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  • #61
    Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
    Hi DJA,

    Someone signed a police statement with a variety of differing signatures, and was never interviewed by a national or local newspaper.

    Regards,

    Simon
    The signatures on the witness statement pages are practically identical, barring one or two outlying letters, and furthermore match the multiple signatures of one George William Topping Hutchinson, recorded over a long period of time. George William Topping Hutchinson WAS the Mary Kelly witness, and it's as simple as that.
    Kind regards, Sam Flynn

    "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Wickerman View Post

      Hi Christer.

      Yes, of course. Hutchinson is touching on two points.
      First, the fact these streets are supposed to be patrolled by police at all hours of the day & night, and Dorset street apparently was not - he is making a complaint.
      Second, unless you believe the killer was a woman, or alternately, unless you think that the police believed the killer was a woman, then Hutchinson only makes reference to seeing a man because that is what the police are interested in.
      In other words he is likely responding to an obvious question - "did you see any other suspicious characters that night?" Hence, his reply to only seeing one man.

      It is in his Daily News interview, Jon, and he thus was not asked anything by the police at all. Instead, he seems to offer the information on his own account, and he is not telling the reporter that he saw no other man. He is telling the reporter that he saw "no one else". Not a living soul, man OR woman.
      It is and remains a total anomaly, unless - as I say - we take it upon ourselves to offer some very peculiar explanations.


      Ok, at the risk of being pedantic here. He makes no reference to "the corner of the court" in his police statement, that came in the press interview.
      So, first lets deal with what he DID say in his police statement.

      "I then went to the court to see if I could see them, but could not.
      I stood there for about three quarters of an hour to see if they came out they did not so I went away"


      Which suggests he was standing outside (re: he said "came out") the court for 3/4 of an hour, so that is where he left from - somewhere in Dorset street.

      Now, what do we read in the press statement?

      "I went to look up the court to see if I could see them, but could not.
      I stood there for three quarters of an hour to see if they came down again, but they did not, and so I went away."


      Which also suggests he was outside the court in Dorset street, as he said "came down", meaning down the passage. So obviously he is waiting out in the street.
      His story is equally applicable to a man standing on either the north side or the south side of Dorset street.

      Yes - until we take a look at the press interview, where he expands on WHERE he actually stood. And the corner of the court IS outside the court. So the question becomes why on earth we would reason that he told the press porkies or that the press invented things to spice matters up. He stood at the corner of the court, as per his own admission. If he had denied standing at the corner of the court when speaking to the police, it would have been a radically different matter, but he never does. It all adds up, therefore.

      It strikes me as you are struggling very hard to eliminate Hutchinson as a reliable witness.

      Then you are very wrong, Jon, because I actually believe he was a very reliable witness when it comes to the details. But I believe he mistook the days - which would explain a whole lot of things that are otherwise left inexplicably unexplainable.

      I had managed to stay out of this Hutchinson thread for almost three days.....
      Maybe we shouldn't turn this into another "lets stick it to Hutch" thread?
      Well, that of course is anybody´s choice. I can only offer my take on things, and I certainly do not stick it to Hutchinson. I don´t think he had anything at all to do with the murders, and I believe he was intent on doing the right thing when seeking out the police, I think he signed his testimony with his real name, and I do not think it is a coincidence that Frank Leander came to the conclusion that the witness was Toppy - who, according to his own son was a very good observer and patently honest.
      This is how I see the matter, and if anything, the debates that have gone down out here have convinced me even more about it.

      And now, some tea!
      Last edited by Fisherman; 05-14-2020, 06:22 PM.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post

        The signatures on the witness statement pages are practically identical, barring one or two outlying letters, and furthermore match the multiple signatures of one George William Topping Hutchinson, recorded over a long period of time. George William Topping Hutchinson WAS the Mary Kelly witness, and it's as simple as that.
        Since we have so often disagreed over matters, I´ll take the opportunity to salute you on this one - yes, yes and once again yes!

