Hutch Photo

[Phil Carter]

I am trying to do another version of this pic atm... hopefully will be able to set it up

if not..

Merry Xmas all

Phil

[DVV]

Hi Phil and Garry,

in fact, Mr Astrakhan sports only a "slight moustache" in the police statement.
The only suspect with a "full moustache" is Blotchy.

Bonnes fêtes,
David

[DVV]

Quite David..

And another thing. Hutchinson said that he met Mary, she asked him for 6d, got the negative, and turned and walked away from him. She then met a man coming towards her, and after a short chat, they turned back towards Hutch, and he stooped to look at the man's face.
What I dont get, is IF Mary KNEW Hutchinson, as a friend, why didn't Hutchinson say, for ex, "Mary looked at me and smiled, or winked, or said tatta".. he doesn't mention Mary. Just this man she was with.
Look, what I'm trying to get at is that IF Mary was his good friend of three years, she would have said "night night Hutchinson" as she passed. I'm sure thats normal...isn't it?

best wishes

Phil

Hi Phil,

and the only person in the VH who knew Mary for 3 years and used to give her money at times is...?

Amitiés,
David

[Garry Wroe]

Mr Astrakhan sports only a "slight moustache" in the police statement.The only suspect with a "full moustache" is Blotchy.

You spotted the deliberate mistake, Dave!

Have a happy Christmas.

Garry Wroe.

[Archaic]

Why Mary Didn't Greet Hutch A 2nd Time While With Astrakhan Man

Hutchinson said that he met Mary, she asked him for 6d, got the negative, and turned and walked away from him. She then met a man coming towards her, and after a short chat, they turned back towards Hutch, and he stooped to look at the man's face.

What I dont get, is IF Mary KNEW Hutchinson, as a friend, why didn't Hutchinson say, for ex, "Mary looked at me and smiled, or winked, or said tatta".. he doesn't mention Mary. Just this man she was with.

Look, what I'm trying to get at is that IF Mary was his good friend of three years, she would have said "night night Hutchinson" as she passed. I'm sure thats normal...isn't it?

Hi, everyone. I don't think it's odd that as Mary came back towards Hutch with Astrakhan Man she didn't say hello again to George in passing.

The reason? She's a PROSTITUTE. This man walking back towards George with her is her CLIENT.

She had already spoken to Hutch, he knew she was a prostitute in need of money, he saw the man "pick her up"-Hutch & Mary both know the drill!

Mary isn't stupid. Why would she smile, wink or speak to Hutch again when she knows full well she'd be running the risk of making her new client
angry by causing him to wonder if Hutch is her boyfriend, her lover or her pimp??

It would be a very foolish business practice on Mary's part to smile and speak to ANY other men on the street once she has her client
in tow.

Instead, she's going to give her client ALL her attention and hope it pays off.

George understood this.

Best Regards & Merry Christmas everybody, Archaic

[jason_c]

Quite David..

And another thing. Hutchinson said that he met Mary, she asked him for 6d, got the negative, and turned and walked away from him. She then met a man coming towards her, and after a short chat, they turned back towards Hutch, and he stooped to look at the man's face.
What I dont get, is IF Mary KNEW Hutchinson, as a friend, why didn't Hutchinson say, for ex, "Mary looked at me and smiled, or winked, or said tatta".. he doesn't mention Mary. Just this man she was with.
Look, what I'm trying to get at is that IF Mary was his good friend of three years, she would have said "night night Hutchinson" as she passed. I'm sure thats normal...isn't it?

best wishes

Phil

Nothing is quite normal behaviour for a drunken prostitute out looking for a trick. This wasnt The Waltons.

[DVV]

If so, Hutch's behaviour from Friday to Tuesday is a bit like that of a drunken prostitute, I'm afraid.

Amitiés,
David

[perrymason]

This is all quite interesting.....but.....where is the evidence aside from Mr Hutchinson that suggests Mary ever left her room after 11:45pm?

All is well and good to assume this or that about what all prostitutes in Victorian England did with every spare minute of their time.....but it seems fairly clear to me that this woman was not in the habit of working conscientiously and paying her bills with that "whoring" money....and her landlord never says a word that she was nearing eviction....and it was pouring rain outside when her lights go out and the singing stops. And we have a witness who spoke with the woman before she goes out that same evening and says that Mary was despondent over her life on the streets.

