Mcarthys, all within an hour and forty-five minutes without anybody else seeing anything despite the fact that at least two people are looking for Mary that morning. Or she could have been killed in the middle of the night when shouts of murder were heard, plus when the medical evidence seems to point to and when the murderer could have slipped away with a much better chance of not being noticed.

[packers stem]

Maxwell didn't confuse Kelly with Albrook ,Prater or anybody else for crying out loud .In press interviews she gave on the 9th (Daily news of the 10th amongst others ) she stated "I believe she was of Limerick" ...... should be no doubt whatsoever

No confusion for Maurice Lewis either .
He saw Kelly drinking with Julia and Dan.
This was corroborated by Barnett in his interview in the star of the 10th when he said his brother met up with Kelly that evening after Joe had last seen her .

Lewis would have been well used to seeing Kelly .
If they were playing pitch and toss IN the court then it's safe to suggest it was a favoured location of theirs for playing it .In that case he would have witnessed Kelly coming and going from her room
regularly on various days of playing pitch and toss .
Why on earth anyone would think he would confuse her with Maxwell who lived over the street is beyond me

The big question is who was this Julia who was with Kelly and Dan , and who occasionally slept with Kelly ,and where did she go ?

It wasn't venturney as she was already tucked up in bed at this point and as she had her own room in the court , didn't need to sleep at number 13

[Sam Flynn]

if it was raining during the night of 7/8 Nov the forecast would read -Rain at night, Dull cold day; not vice versa

I'm not so sure, Darryl. What it's saying is, "The day was dull and cold, and it rained at night", which makes perfect sense to me, logically and sequentially. On the next day, "It rained in the morning until 11AM, and the rest of the day was overcast".

Putting the two statements together, it seems that it rained frequently, if not constantly, during the night of the 8th and the morning of the 9th.

[Darryl Kenyon]

Am I the only one who's confused by this?

Hi, Joshua sorry if I wasn't more clear. But it has been suggested that Mary Cox got her days wrong and she really saw Mary Kelly the night before IE 7/8 Nov. But she says in her inquest testimony - Deceased was still singing at one o'clock when I returned. I remained in the room for a minute to warm my hands as it was raining,
if it was raining during the night of 7/8 Nov the forecast would read -Rain at night, Dull cold day; not vice versa But we know it rained on the 8/9 nov at night, as the forecast points out - Wet till 11A.M, then overcast.

[Joshua Rogan]

Also if Cox did get the day wrong it doesn't look like the night before

Weather for 8 November - Dull cold day; rain at night
Weather for 9 Nov - Wet till 11A.M, then overcast

Dull cold day, nothing about raining during the night.

Am I the only one who's confused by this?

[Sam Flynn]

I am not saying it is wrong but wasn't it from an unofficial report?
Could n/a mean no answer rather than not applicable.

Or "not available", perhaps.

[Darryl Kenyon]

Didn't you forget to mention that the measurable amount of rain was "n/a".
So little it was not measurable.
Thats what we used to call drizzle, not "raining hard".

I am not saying it is wrong but wasn't it from an unofficial report?
Could n/a mean no answer rather than not applicable.
Also if Cox did get the day wrong it doesn't look like the night before

Weather for 8 November - Dull cold day; rain at night
Weather for 9 Nov - Wet till 11A.M, then overcast

Dull cold day, nothing about raining during the night. maybe it did rain, maybe not. But at least we know it did rain/drizzle [ one person's interpretation of heavy/rain drizzle can be different from another's ] during the night of 8/9 Nov

[Simon Wood]

Hi Jon,

I was wrong.

The Standard, 10th November 1888, also stated—

"Her little room was shared with a son, eight years of age, and her mother."

Regards,

Simon

[Sam Flynn]

Sound silly? - actually I'd say it sounds stupid.
But then again, its not my argument.

That's not my argument either, but I really can't be arsed explaining it to you.

[Sam Flynn]

This tangential exchange does not involve Maurice Lewis, the point of the thread. I thought that might concern you.

I hadn't really noticed the heading of the thread, which seems in any case to have morphed into a general discussion about Kelly's time of death. To be honest, we're not likely to get much mileage out of a peripheral figure like Maurice Lewis in any case, so perhaps these tangents are understandable.

[Wickerman]

What on earth do you mean? I haven't been policing anything.

This tangential exchange does not involve Maurice Lewis, the point of the thread. I thought that might concern you.