How Many Victims Were There?

[Juniper4576]

Hi Herlock, as you can see I'm new here and I apologise if it has been discussed before. What are peoples thought MJK and Liz stride were not victims? I loosely, Little knowledge to back up, that MJK was deliberately defaced to hide the identity. And with Liz, in my amateur eye some things don't add up, she was overdressed with a flower, like she was going to meet someone, the location, the most southern murder site and the timings of the double event. I know Jack was quick with his work, but if the double eve t did happen, along with the writing and the apron he had a lot of luck that night. Do you or anyone have any thoughts on this?

[c.d.]

Hello Juniper,

Welcome to the boards.

Yes, these topics have been discussed before and you can look at some old threads discussing these points.

I will simply give you my thoughts - I don't see any evidence to indicate that MJK was deliberately defaced. If you start cutting flesh you are eventually going to get to the face.

Liz may or may not have been soliciting that evening. She might have had a date but dates can end. Regardless of why she was out that night we have no way of knowing what her response would have been had she been approached and asked for her services. So talk of dates etc. is pretty much a moot point.

Hope this helps.

c.d.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Hi Herlock, as you can see I'm new here and I apologise if it has been discussed before. What are peoples thought MJK and Liz stride were not victims? I loosely, Little knowledge to back up, that MJK was deliberately defaced to hide the identity. And with Liz, in my amateur eye some things don't add up, she was overdressed with a flower, like she was going to meet someone, the location, the most southern murder site and the timings of the double event. I know Jack was quick with his work, but if the double eve t did happen, along with the writing and the apron he had a lot of luck that night. Do you or anyone have any thoughts on this?

Hi Juniper

Id forgotten starting this thread?

There are certainly people that feel that the Miller’s Court victim might have been mutilated so badly to disguise the fact that she wasn’t Kelly but I certainly think that she was. I see no evidence of any kind of cover up. Stride might not have been a ripper victim of course but, on balance, I’d say that it would have been a major coincidence to have had 2 throat cutting Murders so close together, in time and location, for them not to have been connected.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Hello Juniper,

Welcome to the boards.

Yes, these topics have been discussed before and you can look at some old threads discussing these points.

I will simply give you my thoughts - I don't see any evidence to indicate that MJK was deliberately defaced. If you start cutting flesh you are eventually going to get to the face.

Liz may or may not have been soliciting that evening. She might have had a date but dates can end. Regardless of why she was out that night we have no way of knowing what her response would have been had she been approached and asked for her services. So talk of dates etc. is pretty much a moot point.

Hope this helps.

c.d.

Good point c.d. I guess the same could be said about Eddowes too. Many ask why she ended up in Mitre Square? I’ve suggested (and it’s only a suggestion) that maybe she was going to see someone she knew and that she might have felt would lend her a few pence? So she might not have been actively soliciting or expecting a customer until she bumped into one. Sadly of course.

[Juniper4576]

Good point c.d. I guess the same could be said about Eddowes too. Many ask why she ended up in Mitre Square? I’ve suggested (and it’s only a suggestion) that maybe she was going to see someone she knew and that she might have felt would lend her a few pence? So she might not have been actively soliciting or expecting a customer until she bumped into one. Sadly of course.

I think she was going to meet someone, as it has been quoted, when she left the police station she turned left instead of right...completely the opposite direction to that of 'home'

c.d. Any thoughts?

[Christian]

Hi Juniper

Id forgotten starting this thread?

There are certainly people that feel that the Miller’s Court victim might have been mutilated so badly to disguise the fact that she wasn’t Kelly but I certainly think that she was. I see no evidence of any kind of cover up. Stride might not have been a ripper victim of course but, on balance, I’d say that it would have been a major coincidence to have had 2 throat cutting Murders so close together, in time and location, for them not to have been connected.

Great point regarding the double event!! Historically how often do two woman die within 1 mile of each other similar neck wound and on the same night??? Been saying this for years!! Still doubters say Stride not a Ripper victim SOME coincidence or statistically amazing!!! Just saying

[c.d.]

Hello Juniper,

I do think she was going to meet someone or at least looking for someone. She had a lot to drink that evening apparently. Could someone have been buying her drinks and was she looking for that someone? Could very well be.

c.d.

[c.d.]

Hello Herlock,

With regard to Stride being approached even if her initial response was to say no what would her response have been to an offer to pay more than the usual? Certainly Jack could have come up with a believable story that he just got paid and was looking for a good time and was willing to up the price. Why not knowing he could take it all back?

c.d.

[Juniper4576]

Hello Juniper,

I do think she was going to meet someone or at least looking for someone. She had a lot to drink that evening apparently. Could someone have been buying her drinks and was she looking for that someone? Could very well be.

c.d.

I do think that Jack had 'eyes on' or chatted with his victims prior to the murder, possibly built their confidence with them with a "oh its you again" or "funny seeing you round here"

[c.d.]

I do think that Jack had 'eyes on' or chatted with his victims prior to the murder, possibly built their confidence with them with a "oh its you again" or "funny seeing you round here"

Yes, I have always had the feeling (and that is all that it is) that Jack had met Mary a few days earlier and she told him to come by some time.

c.d.

[c.d.]

Great point regarding the double event!! Historically how often do two woman die within 1 mile of each other similar neck wound and on the same night??? Been saying this for years!! Still doubters say Stride not a Ripper victim SOME coincidence or statistically amazing!!! Just saying

And both with ties to prostitution.

c.d.

[Christian]

And both with ties to prostitution.

c.d.

Indeed c.d

[MrBarnett]

And both with ties to prostitution.

c.d.

What were Eddowes’ ties to prostitution?

[c.d.]

What were Eddowes’ ties to prostitution?

Let's change it to "alleged" prostitute.

c.d.

[DJA]

Let's change it to "alleged" prostitute.

c.d.

On what evidence?