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by mpriestnall View Post
          So let's see if I've got it right:

          Lechmere killed Nichols
          Cadosche killed Chapman
          Schwartz killed Stride
          Lawende killed Eddowes
          Hutchinson killed Kelly

          Looks like case closed, final solution to me!



          Martyn
          Well thankyou much, you've just opened up another avenue for a theory where Lechmere, Cadosche, Schwartz Lawende & Hutch conspired as members of some as yet unknown club or society attempting to clean up Whitechapel?

          Another Agatha Christie solution, anyone?
          Regards, Jon S.

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post

            The signatures on the witness statement pages are practically identical, barring one or two outlying letters, and furthermore match the multiple signatures of one George William Topping Hutchinson, recorded over a long period of time. George William Topping Hutchinson WAS the Mary Kelly witness, and it's as simple as that.
            Indeed! the signatures look the same, however were they all written by Topping? I'll abstain on that for now.
            Regards, Jon S.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by Wickerman View Post

              Indeed! the signatures look the same, however were they all written by Topping? I'll abstain on that for now.
              You're free to abstain, Jon, but for me, who was formerly vocally anti-Topping, I've no doubt whatsoever that they were.
              Kind regards, Sam Flynn

              "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Wickerman View Post

                Well thankyou much, you've just opened up another avenue for a theory where Lechmere, Cadosche, Schwartz Lawende & Hutch conspired as members of some as yet unknown club or society attempting to clean up Whitechapel?

                Another Agatha Christie solution, anyone?
                Did the Orient Express run through the East End by any chance?

                Not funny, or makes any sense but it's the best I can do!
                Last edited by mpriestnall; 05-17-2020, 05:02 PM.
                Write something...

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by mpriestnall View Post

                  Did the Orient Express run through the East End by any chance?

                  Not funny, or makes any sense but it's the best I can do!
                  Nope, can't do any better. Orient Express pun it is.

                  That book would have been very different if it was Murder on the National Express.
                  Thems the Vagaries.....

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Hello Simon...

                    ...and Merry Christmas.

                    Here's one to contemplate during quarantine: Dr. Robert Anderson spreading a little early holiday cheer down at the Victoria Home for Working Men, Commercial Street, Whitechapel, in December 1889. Whether this indicates that Anderson had some sort of theological affiliation with the Home, I can not say. Perhaps Sir Bob only felt that Lord Rowton required police escort when visiting the great unwashed in the East End. It is said that Georg Hutchinson clapped louder than most on hearing Michael Maybrick's "Nancy Lee."

                    Click image for larger version

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                    • #70
                      Hi RJ,

                      Thanks for that.

                      The Victoria Home must have been rocking, with the dandelion and burdock flowing freely.

                      I'm amazed Robert Anderson didn't round off the evening by taking matters in hand and giving one of his homilies on the perils of masturbation.

                      Stay safe.

                      Simon
                      Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Kattrup View Post

                        Great, thanks.
                        The illustration you posted is from study in scarlet, from 1891.
                        How did Abberline in 1888 know that Geo H was a Hutchinson?

                        If Abberline was not duped, why did he write a memo detailing his examination of GH?
                        Hi Simon, good that you’re back. Have you had a chance to reflect on the questions above?

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                          Hi RJ,

                          Thanks for that.

                          The Victoria Home must have been rocking, with the dandelion and burdock flowing freely.

                          I'm amazed Robert Anderson didn't round off the evening by taking matters in hand and giving one of his homilies on the perils of masturbation.

                          Stay safe.

                          Simon
                          "Taking matters in hand"...I got it. I got it. Good one.

                          c.d.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Al Bundy's Eyes View Post

                            Nope, can't do any better. Orient Express pun it is.

                            That book would have been very different if it was Murder on the National Express.
                            Thanks Al. Though you shouldn't encourage me!
                            Write something...

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