Suspect battle: Cross/Lechmere vs. Hutchinson

[John Wheat]

Far better than a random murderer who killed his wife like chapman or bury

and far better than a random mad jew who was locked in an asylum like Kosmenski, Levy, Hayam, Cohen, Kamnsky

and far better than a random doctor .......
or a random suicider who happened to kill himself that time...
or a random royal family member.

.

Bury was not a random murderer he used the same M.O. as four of the C5. Strangulation followed by mutilation. Bury's wife Ellen was an ex prostitute. The murders began shortly after Bury arrived in London and ceased shortly after he left London. Bury matches all the psych profiles extremely well.

[Elamarna]

Which murder would that be? Chapmans, where Cadosh heard the thumping sound against the fence, Strides, where Schwartz heard Lis cry out three times or Kelly´s, where two women heard her cry "Oh, murder!"?

Oh, you mean the Eddowes murder! I see!

Fish

If what Cadosh heard was indeed Chapman, does that not create time issues for Lechmere?


Steve.

[Elamarna]

Far better than a random murderer who killed his wife like chapman or bury

and far better than a random mad jew who was locked in an asylum like Kosmenski, Levy, Hayam, Cohen, Kamnsky

and far better than a random doctor .......
or a random suicider who happened to kill himself that time...
or a random royal family member.

.

How do you define random? you seem to have a strange use of the word.

Which doctor are you talking about as being random.

As far as i was aware the royal family member was anything but Random, and completely innocent to boot.


Steve

[Columbo]

This is the answer why Lechmere didn't flee...

he simply hadn't any other choice!

This case is closed.

Not really. he had plenty of time to take off in the other direction. If he was as cool and collected as alleged in the theory he would have no problem getting by anyone else he came across.

Columbo

[Fisherman]

Cadosch heard something. Did he hear the killer?

Schwartz's account is dubious. Mrs. Mortimer was standing outside her door around the time of Stride's murder and she didn't hear a thing.

It was never established that "Oh murder!" emanated from Kelly.

And all of this means that it was not established that the murders were silent.
Which, if I am not mistaken, was your point...?

[Fisherman]

Fish

If what Cadosh heard was indeed Chapman, does that not create time issues for Lechmere?


Steve.

I think that depends on where the carman was at the time. If you can prove he was elsewhere, then yes, it creates problems.

[Columbo]

all other murders the victims had been seen with some person or the another soon before they had been butchered.... Tabram, Chapman, Stride, Eddows, Kelly

except with Nichols, no one had seen here after she left except Paul, with her killer..

Tabram was not seen with anyone right before she was killed, it was a few hours before. Chapman and Stride were. Stride was the only one seen being assaulted. Eddowes was also seen with someone soon before and not far from where she was found. Kelly was seen several hours before with someone who probably wasn't her killer.

Columbo

[Columbo]

I think that depends on where the carman was at the time. If you can prove he was elsewhere, then yes, it creates problems.

That's true but there's no evidence Lechmere was there either. There's a possibility he may have delivered in the area but since Pickfords records don't go back that far how do we know?

Columbo

[Rainbow]

Not really. he had plenty of time to take off in the other direction. If he was as cool and collected as alleged in the theory he would have no problem getting by anyone else he came across.

Columbo

No one had seen a soul.

He was trapped like a mouse in a tube, between John Neil the police-constable from one side and Robert Paul from the other side, while the blood was still running from the victim's neck.

[Harry D]

And all of this means that it was not established that the murders were silent.
Which, if I am not mistaken, was your point...?

There are insufficient sightings or sounds of the killer, therefore Rainbow's point is moot. The chances of another killer dispatching Nichols without anyone hearing or seeing a thing are not out of the ordinary.

[Columbo]

Far better than a random murderer who killed his wife like chapman or bury

and far better than a random mad jew who was locked in an asylum like Kosmenski, Levy, Hayam, Cohen, Kamnsky

and far better than a random doctor .......
or a random suicider who happened to kill himself that time...
or a random royal family member.