So,.....at what time does Mary miraculously realize that she must work that night in the cold hard rain despite her despondency at having to do so at all anytime...and who is it that does anything to corroborate Hutchs claim that he saw Mary outside her room with someone at around 2am?

And really,....isnt this all about someones story who was stated by the police...who took it Monday night....that on Wednesday night it was not believed any longer.

This man is the bane of Ripperology as far as Im concerned, moreso than Packer....because anyone can see Packers motives for lying...a hope he gets some money from it.

Best regards all.

[DVV]

This man is the bane of Ripperology as far as Im concerned, moreso than Packer....because anyone can see Packers motives for lying...a hope he gets some money from it.

Come one, Mike, why the world did that man go to the station on Monday?

Amitiés,
David

[perrymason]

Come one, Mike, why the world did that man go to the station on Monday?

Amitiés,
David

Because Sarah Lewis saw someone loitering around that area he thought could have been him. I never would suggest that he wasnt hanging around Dorset....he may well have been, or not.....although no-one else sees him....

Im not saying that we dont have reason to suspect his possible complicity in the murders by the fact he places himself in the shoes of Sarahs suspicious man....I am saying we have no reason to believe the story he tells that includes Mary Kelly.

Does anyone from Kellys inner circle later state that they knew Hutch too after hearing this tale....or that they could attest to Mary knowing him? Nope.

My best David

[perrymason]

We have far too many witnesses whose statements are strongly considered without any proof or corroboration validating their claims....Packer, Israel, Hutch, Cross, ......

Im just saying David that no burden of proof has been met in any of their stories....and in this one, we have the Police statements saying that they didnt believe it after they investigated it,.... with his help.

Cheers mate

[DVV]

In fact, Mike, we don't know clearly on which point, and why, the police ceased to believe Hutch.
It was not, imo, something strong, definitve and general...
They started to have doubts...We can't say how and why precisely...

As to me, I don't believe anything from Hutch, except that he knew Mary for about 3 years and used to give her money at times.

Bourgogne!

[perrymason]

In fact, Mike, we don't know clearly on which point, and why, the police ceased to believe Hutch.
It was not, imo, something strong, definitve and general...
They started to have doubts...We can't say how and why precisely...

As to me, I don't believe anything from Hutch, except that he knew Mary for about 3 years and used to give her money at times.

Bourgogne!

It would be nice to know why they said his story was "discredited"...that they said that at all however is good enough for me.

Au revoir pour maintenant....

[DVV]

Ah no, Mike!
It makes a huge difference...And he could have been discredited for various reasons.
Perhaps: "he hasn't watched the man so carefully, and therefore can't know him again".
Or : "he wasn't there, he doesn't match Lewis loiterer, he hasn't seen Kelly at such a time."
Or: "He's even not a friend of Kelly".
Or simply: "He talks to the press too much. Leave him."

What I can't understand is that they never suspected him.

Amitiés,
David

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

A few days after George Hutchinson's appearance following the MJK inquest the story below appeared in half-a-dozen or so American and Canadian newspapers, and, in January 1889, the Pall Mall Gazette.

New York Herald, 16th November 1888
AN ILLINOIS "RIPPER

George Hutchinson Murdered a Woman in Whitechapel Style
[BY TELEGRAPH TO THE HERALD]

Chicago, Nov. 15, 1888:
"A dispatch from Elgin, Illinois, says that seven or eight years ago a man named George Hutchinson, an inmate of the asylum there, delighted to visit the hospital slaughter house, making many peculiar toys from bones. He was an expert with the knife. After escaping from Elgin he was captured at Kankakee and placed in the insane asylum there.

"He escaped from that place and afterward murdered a disreputable woman in Chicago, mutilating her body in a way similar to the Whitechapel cases. He was returned to Kankakee, but afterward escaped, and has been at large three or four years. It is thought by some that he may be the Whitechapel fiend.

"The police here do not remember him."

Which isn't surprising. More later.

Regards,

Simon