Acquiring A Victorian Diary

[Mike J. G.]

Hi Yabs,

Personally, I don't know the answer to this, although I am sure I am right in saying that domestic electricity was available in the late Victorian period. To be honest, it's not something I give a lot a thought to (as I don't believe the scrapbook came from under the floorboards of Battlecrease House - I believe, rather, that a servant girl found it in Battlecrease House in 1889 after James Maybrick's death, literally laundered it via Elizabeth Formby's laundry, leaving it for Elizabeth to give to her daughter Edith who passed it to her stepson Billy Graham, who gave it to his daughter Anne Graham, who foolishly - thank God! - gave it to Tony Devereux, who gave it to his mate Bongo Barrett, husband of Anne Graham and erstwhile master-forger and world's greatest ever undiscovered actor, who gave it to the world).

Hope this helps.

Ike

Okay, I've changed my mind, Ike, there's sod-all in the way of hope for you!

[Mike J. G.]

I don't think the artefact taken to Liverpool University was ever verified satisfactorily - it may not even have happened at all.

Ike, there may be some hope for you yet, mate.

[Mike J. G.]

I wonder if anyone has yet managed to figure out what went on when the blokes from Portus and Rhodes found the diary. They apparently just randomly decided to ring the Liverpool university, though it's never, to my knowledge, been revealed which department they even rang. Putting aside the fact that there is more than one branch of said university in town, how did they settle on who they should be contacting? Did they mistakenly contact the School of Tropical Medicine first? Who knows, who even cares, apparently?!

I'd like to envision that it all went a little something like this:

P&R Bloke #1: Mate, I've only gone and found a diary, innit?

P&R Bloke # 2: Really, mate? Whose diary?

P&R Bloke #1: Dunno, lad, but it says stuff like tin match-box empty, and he goes on about havin' a jar in the Poste House in town.

P&R Bloke #2: the oldest pub in Liverpool that was known as the Muck Midden in 1888?

P&R Bloke #1: Nah, although I can see why you'd think that, because most Scouser's seem to get those two pubs confused, mate. He can't have meant the Poste House, even though he wrote it exactly like that, even with the "e".

P&R Bloke #2: Ah, right, interesting stuff that, mate. Who you gonna call?

P&R Bloke #1: *shrugs* Dunno, I'll dial this number I just pulled out of my arse for the Liverpool University in town.

P&R Bloke #2: Which campus, building or department are you gonna contact, mate?

P&R Bloke #1: *shrugs* The Liverpool University.

P&R Bloke #2: Ah, right, that one.

P&R Bloke #1: *dials phone from unknown phone-box.* Hello? Is this the Liverpool University?

Liverpool University Receptionist: Hello, you've reached the Liverpool University, how may I be of assistance?

P&R Bloke #1: Erm, hello, what it is, like, is me and my mate are doing work in Battlecreese house, and we found a diary.

Liverpool University Receptionist: A diary? Sounds interesting! We've actually got a professor on standby for calls such as this, hold on, please.

*Generic scientist in a lab coat, studying vials of brightly coloured liquid picks up phone*

...

Am I close? Thought so.

[Mike J. G.]

I did manage to honour my commitment to attend Ricky Cobb’s Liverpool Diary Conference and panel discussion in October 2017 where I fully expected to be challenged with hostile questions. (Unfortunately, the gentleman who had been so vociferous and forthright on the Message Boards decided he had to leave early.)KS

You're right, mate, I was brimming with such Maybrick-style Jekyll and Hyde rage that I was doing press-ups outside the hotel before entering, that's just how this subject makes me feel; violent, like James Maybe storming the London streets during the Autumn of Error.

Genuinely, though, I'm sorry if I made you up your ant-acid tablets, I would've just casually asked you a few of the questions I was asking on here, there'd have been no hostility, mainly because I'm not mental, unlike some of the people who choose to believe that the diary was actually written by James bloody Maybrick, and that James bloody Maybrick was Jack the sodding Ripper!

In all fairness, y'all waffled on a bit and it got boring, so I decided I couldn't be arsed hanging about! I was hoping I'd see some of Sir Jim's keen, wry humour on display in the speakers.

