Finding more out about MJK

[RockySullivan]

Indeed Natasha...can you tell me more about the ripper letter that was post marked with address near McCarthy on dorset st? I cant seem to find the post

[Natasha]

Indeed Natasha...can you tell me more about the ripper letter that was post marked with address near McCarthy on dorset st? I cant seem to find the post

Hi Rocky

I think the following link will shed light on the letter you are referring to:

http://forum.casebook.org/archive/index.php/t-6812.html

[RockySullivan]

Thanks Natasha

[Natasha]

Hi All

Since discussions have revisited the Norfolk letter (http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=6812)

I was wondering weather anyone had done any research on Kelly maybe having a connection to Norwich. I think it would be well worth looking into as I don't think the author of this letter plucked the Norwich idea out of the air for nothing.

What do you lot think?

[MayBea]

The only Norfolk/Norwich connection I can think of is that of a Ripper candidate who lived in Norfolk.

Norfolk, Virginia...

[Natasha]

The only Norfolk/Norwich connection I can think of is that of a Ripper candidate who lived in Norfolk.

Norfolk, Virginia...

Hi MayBea,

I gather you are talking about Maybrick.

I don't believe it was Maybrick.

This might not be the right place to post the following, as it is in regards to Eddowes, but it does concern Norfolk/Norwich. I don't know if it's relevant but, Eddowes was found with a Colemans mustard tin, and where was the flagship mustard store? In Norwich! Maybe that's a long shot and it's possible that she purchased it in London or was given it at some point. Or was the tin left by the killer?

Might be insignificant, but I thought I would mention it.

[Rosella]

I come from Norfolk, England, and, especially in the 19th century, the Coleman family and brand (sauces and mustards) were well known. The Prince of Wales used to shoot on their estate.

Having said that, though, I don't think Eddowes' possession of an old Coleman's mustard tin is significant, unfortunately. It was probably discarded and she picked it up as maybe useful to keep things in. A neighbour of my mother's used to keep reels of cotton in an old custard container. Same thing!

[Rosella]

Incidentally, going many posts back, to the discussion of McCarthy as landlord and Mary's letters from relatives, maybe Mary used Mac's chandler's shop as a sort of poste restante for her relatives to write to her, and she would collect the mail when she visited his shop?

[markmorey5]

Incidentally, going many posts back, to the discussion of McCarthy as landlord and Mary's letters from relatives, maybe Mary used Mac's chandler's shop as a sort of poste restante for her relatives to write to her, and she would collect the mail when she visited his shop?

Almost certainly

[MayBea]

According to reports, Mary received only one letter from her mother "in Ireland".

The letter could have been passed on by a relative in London who knew where Mary was. But where did McCarthy get the idea that it came from Ireland? Unless he read the letter, it was likely from Mary herself.

I'm not sure there would be a return address, unless they put it on the back fold. I don't think it was a common practice any more than in a Ripper letter.

I wonder what her mother had to say and why didn't she mention it to Barnett or have him read it to her? Maybe something to do about a husband perhaps?

Can we say we're looking for a Mary Kelly whose mother was still alive in 1888?

[Natasha]

According to reports, Mary received only one letter from her mother "in Ireland".

The letter could have been passed on by a relative in London who knew where Mary was. But where did McCarthy get the idea that it came from Ireland? Unless he read the letter, it was likely from Mary herself.

I'm not sure there would be a return address, unless they put it on the back fold. I don't think it was a common practice any more than in a Ripper letter.

I wonder what her mother had to say and why didn't she mention it to Barnett or have him read it to her? Maybe something to do about a husband perhaps?

Can we say we're looking for a Mary Kelly whose mother was still alive in 1888?

Hi MayBea,

Having read Barnett's account of Kelly's life, there is no mention of her mother. I don't think she knew her mother IMO, maybe because the mother died/left. Then again is it not strange that there is no mention at all of the mother, from Barnett's retelling of the story?

I think that if there was a letter, it was perhaps from someone other than family.

[MayBea]

Then again is it not strange that there is no mention at all of the mother, from Barnett's retelling of the story?...

I'm not surprised there's no specific mention of the mother based on how macho/masculine/ballsy Mary's story was: father in ironworks, six brothers, one in the army, husband in a mine explosion, etc....

I think she only mentioned her sister because she was a businesswoman. That's also the only part that strikes me as true.

There were actually quite a lot of female merchants at the time so it's not a dead giveaway. However, I might still look for women who were "merchants" or "dealers" and were born a Kelly. Then I would look for a sister.

[Penhalion]

Wouldn't the letter have an Irish post mark? Maybe the handwriting looked feminine? Maybe he assumed it would be from the mother and never actually saw who wrote it? Hard to say at this point, but its still odd that if her family knew enough to send a letter, they never responded to her murder.

[Natasha]

I'm not surprised there's no specific mention of the mother based on how macho/masculine/ballsy Mary's story was: father in ironworks, six brothers, one in the army, husband in a mine explosion, etc....

I think she only mentioned her sister because she was a businesswoman. That's also the only part that strikes me as true.

There were actually quite a lot of female merchants at the time so it's not a dead giveaway. However, I might still look for women who were "merchants" or "dealers" and were born a Kelly. Then I would look for a sister.

Hi MayBea

I never thought of the tomboy angle before.

It would be a good idea to research weather women did take on jobs reserved for men only. I know the Victorian era was very restrictive for women, but I don't think that would have stopped women.

Could this macholistic attitude have gotten Kelly in to trouble? Possibly.

[Natasha]

Wouldn't the letter have an Irish post mark? Maybe the handwriting looked feminine? Maybe he assumed it would be from the mother and never actually saw who wrote it? Hard to say at this point, but its still odd that if her family knew enough to send a letter, they never responded to her murder.

Hi Pen,

Good point. If the letter was from family, why did they not respond upon hearing about her murder? I think if a letter was delivered it was written by someone else, not family.

Was McCarthy lying? If so then why?