Did the Seaside Home ID happen?

[Monty]

Mitre Court is seconds away from Kings Bench Walk.

One for the Druittists out there.

Monty

[pinkmoon]

[QUOTE=Monty;343798]Mitre Court is seconds away from Kings Bench Walk.

One for the Druittists out there.

Monty
[/QUOTE
Could Druitt have been making his way to safety after nearly getting caught red handed the little love must have got the shock of his life when he was disturbed with Liz stride may be he thought it time to head to safety and on the way he bumped into Catherine and found her just to tempting.

[lynn cates]

yup

Hello Phil. Yes, indeed. Those are my feelings as well.

Perhaps he later recalled more about one of those two and it tallied with another description?

Cheers.
LC

[pinkmoon]

If a policeman saw kosminski shortly before or after poor Catherine's murder and was known to this policeman as say the local loon it wouldn't take them to long to track him down and then what?I think the next step would be to put him under surveillance .

[Wickerman]

There may have been several local lunatics known to police across the East End, many of them watched at different times, just none of them named.

[Jeff Leahy]

Colin.
Many have suggested that the PC referred to was either Watkins or Harvey, but there is no rational reason why either of these constables would omit that testimony from the inquest.
Secondly, that even if it were another PC entirely, that such a witness would not be summoned to the inquest, nor mentioned in any subsequent reports by McWilliam, is also questionable.
The suggestion fails at the first hurdle.

If the statement reflects any truth at all, it must be an indirect association which only surfaced later, after the inquest had terminated, perhaps some time after.

I believe it is possible that this PC only came forward after Kozminski was brought up as a suspect, and he was recognised by a beat constable who patrolled the streets near Mitre Square.
Sadly, we have no idea when Kozminski was first suspected.

Hi Jon

I think your City PC theory most interesting. As for when Kozminski first came to police attention then if Rob Houses Batty Street theory is correct we can estimate Sunday 14th October 1888.

Cox follows his suspect unto March 1889, and thats when MacNaughten says Kozminski goes into an asylum. (Private Asylum Surrey)

The ID however makes most sense if it happens shortly before Kozminski goes into Colney Hatch February 1891.

The only possible explanation for this apparent discrepancy in time, is we are looking at two completely different events that happen to the same suspect at different times.

MacNaughten does not know anything about Kozminski or what happened to him after March 1889 so I think his City PC witness has nothing to do with the later Seaside Home ID but is related to the earlier survey lance

Many thanks

Yours jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

I noted with interested in this mornings Daily Mail that a new picture of Issac has been published.

If this photograph is of Isaac surely it gives some credence to a Holloway connection. Surely the pretence of Aaron Kozminski as a poor Polish Jew eating from the gutter can know longer be 'argued in earnest by the Kosminski neah sayers..

If it is Issac it is a remarkable new incite into the Kozminski family that holds out far more wealth than previously considered

It also opens up questions of Shabbey gentile and the clothes that might have been available to Aaron, especially if he choose to change his appearance after the double event and the Batty Street incident. Could the man described by Hutchinson have been Kozminski?

Yours Jeff

[Trevor Marriott]

I noted with interested in this mornings Daily Mail that a new picture of Issac has been published.

If this photograph is of Isaac surely it gives some credence to a Holloway connection. Surely the pretence of Aaron Kozminski as a poor Polish Jew eating from the gutter can know longer be 'argued in earnest by the Kosminski neah sayers..

If it is Issac it is a remarkable new incite into the Kozminski family that holds out far more wealth than previously considered

It also opens up questions of Shabbey gentile and the clothes that might have been available to Aaron, especially if he choose to change his appearance after the double event and the Batty Street incident. Could the man described by Hutchinson have been Kozminski?

Yours Jeff

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[Sam Flynn]

If it is Issac it is a remarkable new incite into the Kozminski family that holds out far more wealth than previously considered

As I've suggested in Another Place, the photographer's studio in question came into its heyday during the 1920s. The girl in the photograph looks to be in her mid-20s so, if she is Matilda Kozminski, that would date the photo somewhere in the mid-to-late 1910s. This puts a gap of almost 30 years between the Ripper murders and the taking of that photograph - ample time for the Kozminski clan to rise from rags to riches.

[Jeff Leahy]

As I've suggested in Another Place, the photographer's studio in question came into its heyday during the 1920s. The girl in the photograph looks to be in her mid-20s so, if she is Matilda Kozminski, that would date the photo somewhere in the mid-to-late 1910s. This puts a gap of almost 30 years between the Ripper murders and the taking of that photograph - ample time for the Kozminski clan to rise from rags to riches.

Hi Gareth

Yes I'm now getting other suggestions for the Photo, Possibly Isaac with his children, trying to get a more accurate date on that dress and neckline you mention..

However it remains at least interesting that these photographs are now coming into the public domain and support the argument I have been putting forward for sometime that the Kozminski's were wealthier than previously believed. The pictures of Matilda and Morris also supporting this

I'm also interested in that Nose, very distinctive if someone was truly interested in creating a likeness of Aaron himself.

Its been argued else where (and reasonably in my view) that the kozminski's could not have afforded Holloway a middle class asylum, I'm increasing becoming more uncertain about this especially given the suggested link between the Police Seaside Home and the Holloway Brighton convalescent Home i.e. next door to each other.

Not quiet sure what Trevor is saying OKI about?

Yours Jeff

[Howard Brown]

Jeff:
Just to excite you even more....I just located this photo from approx. 1897....one with a fellow said to be Ignatz "Fuzzy" Kozminski and his teen bride, Sarah Streisand-Kozminski.
Pretty handsome guy, ain't he ?

[Mayerling]

Jeff:
Just to excite you even more....I just located this photo from approx. 1897....one with a fellow said to be Ignatz "Fuzzy" Kozminski and his teen bride, Sarah Streisand-Kozminski.
Pretty handsome guy, ain't he ?

I like their taste in outfits Howard.

Jeff

[Howard Brown]

Jeff:
Yeah, they do look like the goods, don't they ?

[Jeff Leahy]

Jeff:
Just to excite you even more....I just located this photo from approx. 1897....one with a fellow said to be Ignatz "Fuzzy" Kozminski and his teen bride, Sarah Streisand-Kozminski.
Pretty handsome guy, ain't he ?

I think your bias here Howard, Its a cool rash.. (I mean Tash)

The neckline is still higher than the one in the Issac Photo, so i think its more likely 1910

Could be Issac and his children. I've no doubt whoever owns the photo genuinely believes its Issac

Yours Jeff

[Sam Flynn]

Yes I'm now getting other suggestions for the Photo, Possibly Isaac with his children, trying to get a more accurate date on that dress and neckline you mention.

Thanks Jeff

I know you're following both boards, but to summarise what's going on over at Howard's site:

Debra Arif has established that the photographer, "Henry Shaw" (aka Chaim Shockaczewski), was only born in 1880 - so this photograph is highly unlikely to be Late Victorian. On that basis, it's no wonder that Ed Stow couldn't find Shaw's studio listed in the 1899 Trade Directory - the kid would surely have been too young to have owned his own studio by that time.

In addition, I've found online a few of Shaw's photos (from his "Rembrandt Studio" in 76-78 Commercial Road), which stem from the early 1920s. Finally, the girl in the photo looks to be in her 20s, and Matilda Kozminski was born in 1890.

All the above points to the strong probability that the photo was taken sometime after 1910. If you can find a firm date, and establish the actual identities of the sitters, that would be brilliant.