Was Stride Really a JtR Victim?

[cts2914]

I was wondering what percentage of a chance others of you would give that there actually WAS a double event, i.e. that both Elizabeth Stride and Catherine Eddows were killed by JtR. I am willing to go 60% against Stride being a victim. As audacious as JtR seemed to be, I think he would have risked at least one abdomen slash regardless of the chance of being caught. After all, there is the timing of the Kate Eddows murder and mutilation between PC's walking a set beat.

God bless

Darkendale

Stride was killed by a local gang

[DVV]

Hi CTS

Welcome.
And thanks for that info.

[Phil H]

cts2914, welcome to Casebook.

Stride was killed by a local gan

I too have a strong suspicion that Stride was not a Ripper victim - but my money would be on Kidney (her former lover).

Can you please explain a little more about you thinking re a gang? I'm interested.

Phil

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Hullo Phil

Me thinks someone would enjoy counting your money. And a gang? Maybe some anarchists? Heh heh. Couldn't resist. Apologies.

[lynn cates]

rep

Hello CTS. Welcome to the boards.

Do you think BSM was a representative of the gang?

Cheers.
LC

[Phil H]

Me thinks someone would enjoy counting your money.

Oh, I think it's safe, Digalittledeeperwatson.

I think time will reveal that Stride was not a JtR victim. Whether her killer was Kidney is another thing - but it's a reasonable bet, IMHO.

Since I know nothing of what the poster suggesting a "gang" has in mind, I'll reserve judgement until I hear his/her reasoning.

Phil

[DRoy]

Welcome CTS,

Just a heads up since you're new to the boards...

It is a good idea to follow up with an explanation of evidence when providing an absolute and direct answer like the one you gave. The how, who, when, what, where questions are a good place to start.

I look forward to your response.

Cheers
DRoy

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Kidney's guilt

Based upon what? That he was abusive towards her? This comes from Liz. Who is apparently known to be a liar and an alcoholic. I know these women were murdered horribly but that doesn't make them good honest people. Kidney gets thrown under the horse and cart if you will based on what amounts to basically diddley-squat.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

I'm not saying Stride is a "JTR" victim. I'm just not willing to exclude the possibility of it because of convenience.

[Phil H]

And I try to keep an open mind, Digalittledeeperwatson.

In my view, Kidney is more likely to have killed her than "Jack".

His actions after the murder seem unusual to me. The murder, for me, lacks many of the features of a JtR killing - the location seems wrong, and there is no mutilation - of course, I accept that there could be other reasons for that.

"Jack", again in my opinion, confined his activities north of Whitechapel High St (though I note recent research that could link Aaron Kosminski to the Berner St area). Moreover, rather than the traditional adjunct of the alleged "double event" involving a frustrated serial killer rushing north to find another victim; I find it far more likely that "Jack" was already probably in search of his only victim of the night, in the Aldgate area.

If (and I emphasise the if) Schwartz saw anything, and what he saw was correctly interpreted, in every sense of the word, then what he saw might well fit a vengeful Kidney encountering or finding his former lover and angrily remonstrating with her. What Schwartz appears to have said would also fit a women in Liz's relation to Kidney.

End of my explanation. Please don't interpret it as a "theory" or my only thought on the subject, but it is the interpretation I favour most at the moment.

Whether you accept it is of no concern to me.

Phil

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

What facts are there to substantiate "Liz's situation"? I accept and respect the position you are coming from as a very likely possibility, but there is insufficient verifiable data to make it likely probable. And Schwartz, hey Israel, is this thd man you saw attacking the woman? Also, Kidney having an alibi maybe. It would be the worst police work never done.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

And Phil

It is not my intent to be disrespectful towards you. I have a great deal of respect for you and your take on things. So if I seem extra hard on you that's why.

[DRoy]

Digital,

They didn't catch her killer whether it was Kidney, BSM, Pipeman, 'Jack', or anyone else. That's just this murder. They tried. They interviewed everyone they could think of yet still didn't catch him/them. No I don't think they were stupid, perhaps their killer(s) were that sneaky or lucky.

Cheers
DRoy

[caz]

Caz,

The problem with saying that it was at least a little loud is that nobody claims to have heard it. Yes there was music from the club but did it drown out the three screams?

In my opinion it's one more piece of Schwartz that nobody can verify and doesn't seem to make sense. Maybe the screams weren't loud because there was no three screams.

Cheers
DRoy

But DRoy, the screams were loud, according to our only willing witness, just not very loud, which could indeed suggest not loud enough to be heard within the walls of the club. We already know that nobody was around to see Schwartz, BS man, Pipeman or Stride, so who would have been around to hear three not very loud screams?

Love,

Caz
X

[The Good Michael]

But DRoy, the screams were loud, according to our only willing witness, just not very loud,

Schwartz may have meant that he heard her scream, but the sounds from the club and/or the street drowned the screams out a bit.

Mike