Did jack kill liz stride?

[Sam Flynn]

Hello Gareth, Tom. I'm good with Annie having the rings wrenched off. Not sure if we can extrapolate to the others, however.

I'm with you there, Lynn.

[lynn cates]

generalisation

Hello Gareth. Thanks.

I might even have generalised on that to include ALL backwards historical extrapolation.

Cheers.
LC

[Tom_Wescott]

I'm with you there, Lynn.

Poor Lynn. Now he has the nutty fringe theorists backing him up.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[lynn cates]

conspiracy theory

Hello Tom, Thanks.

Actually, we are jointly working on a conspiracy theory.

Cheers.
LC

[Sam Flynn]

Poor Lynn. Now he has the nutty fringe theorists backing him up.

I was only agreeing with Lynn about the possible evidence of robbery in the Chapman murder, but not in the others. Nothing nutty - or "fringy" - about that, Tom

[sleekviper]

Hi Tom!
Well it defeats the purpose if they instantly dissolve, they were designed to dissolve slowly, so that the taste remained on the breath for awhile. We know for sure that the only cachous in the yard, are the ones that fell from her hand once she is found? If they are bundled, and sealed before a robbery, at what point are they opened? Killer says, "Empty your pockets", while her hand is holding the sealed cachous, she dies, correct? When does the seal break? If it breaks during a struggle, then how do we know who originally held the cachous since the end result is virtually the same? Does it say the tissue paper has been torn?

[Tom_Wescott]

I was only agreeing with Lynn about the possible evidence of robbery in the Chapman murder, but not in the others. Nothing nutty - or "fringy" - about that, Tom

You have been away too long, Sam, if you're taking my comments for serious.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

Hello Tom, Thanks.

Actually, we are jointly working on a conspiracy theory.

Cheers.
LC

You mean to say you're conspiring on a conspiracy? Who's bringing the joints?

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Tom!
Well it defeats the purpose if they instantly dissolve, they were designed to dissolve slowly, so that the taste remained on the breath for awhile. We know for sure that the only cachous in the yard, are the ones that fell from her hand once she is found? If they are bundled, and sealed before a robbery, at what point are they opened? Killer says, "Empty your pockets", while her hand is holding the sealed cachous, she dies, correct? When does the seal break? If it breaks during a struggle, then how do we know who originally held the cachous since the end result is virtually the same? Does it say the tissue paper has been torn?

I genuinely don't know what you're on about, but clearly it's important to you. We know very little about the cachous except there weren't many of them, they were wrapped in tissue paper, and were lodged between her thumb and forefinger. Most likely it was Edward Johnston who opened her hand and naturally would have wanted to unfold the paper and either at this point or shortly thereafter when Blackwell got on the scene, the cachous were spilled.
They were little sweetmeats, that's all they were.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

Market holders and sellers of boiled sweets would often use square pieces of paper rolled in such a fashion to produce a cone (like an ice-cream cone shape) but with a top piece like a triangle shape (as with an envelope) which was folded down to close the contents.
Maybe, this packet of cachous was this shape, its quick to make, its cheap, its universal, and quite often made from newspaper.

[Tom_Wescott]

Market holders and sellers of boiled sweets would often use square pieces of paper rolled in such a fashion to produce a cone (like an ice-cream cone shape) but with a top piece like a triangle shape (as with an envelope) which was folded down to close the contents.
Maybe, this packet of cachous was this shape, its quick to make, its cheap, its universal, and quite often made from newspaper.

Sounds too big. And the cachous were wrapped in tissue paper.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

Sounds too big. And the cachous were wrapped in tissue paper.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Tom, the shape of an ice-cream cone, not the size of an ice-cream cone

Does anyone know what size these cachous were?
Does anyone know why they are also referred to as Sweetmeats?
Does anyone know the difference between a cachou and a sweetmeat?

Cachous of the period were very small and black. Very similar to what Brits know as Imps, a little smaller than a Tic-tac.

However, Sweetmeats were much larger. Typically this is fruit, a raisin or plumb, covered by sugar. Its an old recipe that dates back to Ancient Egypt.

Anything the size of a Tic-tac will not be noticeable in the mud and darkness, but Sweetmeats are large enough to be noticed.
This may actually be the source of the erroneous 'grapes' theory.
Sweetmeats are the size of grapes.

So, how can we establish whether these were cachous or sweetmeats?

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Wick,

They must have been small because all were lodged between her thumb and forefinger and apparently not visible until her hand was opened. That's the best I can tell you. I thought about this years ago and decided they must have been smaller than grapes, otherwise I might have opted for that solution of the grapes instead of the one I feel is the only logical explanation, which is the oblong blood smears appearing under the grip of her hand looked like she was grasping grapes.

As for sweetmeats, cachous, and breath mints (a modern term), we might be splitting hairs because the terms could have been used generically at the time and in that area.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

Hi Wick,

They must have been small because all were lodged between her thumb and forefinger and apparently not visible until her hand was opened.

Hi Tom.
I think the words Blackwell used was "partially hidden from view", presumably by the partially closed fingers.
So the packet was visible.

As for sweetmeats, cachous, and breath mints (a modern term), we might be splitting hairs because the terms could have been used generically at the time and in that area.

That is the more likely - interchangeable terms, but that still does not allow us to determine precisely which one she held. A sweetmeat called cachou, or a cachou called a sweetmeat. Size is the obvious difference.

A search in Press Reports turns up 14 uses (1 unrelated) of the term 'cachous', and 10 uses (1 unrelated) of the term 'sweetmeats'.

The fact the term 'cachou' is used by Blackwell & Phillips may tip the scales, though we cannot say for sure.

[Tom_Wescott]

You can't go by Blackwell on anything because Johnston had already moved the body and compromised the scene. It seems to me it was Johnston who spilled the cachous, but Blackwell claimed responsibility to protect both himself and Johnston.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott