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  • How Many Victims Were There?

    It would be interest for me to gauge opinion on how many actual victims (murders) there were that each poster attributes to Jack the Ripper. I intended to do it as a poll but I decided against it as there were so many combinations for eg c5 + Tabram or c5 + Tabram and Mackenzie or c5 + Mackenzie.

    Iíll suggest the term c4 to denote the c5 minus Stride?

    Even without the poll format weíll be able to get a feel for what posters think. This thread isnít really for comments or debate just the presentation of your opinions although it would be ok for you to add your level of likeliness if you feel itís important.

    Ill begin.

    I go for the c5

    (with Tabram and Mackenzie accepted as possibles.) At a guess Iíd say 25% Tabram, 30-40% Mackenzie.
    Regards

    Herlock






    "Crime is common. Logic is rare. Therefore it is upon the logic rather than upon the crime that you should dwell.”

  • #2
    Five.
    My name is Dave. You cannot reach me through Debs email account

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    • #3
      AT LEAST ten victims...

      Rainham torso
      Nichols
      Whitehall torso
      Chapman
      Stride
      Eddowes
      Kelly
      Jackson
      McKenzie
      Pinchin torso

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      • #4
        C5 (fillertext)

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        • #5
          C2, possibly 3. Remove Liz and Mary. Circumstances in both cases suggest other possible motives than just a compulsion for murder and mutilation.

          If 2 is correct, then an explanation for why they stopped with Annie is present within the known "suspects" files. In fact the suspect later ID'd from an appearance at the pub down the street from the Hanbury murder scene on the morning of the murder is a likely prospect. The means, the skills, the institutionalization between C2 and C3 murders ending the series...it could fit. People who think that only Jack killed street women during this period should look closer at the Torsos, or the other 8 or so Unsolved murders, which suggest multiple men doing violent acts.
          Michael Richards

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Harry D View Post
            AT LEAST ten victims...

            Rainham torso
            Nichols
            Whitehall torso
            Chapman
            Stride
            Eddowes
            Kelly
            Jackson
            McKenzie
            Pinchin torso
            agree with this. but if ripper was separate from torso (i doubt)then c7-add tabram and McKenzie to c5.
            "Is all that we see or seem
            but a dream within a dream?"

            -Edgar Allan Poe


            "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
            quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

            -Frederick G. Abberline

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            • #7
              Thanks for the responses. Iíll give it a week or so to get a better overall picture.
              Regards

              Herlock






              "Crime is common. Logic is rare. Therefore it is upon the logic rather than upon the crime that you should dwell.”

              Comment


              • #8
                Canonical Five, and probably Martha Tabram as well. I'd not be at all surprised to learn that Annie Millwood was a victim of the Ripper also. I have trouble imagining that he started out murdering women right off the bat. We see an escalating series of horrors from Polly Nichols up to Mary Kelly (excepting Elizabeth Stride, but I think he didn't get to finish what he'd begun there). It seems sensible to me that his earliest crimes would have been part of that pattern of ever-increasing violence.
                Last edited by Ginger; 07-25-2019, 02:43 PM. Reason: Rephrasing
                - Ginger

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
                  It would be interest for me to gauge opinion on how many actual victims (murders) there were that each poster attributes to Jack the Ripper. I intended to do it as a poll but I decided against it as there were so many combinations for eg c5 + Tabram or c5 + Tabram and Mackenzie or c5 + Mackenzie.

                  Iíll suggest the term c4 to denote the c5 minus Stride?

                  Even without the poll format weíll be able to get a feel for what posters think. This thread isnít really for comments or debate just the presentation of your opinions although it would be ok for you to add your level of likeliness if you feel itís important.

                  Ill begin.

                  I go for the c5

                  (with Tabram and Mackenzie accepted as possibles.) At a guess Iíd say 25% Tabram, 30-40% Mackenzie.
                  3 Nichols.chapman.Eddowes

                  www.trevormarriott.co.uk

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Nichols, Chapman, Eddowes close to 100%. Stride 40-50%, Kelly 90% plus. Torso victims, zero to 0.5%. Tabram, 50-60%. Mackenzie, around 20%. Coles, 10%. Smith, 10%.
                    Last edited by John G; 07-25-2019, 03:16 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by John G View Post
                      Nichols, Chapman, Eddowes close to 100%. Stride 40-50%, Kelly 90% plus. Torso victims, zero to 0.5%. Tabram, 50-60%. Mackenzie, around 20%. Coles, 10%. Smith, 10%.
                      Pretty close to how I'd rate them, John.
                      Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                      "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, GŲtzendšmmerung, 1888)

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post

                        Pretty close to how I'd rate them, John.
                        Thanks Gareth- great minds think alike!

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Trevor Marriott View Post

                          3 Nichols.chapman.Eddowes

                          www.trevormarriott.co.uk
                          Nice to be in agreement with you Trevor. And by the way we both agree with Stewart Evans, I asked him directly here how many victims he puts under this JtR killer, and he told me 2 perhaps 3. That 3rd for me is Eddowes.
                          Michael Richards

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Michael W Richards View Post

                            Nice to be in agreement with you Trevor. And by the way we both agree with Stewart Evans, I asked him directly here how many victims he puts under this JtR killer, and he told me 2 perhaps 3. That 3rd for me is Eddowes.
                            He has been more equivocal: "Both authors feel that on grounds of modus operandi at the very least, Nichols, Chapman and Eddowes were almost certainly victims of the same killer. There must be less certainty, on the same grounds, that Stride and Kelly were." (Evans and Rumbelow, 2006)
                            Last edited by John G; 07-25-2019, 08:23 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by John G View Post
                              Nichols, Chapman, Eddowes close to 100%. Stride 40-50%, Kelly 90% plus. Torso victims, zero to 0.5%. Tabram, 50-60%. Mackenzie, around 20%. Coles, 10%. Smith, 10%.
                              Pretty close to my answer but Iíd go more like 80 on stride and 40-50 on Tabram
                              G U T

                              There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

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