Why Buck's Row?

[Hair Bear]

Apologies if this subject has already been covered, but why would Nichols be in Buck's Row? If she wanted business surely she'd stick to the more populated Whitechapel Road. In that case, it could be argued that, rather than the theory that the Ripper came upon her on his way to, say, work, a la Charles Cross, she was actually escorted there.

[Pcdunn]

That's where speculation comes in...

Apologies if this subject has already been covered, but why would Nichols be in Buck's Row? If she wanted business surely she'd stick to the more populated Whitechapel Road. In that case, it could be argued that, rather than the theory that the Ripper came upon her on his way to, say, work, a la Charles Cross, she was actually escorted there.

Yes, you would think that, wouldn't you? Good question, Hair Bear.

I once asked something similar on another thread about Lechmere, and also asked why on earth, if Lechmere had left earlier than he'd said so he could find likely victims, would he bring one back to a street on his usual route to work to finish her off?

I was told, well, we have no idea how Lechmere and Nichols really met, and it doesn't really matter, anyway, as we do know what happened in Buck's Row. (Right, but to kill her right on his route to work--?)

The only thing that makes some sense to me would be the speculation that Polly had given up trying to turn tricks and was perhaps in Buck's Row looking for a sheltered place to try and sleep, when Lechmere came upon her and decided to get in a quick throat-cutting prior to work. (However, that idea isn't really supported by forensic evidence of the attack, in which she seems to have been upright, not sitting or lying down when attacked.)

What is your answer to your own question?

[GUT]

Apologies if this subject has already been covered, but why would Nichols be in Buck's Row? If she wanted business surely she'd stick to the more populated Whitechapel Road. In that case, it could be argued that, rather than the theory that the Ripper came upon her on his way to, say, work, a la Charles Cross, she was actually escorted there.

Seems most likely answer was she and her client went there.

[Robert St Devil]

Hello Bear.

SHADES OF DUTFIELD YARD. I,ve considered that it was Polly Nicholls leading Jack the Ripper to Mr. Brown,s Stableyard. Finding it locked, he may have murdered her regardless...

SCENES OF THE CRIME. I detect a subtle difference between the eviscerate murders of Chapman, Eddowes & Kelly and the other murders (possibly) attributed to Jack the Ripper. Their 3 murders required discovery. Someone had to go into a backyard, the dark recesses of square or an apartment. There was more ,publicity, with the murders of the other women. Someone was bound to ,trip over, their bodies.

[John Wheat]

Seems most likely answer was she and her client went there.

I agree Gut.

Cheers John

[Abby Normal]

Apologies if this subject has already been covered, but why would Nichols be in Buck's Row? If she wanted business surely she'd stick to the more populated Whitechapel Road. In that case, it could be argued that, rather than the theory that the Ripper came upon her on his way to, say, work, a la Charles Cross, she was actually escorted there.

Hi HB
I had brought it up when lech was first proposed as a suspect because as you imply, his route would take him down bucks row, not the main streets, where she was last seen.

That would mean either he left his main route to look for a victim or that she was already there. both seemed unlikely to me.

If it was lech, I think she may have already been their, maybe looking for a place to doze and he came upon her. I have a hard time envisioning him looking for a victim, going off the beaten path, on his way to work.

however, as was pointed out to me, he may have left his house earlier than he said to give him time to look around.

[Pierre]

Apologies if this subject has already been covered, but why would Nichols be in Buck's Row? If she wanted business surely she'd stick to the more populated Whitechapel Road. In that case, it could be argued that, rather than the theory that the Ripper came upon her on his way to, say, work, a la Charles Cross, she was actually escorted there.

Drinking?

[kjab3112]

She was last seen about half a mile further west on Whitechapel Road/High Street, Bucks Row/Durward Street runs parallel to the main road behind Whitechapel Station. To my mind it would suggest she'd picked up a John around the station and then sought a quiet place to seal the deal so to speak. Whether the client killed her (most likely) or she was found by e.g. a passing cartman can and will be argued. Each murder site is surprisingly close to major thoroughfares which would have been and still are busy round the clock

Paul

[Abby Normal]

She was last seen about half a mile further west on Whitechapel Road/High Street, Bucks Row/Durward Street runs parallel to the main road behind Whitechapel Station. To my mind it would suggest she'd picked up a John around the station and then sought a quiet place to seal the deal so to speak. Whether the client killed her (most likely) or she was found by e.g. a passing cartman can and will be argued. Each murder site is surprisingly close to major thoroughfares which would have been and still are busy round the clock

Paul

agree that if it wasn't lech, this is the most likely scenario.

[John Wheat]

agree that if it wasn't lech, this is the most likely scenario.

Unless there is anything that actually points to Lechmere which there isnt. It is the likely scenario.

[Hair Bear]

Drinking?

If you are suggesting she was looking for somewhere to drink, I'm sure she knew where to find one. If so, would that be on Buck's Row?

Everyone else
If Cross did kill her, I agree with the theory that he didn't go find her and then walk her to the very route he took for work. That simply wouldn't make sense. At the same time, if he came across her, why wouldn't he take her off his walking route down one of the side streets?

[Hair Bear]

Yes, you would think that, wouldn't you? Good question, Hair Bear.

I once asked something similar on another thread about Lechmere, and also asked why on earth, if Lechmere had left earlier than he'd said so he could find likely victims, would he bring one back to a street on his usual route to work to finish her off?

I was told, well, we have no idea how Lechmere and Nichols really met, and it doesn't really matter, anyway, as we do know what happened in Buck's Row. (Right, but to kill her right on his route to work--?)

The only thing that makes some sense to me would be the speculation that Polly had given up trying to turn tricks and was perhaps in Buck's Row looking for a sheltered place to try and sleep, when Lechmere came upon her and decided to get in a quick throat-cutting prior to work. (However, that idea isn't really supported by forensic evidence of the attack, in which she seems to have been upright, not sitting or lying down when attacked.)

What is your answer to your own question?

It's outrageous to suggest that the meeting place of Nichols and the Ripper doesn't matter. Of course it does! Knowing that would help track his movements, which in turn would perhaps lead us closer to his identity.

Re looking for shelter: we need to find out whether shelter could be found by heading East. Whatever the reason for her being there, I would say that just as there is a case for the Ripper to have walked her there (or she him), it is also possible that he came across her, on the grounds that I can't see why he would take her to Buck's Row - or she him - and not down a less-populated cranny.

[Joshua Rogan]

There was a workhouse casual ward just off Buck's Row, on Thomas Street. But I suspect you needed to be there a lot earlier than 3 am to get a bed.

[Harry D]

If a woman had been killed at Buck's Row between 3.15 - 3.40am, is it likely that Lechmere would've been one of the first to discover the body?

[Hair Bear]

There was a workhouse casual ward just off Buck's Row, on Thomas Street. But I suspect you needed to be there a lot earlier than 3 am to get a bed.

I agree. To the point that I find it more probable that she walked to Buck's Row with the Ripper (from Whitechapel Road).

Dr Llewellen said she had "not been dead more than half-an-hour" (my take on that is "between 25mins and 30mins"). This was at either just before 4am or 4am. So let's narrow her time of death down from Neil's 3:15 to 3:45, to between 3:27 to 3:35. If Cross did indeed set off at 3:30, by my reckoning he would reach the corner of Buck's Row at 3:36. And this is why he didn't see or hear anyone, because the Ripper was probably heading down Court street by 3:36!