The pail

[Pcdunn]

"oh murder!"

What I got from what he said is that he was implying Dr. Phillips was the accomplice. I don't see why anyone would argue for two victims at the scene, accomplice or not.

Dr. Phillips was Jack's accomplice? Or an accomplice in the supposed cover-up by the police?

Pierre has said previously that the exclamation "oh murder!" may have come from someone JtR brought to see his masterpiece of Kelly on her deathbed. While this has marvelous potential in a drama, I think it raises the question of what became of the witness? (We can probably guess he or she did not live long enough to say much...) But, this is such a jumble I'm sure there's nothing to it.

[Karl]

I wondered if Pierre was getting at the possibility of two victims, and the contents of the pail held what remained of the other.

Pros for this idea: Pierre has mentioned that the killer wanted his work to be witnessed by someone, back when we discussed the door in the panel theory.

Cons for this idea: You can hardly get an entire body into one pail, covered with newspaper, unless it was minced very small. If there were remains that did not belong to Kelly, they'd have to be partial, or bodily fluids such as blood or vomit.

Never mind.

What I got from what he said is that he was implying Dr. Phillips was the accomplice. I don't see why anyone would argue for two victims at the scene, accomplice or not.

[Pcdunn]

I wondered if Pierre was getting at the possibility of two victims, and the contents of the pail held what remained of the other.

Pros for this idea: Pierre has mentioned that the killer wanted his work to be witnessed by someone, back when we discussed the door in the panel theory.

Cons for this idea: You can hardly get an entire body into one pail, covered with newspaper, unless it was minced very small. If there were remains that did not belong to Kelly, they'd have to be partial, or bodily fluids such as blood or vomit.

Never mind.

[Elamarna]

"In the abdominal cavity was some partially digested food of fish & potatoes & similar food was found in the remains of the stomach attached to the intestines."

Perhaps the pail contained any remains that might have 'leaked' something other than blood.

Joshua,

I could be wrong, but Pierre has now twice mentioned organs other than from the site, if I read him right?
I may just be over interpreting of course.

However when ones takes posts #53 and#30 there seems to be a common link.

I wonder if he for some reason thinks that something from another site was taken to Millers Court for comparison, of if there was an extra organ of some sort at Millers court.

Steve

[Elamarna]

If there had been any alcohol in the flat Kelly would have probably drunk it

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Possibly Trevor, very possibly

Steve

[Joshua Rogan]

Hi Joshua,

Has I said so many items, simply forgot to mention the stomach, my memory fails me here, was it separated from or connected to part of the small intestine.

I should know that!

Anyway not as large as people think, particular as it was opened, I could see it going into the pall with other smaller organs, if that was what was in the pall, or in shell.



Steve

"In the abdominal cavity was some partially digested food of fish & potatoes & similar food was found in the remains of the stomach attached to the intestines."

Perhaps the pail contained any remains that might have 'leaked' something other than blood.

[Trevor Marriott]

Depends on what you mean by fresh?

If a few hours no real difference, however if decomposition as started, then they will swell/bloat at first, particularly the intestines.

If preserved they would have to be in sealed jars filled with a preserving liquid.

There's an idea Pierre, if you wanted to preserve an organ but did not have the correct equipment with you, one could use the pall as a temporary vessel for such if filled with say alcohol.

Steve

If there had been any alcohol in the flat Kelly would have probably drunk it

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Elamarna]

OK. When things like that are not fresh, would they be smaller?

Depends on what you mean by fresh?

If a few hours no real difference, however if decomposition as started, then they will swell/bloat at first, particularly the intestines.

If preserved they would have to be in sealed jars filled with a preserving liquid.

There's an idea Pierre, if you wanted to preserve an organ but did not have the correct equipment with you, one could use the pall as a temporary vessel for such if filled with say alcohol.



Steve

[Elamarna]

How about the stomach and whatever contents remained? If they'd simply put that in the shell with the other bits and pieces, it would have been all over the place by the time the cart arrived at the mortuary.

Hi Joshua,

Has I said so many items, simply forgot to mention the stomach, my memory fails me here, was it separated from or connected to part of the small intestine.

I should know that!

Anyway not as large as people think, particular as it was opened, I could see it going into the pall with other smaller organs, if that was what was in the pall, or in shell.



Steve

[Joshua Rogan]

Well not knowing the exact size does not make it easy.


You certainly could not have all the excised organs in one pall.

The intestine would certainly not fit in one pall whole, the liver is also a large organ.

So much was cut and removed from Kelly, it is not possible to decide what or how many items could be taken, the list is very long.

One could fit several of the small items into the pall, uterus, flesh, breasts that is as far as I can go.

Sorry

Steve

How about the stomach and whatever contents remained? If they'd simply put that in the shell with the other bits and pieces, it would have been all over the place by the time the cart arrived at the mortuary.

[Pierre]

Well not knowing the exact size does not make it easy.


You certainly could not have all the excised organs in one pall.

The intestine would certainly not fit in one pall whole, the liver is also a large organ.

So much was cut and removed from Kelly, it is not possible to decide what or how many items could be taken, the list is very long.

One could fit several of the small items into the pall, uterus, flesh, breasts that is as far as I can go.

Sorry

Steve

OK. When things like that are not fresh, would they be smaller?

[Elamarna]

Steve, how many items could such a pail have contained do you think?

Regards, Pierre

Well not knowing the exact size does not make it easy.


You certainly could not have all the excised organs in one pall.

The intestine would certainly not fit in one pall whole, the liver is also a large organ.

So much was cut and removed from Kelly, it is not possible to decide what or how many items could be taken, the list is very long.

One could fit several of the small items into the pall, uterus, flesh, breasts that is as far as I can go.

Sorry

Steve

[Pierre]

Robert,

I would not be surprised in the slightest if that is what it is about.

Steve

Steve, how many items could such a pail have contained do you think?

Regards, Pierre

[Pierre]

[QUOTE=Robert St Devil;399735]

Hi Pierre.

I think you differ from Fisherman in that your hypothesis encompasses an overall story, and wants to go further than a work route to tie all the murders together.

That is correct, Robert.

Regards, Pierre

[Robert St Devil]

Hi Pierre.

I think you differ from Fisherman in that your hypothesis encompasses an overall story, and wants to go further than a work route to tie all the murders together. You've broken the hypothesis up into pieces over the past year, and fielded the suggestions of ripperologists on separate threads, but the result is always the same: no, nope, zero points, not a doorknob and window. You're not going to resolve this thread even tho you have your own suggestion for the contents of the pail.