.

It could've been a random doctor, or a random suicide, mad Jewish person, etc. And yes if you saw Bury in Buck's row before or after the discovery of the body then yes he would be a better suspect then Lechmere, who has no record of violence towards anyone as far as we know.

Columbo

[Harry D]

Off-topic: Anyone else find it sketchy how Fisherman & Rainbow appear to come and go at the same time? I'm not saying, I'm just saying.

[Columbo]

No one had seen a soul.

He was trapped like a mouse in a tube, between John Neil the police-constable from one side and Robert Paul from the other side, while the blood was still running from the victim's neck.

No he wasn't trapped at all. I'm not sure you understood my initial response. If he could get passed Mizen he could get passed Neil. This has been argued enough times that a rehash here is UN-necessary.

Columbo

[Rainbow]

It could've been a random doctor, or a random suicide, mad Jewish person, etc. And yes IF you saw Bury in Buck's row before or after the discovery of the body then yes he would be a better suspect then Lechmere, who has no record of violence towards anyone as far as we know.

Columbo

What a BIG 'if' you have there Columbo...

If Bury was in Buck's row at the time of the murder, then we don't need even his record of violence..


It is clear that you don't understand what serial killers are, you even don't seem to understand what was Jack the Ripper M.O to think Ellen was also like the other victims

Serial killers don't sleep with knives under their heads, don't hit and slap their wives in public and then kill them and go to the police...
!

[Elamarna]

There was no place for that phantom killer except to fly with two wings in the sky, although I will still dought this possibility or it will be heard flying too

John Neil, police-constable said in the inquest:

Yesterday morning I was proceeding down Buck's-row, Whitechapel, going towards Brady-street. There was not a soul about. I had been round there half an hour previously, and I saw no one then.

So we can limit the time of death/attack to no more than about 30minutes before he finds it. Good.

There was a pool of blood just where her neck was lying. It was running from the wound in her neck.

The Coroner: Did you hear any noise that night?

Witness: No; I heard nothing. The farthest I had been that night was just through the Whitechapel-road and up Baker's-row. I was never far away from the spot.

Yes he was certainly far enough away to not hear an attack.

and we know he discovered the body of the victim soon after Lechmere and Paul went searching for a policeman.

Yes.

Alfred Malshaw , a night watchman in Winthorpe-street, had also heard no cries or noise. In a straight line he was about thirty yards from the spot where the deceased was found.

No one heard Eddowes in Mitre Square and night watchman Morris was far closer to the murder spot than Malshaw was to the one in Bucks Row.

Police-constable John Thail stated that the nearest point on his beat to Buck's- row was Brady-street. He passed the end every thirty minutes on the Thursday night, and nothing attracted his attention until 3.45 a.m.

Fits with Neil does. does not pinpoint attack time other than saying he noticed nothing until 3.45.

However would he have noticed anything anyway?
He did not patrol Bucks Row?

Sergeant Kerby passed also down Buck's Row and saw nothing.

Again about half hour before Neil.

this side of the the row was closed by the police constable Neil for the phantom killer to flee, and the other side of the row was closed too by Paul, and the blood was still running from the wound on the victim's neck.

No if he was not Lechmere he had already gone.

Neil was not there at the same time as Paul and Lechmere, there were several possible means of exit.

if he was not Lechmere, then he must had flown in the sky

Such a comment is pointless. And ignore the facts set out above.


Three of observations are made about the scene some 30 or so minutes before the discovery of the body.

They do however allow us to discard ideas that the body was there for a long time, but they do not narrow the window for attack any more than that.

The night watchmans report can be directly compared to that of Morris in Mitre Square, he heard nothing too.

Interestingly it seems Malshaw he did not hear the actual attack or Lechmere and Paul either.

None of that pinpoints the attack time. it certainly does not prove it was Lechmere.



Steve