If you do happen to visit Liverpool soon, though, by all means, I'd love to have a pint and a natter with you about it. We could even visit the Poste House, but just be sure to get the right one, as there's apparently a load of pubs in town baring that name, but don't ask anyone from this city for directions, cos they'll send you to the actual pub known as the Poste House, and really, you may actually want to go to the Old Post Office on School lane. It's easy to confuse those two, said nobody from Liverpool.

I'm impressed that Ike has kept this thread alive, tbh, like Roy Chubby Brown taking his brand of stale, beaten-to-death humour around the bingo halls of the UK, this topic has taken it's lumps and bumps, yet here it is, still laboriously peddling its tired bicycle off the beaten track of common-sense and into the wilds of pure fantasy, where belief is suspended, like Roy Chubby Brown's pants, by a fading thread of boredom.

[APerno]

Hi Aperno,

Would Abberline have been sent back to H Division had Arnold and Reid not been on vacation?

Regards,

Simon

Don't ask me, tell me! My post was in the form of a question because what you suggested seemed to go against the JTR CW I often hear, so I thought you could enlighten me with more insight. (No sarcasm.)

[Simon Wood]

Hi Aperno,

Would Abberline have been sent back to H Division had Arnold and Reid not been on vacation?

Regards,

Simon

[APerno]

On the weekend of Polly Nichols’ murder, two of H Division's senior officers, Superintendent Thomas Arnold and Local Inspector [CID] Edmund Reid, began their annual leave, which gives us a fairly good indication of the importance attached to Polly Nichols’ murder [which actually took place in the adjacent J Division].

Abberline was brought in as a result of their temporary absence.

As to say the murder was not deemed important?

CW usually claims Abberline was brought back because of his familiarity with the ground and people, i.e. he would have been brought back regardless of need.

[rjpalmer]

The Diarist doesn't start ranting about Abberline until after the Chapman murder. Abberline was at the Chapman inquest, admittedly, but so were Helson, Thicke, and Badham, and it was Inspector Chandler, and not Abberline, who spoke at length. There's not a heck of a lot in the contemporary coverage that would jettison Fred Abberline to the forefront. As Gareth states, his prominence rose in the latter half of the 20th Century, with Donald McCormick, the MEPO files opening up, and the Michael Caine mini-series. Edwin Woodhull (1937) doesn't even mention Abberline in that masterpiece of accuracy, truth, and insight, When London Walked in Terror, though he does mention Warren, Macnaghten, Henderson, and Swanson. But, as Ike rightly states, one shouldn't "excite the mind" too much in thinking about such matters.

[Simon Wood]

On the weekend of Polly Nichols’ murder, two of H Division's senior officers, Superintendent Thomas Arnold and Local Inspector [CID] Edmund Reid, began their annual leave, which gives us a fairly good indication of the importance attached to Polly Nichols’ murder [which actually took place in the adjacent J Division].

Abberline was brought in as a result of their temporary absence.

[Sam Flynn]

Hello, Sam. hope you're well!

As far as ranking goes where would Abberline appear?

Hello Kaz

The overall head of H Division (Whitechapel) was Superintendent Thomas Arnold. Chief Inspector Donald Swanson was appointed to take charge of the Ripper enquiry on the ground. Inspector Edmund Reid was head of H Division CID, and both he and Inspector Abberline reported to Swanson.

[Kaz]

Donald Swanson, Thomas Arnold, Edmund Reid and Sir Robert Anderson and Sir Charles Warren got pretty decent coverage in the press, but none of them are mentioned in the Diary. Sir Charles Warren, whose fame/infamy preceded the Whitechapel Murders, whose resignation was arguably caused by the Ripper and whose name appeared many times in connection with the case, is mentioned but once. In contrast, Michael Caine off the telly - sorry! - Abberline gets seventeen mentions that I've counted, and it may be higher.

Abberline's profile rose significantly in the latter half of the 20th Century. He was particularly prominent in B-movies and TV dramatisations, perhaps providing an almost romantic Holmesian figure for the audience to focus on. Abberline was certainly an important player in the case, but having only read the odd sensationalist book and seen the odd film, I used to be under the impression that he was in charge of the whole operation. That was before I became a ripperologist, and I know now that he was only one among many.

