6d. Did Liz spend it, or die for it?

[c.d.]

Hello CD. Not a bad idea about a loan. And what a way to avoid repayment!

Cheers.
LC

Hello Lynn,

I wasn't suggesting that the loan was made to her killer. I was thinking more along the lines of a friend or a prostitute/friend.

c.d.

[lynn cates]

club

Hello CD. Thanks. A friend from the club, perhaps?

Cheers.
LC

[c.d.]

Hello Lynn,

I was going to say fellow prostitute but I knew you would jump on me for that. But a prostitute would make sense in that they could hopefully repay a loan given early in the evening by later that night. Also, a prostitute might be more likely to be up that late at night.

c.d.

[lynn cates]

Lately he's been overheard in Mayfair.

Hello CD. Thanks. Jump? I? Some things are so deeply ensconced in the psyche that mere chastisement is not enough to dislodge them. So it is with "JTR" and prostitution.

Here's a fun though experiment. Imagine 5 wealthy old crones from Mayfair being killed by throat cutting and let 3 of them be disemboweled. What's more, suppose that sex for them were once a month whilst "thinking of England."

Would we still discuss the case?

Cheers.
LC

[RivkahChaya]

His reference to the most likely candidate to be Michael Kidney is interesting because, if memory serves, one of the candidates Debra unearthed as a possible Scots Guards Kelly was also from Tredegar. I shall hie me away to research!

So, the implication is that Prisoner 1167 was Mary Jane Kelly's brother?

I wasn't suggesting that the loan was made to her killer. I was thinking more along the lines of a friend or a prostitute/friend.

Because it is impossible to describe a friend who works as a prostitute as simply a friend, but must be called a "prostitute/friend." Are there any other special occupation/predicate nominatives I need to know about? like, "male nurses," who are not allowed to be just "nurses"? Or the "Lady bacteriologist" in this one terrible sci-fi movie I saw? who wasn't a "lady" in the peerage sense, either, but everyone kept referring to her as the "lady bacteriologist" anyway.

Here's a fun though experiment. Imagine 5 wealthy old crones from Mayfair being killed by throat cutting and let 3 of them be disemboweled. What's more, suppose that sex for them were once a month whilst "thinking of England."

Would we still be talking about them? Oh, I think yes. *Sigh* we would probably be talking about how JTR targeted them because he was trying to rid the world of frigid women, or something, and he was probably angry at some frigid woman in his past, maybe his mother was cold to him, and refused to sleep with his father after having him, or something, because the victim's sexuality is somehow more relevant than the killer's decision to kill people.

It matters as a practical consideration whether any of the victims worked as prostitutes, because it explains their easy availability, and lets us know that our killer was out for "easy prey"-- not in the sense of licentious, but in the sense of their being easy targets, not being with groups, or young and strong (Kelly was drunk), and soforth. But it doesn't matter for any other reason. Eddowes was alone and vulnerable because she was walking home alone from jail, and that's reason enough. She was probably still a little tipsy, hadn't eaten in a while, and wasn't in good general health. You can add "she was soliciting" to that or not, and it doesn't matter, because we already know she was vulnerable.

Considering whether or not the women were prostitutes for what amount to Freudian reasons is just silly. It's all TV and movies. If the women were targeted for any personal note they struck with the killer, it was probably their age (they were all in their 40s, and looked older, so if they struck a personal note, the killer's mother was probably around 50, but I don't want to go on record as firmly believing this), and nothing so specific as whether they ever worked as prostitutes. If the killer wanted to kill prostitutes, and was looking at the job, not the woman, he would probably strike real pros, who worked out of brothels, and not women who just got their doss money any way they could.

[lynn cates]

the winner

Hello Rivkah. Thanks.

"we would probably be talking about how JTR targeted them because he was trying to rid the world of frigid women, or something, and he was probably angry at some frigid woman in his past, maybe his mother was cold to him, and refused to sleep with his father after having him, or something, because the victim's sexuality is somehow more relevant than the killer's decision to kill people."

I don't think Casebook has a "best post of the month award" and I'm quite sure the honour of handing it out is not mine, in any case. However, if there were, this would win.

Cheers.
LC

[RivkahChaya]

Aw, shucks. Thanks.

[Cogidubnus]

Interrupting for just a moment...

Hi Lynn/Rivkah

Wouldn't at least one of the old crones have been laying back and thinking of Sweden?

All the best

Dave

[RivkahChaya]

I haven't seen the long form of her birth certificate yet....

[lynn cates]

Sweden

Hello Dave. Thanks.

I thought Christer did that? (heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[curious4]

Liz

Hallo Dave,

No, definitely not typical prostitute behaviour. I am attached to my grooming idea - and it was interesting to read of a case where this had actually happened. Drunk or not, prostitute or not, the women of the East End were definitely on their guard. No, don't think Kidney was responsible, She had left him on several occasions and come back and I think he would have finished her off with a beating a la Bill Sikes if he had been angry. The "Not tonight"? - there is reason to think that the witness saw the courting couple who were in the area and confused them with Liz and her escort.

And perhaps we should consider why Kate got herself released from prison in the middle of the night. To earn some money to put a roof over her head? She already had one and I doubt that she would have been thrown out before the morning. Heading for Mile End? Ditto. Wanting more drink? "Too late for you to get any more drink..".

I will bring you round lol!

Best wishes,
Gwyneth

[curious4]

Er Lynn, let me get this straight. Jack was killing PROSTITUTES because he was angry at frigid women?

Personally I think he was driven insane after visiting IKEA on a saturday ;-D.

Best wishes,
C4

[lynn cates]

Mayfair

Hello C4.Thanks. Well, if he were in Mayfair. (heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[curious4]

Hello Michael,

I think this article does illustrate the attitude towards the club at the time. And I love the picture of the indomitable Mrs D coming to her husband's rescue with a hair broom. Anyone know exactly what a hairbroom was? I`m guessing at a broom with bristles but the women did wear their hair longer then ;-)

Cheers,
C4

[RivkahChaya]

Hello Michael,

I think this article does illustrate the attitude towards the club at the time. And I love the picture of the indomitable Mrs D coming to her husband's rescue with a hair broom. Anyone know exactly what a hairbroom was? I`m guessing at a broom with bristles but the women did wear their hair longer then ;-)

Cheers,
C4

Boar hair, not straw bristles.