Hello, Sam. hope you're well!

As far as ranking goes where would Abberline appear?


I've forgotten the importance of his name appearing so much..

[Sam Flynn]

I am not a Diary supporter, but it would seem to me that Maybrick would be aware only of police matters via the newspapers and the street chatter; for Maybrick to be able to parse McWilliam (City of London) from Abberline, just days after the Eddows murder, to me, would be suspect.

Donald Swanson, Thomas Arnold, Edmund Reid, Sir Robert Anderson and Sir Charles Warren got pretty decent coverage in the press, but none of them are mentioned in the Diary. Sir Charles Warren, whose fame/infamy preceded the Whitechapel Murders, whose resignation was arguably caused by the Ripper and whose name appeared many times in connection with the case, is mentioned but once. In contrast, Michael Caine off the telly - sorry! - Abberline gets seventeen mentions that I've counted, and it may be higher.

Abberline's profile rose significantly in the latter half of the 20th Century. He was particularly prominent in B-movies and TV dramatisations, perhaps providing an almost romantic Holmesian figure for the audience to focus on. Abberline was certainly an important player in the case, but having only read the odd sensationalist book and seen the odd film, I used to be under the impression that he was in charge of the whole operation. That was before I became a ripperologist, and I know now that he was only one among many.

[Iconoclast]

But I am not a Diary supporter.

Honestly, APerno, your point is valid whether you are a scrapbook-supporter or detractor. Your rather nervous post is symptomatic of how this Casebook has made people terrified of being 'misunderstood' as pro-Maybrick (which, I suspect, is why we get so few posts arguing for anything that might support Maybrick's case to be Jack - this has improved over recent times but it's definitely an issue, exemplified by your post, I have to say).

If you have an opinion, just state it. It doesn't need to be qualified in any way.

Ike

[APerno]

Ike, doesn't your man Maybrick make one heck of a blunder when writing about the Eddowes' murder? He obsesses about Kate's meager belongings, the 'whore's knife,' the sugar and tea, the infamous tin matchbox empty, etc., then writes (apparently alluding to the pawn ticket):

Oh, Mr. Abberline he is a clever little man
he keeps back all that he can.

I don't recall if you dealt with this before, but one would think that someone this obsessed with Abberline would be aware that Kate died in the City of London Police jurisdiction, and McWilliam would have had charge of the investigation. Abberline would have had bugger-all to do with it, or in "keeping back" a clue. Your reflections, sir?

At the very least, it would suggest that the author was a second-rate 'Ripperologist'

I am not a Diary supporter, but it would seem to me that Maybrick would be aware only of police matters via the newspapers and the street chatter; for Maybrick to be able to parse McWilliam (City of London) from Abberline, just days after the Eddows murder, to me, would be suspect. IMO having the murderer fixate on Abberline actually makes more sense, even when it is incorrect. But I am not a Diary supporter.

[Iconoclast]

Ike, doesn't your man Maybrick make one heck of a blunder when writing about the Eddowes' murder? He obsesses about Kate's meager belongings, the 'whore's knife,' the sugar and tea, the infamous tin matchbox empty, etc., then writes (apparently alluding to the pawn ticket):

Oh, Mr. Abberline he is a clever little man
he keeps back all that he can.

I don't recall if you dealt with this before, but one would think that someone this obsessed with Abberline would be aware that Kate died in the City of London Police jurisdiction, and McWilliam would have had charge of the investigation. Abberline would have had bugger-all to do with it, or in "keeping back" a clue. Your reflections, sir?

At the very least, it would suggest that the author was a second-rate 'Ripperologist'

You've got two options there, Roger:

1) The scrapbook is a hoax and the hoaxer homed-in on Abberline for reasons only he or she can accounbt for, or
2) The scrapbook is the work of Jack the Ripper and he could write anything he wanted to because - he might have argued - he was the original Ripperologist.

Either way, it's not a point to excite the mind in my book, I'm afraid, old bean.

Ike