Alternative entrences / exits to #29 Hanbury crime scene?

[RockySullivan]

It is a question of timing isn't it, more than anything. Dr Phillips gave a time of death for Annie of about 4:30am, and possibly earlier (though he amended his opinion about the coolness of the body later at the inquest).

If we accept that Dr Phillips is correct then the killer murdered Annie in the yard in complete darkness and everyone in the house except for Thompson, who'd gone to work, was probably asleep. Little chance of anyone glimpsing a knife from neighbouring windows, then.

Richardson arrived in the yard at around 4:45am, and whether he had a knife or not, he would, I agree, have either spotted the Ripper rapidly departing or seen Annie Chapman's body lying in front of him as he stood/sat on the steps.

Now the trouble with this is that, even today, estimation of time of death by medical professionals is often just a little bit more than an educated guess.

What is more, if Phillips is right, it completely knocks away the evidence of Mrs Long/Durrell (who may or may not have seen Annie and her client at about 5:15 am - 5:30am) and Albert Cadosch, who definitely heard a bump against the fence at around 5:30am.

It couldn't have been Annie making the fence rock as, according to the good doctor, she'd been dead for an hour. Their times are messed up but Wynne Baxter believed Cadosch and Long and discounted Phillips' evidence. Are you suggesting that Richardson was skulking around his mother's yard before 4:30am and was still there moving Annie's body at 5:30am? Hope not!

I didn't realize the market opened at 5. Perhaps Long was mistaken and the two she saw were a prostitute & John but not annnie.

[RockySullivan]

I don't know richardson was in the yard with a knife that's suspicious. Are there holes in it yea but what's the deal with him saying the guy in the street was "the real leather apron? Seems like a nut trying to avert suspicion. That statement makes him all the more suspicious IMO. I'm not gonna say Its proven he's the ripper like the BS Lechmere theory but richardsons def a better suspect than him

[RockySullivan]

I don't know richardson was in the yard with a knife that's suspicious. Are there holes in it yea but what's the deal with him saying the guy in the street was "the real leather apron? Seems like a nut trying to avert suspicion. That statement makes him all the more suspicious IMO. I'm not gonna say Its proven he's the ripper like the BS Lechmere theory but richardsons def a better suspect than him

I do understand why Lechmere is a person of interest, he lied. And richardson lies too. I just find richardsons lies a whole more damning Then Lechs.

[RockySullivan]

I do understand why Lechmere is a person of interest, he lied. And richardson lies too. I just find richardsons lies a whole more damning Then Lechs.

Simply put he admitted to being right next to the spot at the time when the Dr said a body would be with a knife.

[GUT]

Simply put he admitted to being right next to the spot at the time when the Dr said a body would be with a knife.

But of course he was an absolute liar, who couldn't tell the truth if his life depended on it, but about the one issue that could put his neck in a noose he told the truth.

It all makes complete sense to me now.

[RockySullivan]

But of course he was an absolute liar, who couldn't tell the truth if his life depended on it, but about the one issue that could put his neck in a noose he told the truth.

It all makes complete sense to me now.

So was not in the yard with a knife cutting his boot? Or was he in the yard with a knife on the steps...and worried someone saw him (maybe someone did)? I wonder if he was really alone and would richardson Associated with ...

[martin wilson]

Hi all

The Coroner asked Amelia Richardson about the leather apron, "It is rather a dangerous thing to wear,is it not?" She replied "yes" which suggests to me that she was aware of the suspicion about 'leather apron' Perhaps that's why Richardson stopped wearing it, who knows?, we do know she was exact about the date she took it from the cellar to wash it, September 6th, and it was still there two days later.
If Richardson only wore it for cellar work, why would it be a dangerous thing to wear? Who would see him?
Basically we have a suspect who stopped wearing a leather apron. had a knife and Anne Chapman in his back yard. A coincidence too far?
All the best.

[martin wilson]

Hi all

On the other hand Francis Tyler, employee of Amelia Richardson. should have been there a 6 a.m, but had to be sent for but didn't arrive until 8 a.m, as he was wont to do when trade was 'slack', so perhaps Richardson had not done any work for some time. peculiar story about the knife though, and I don't see how he could have borrowed one from the market if it didn't open till 5, the timings don't make sense.
All the best.

[RockySullivan]

Hi all

On the other hand Francis Tyler, employee of Amelia Richardson. should have been there a 6 a.m, but had to be sent for but didn't arrive until 8 a.m, as he was wont to do when trade was 'slack', so perhaps Richardson had not done any work for some time. peculiar story about the knife though, and I don't see how he could have borrowed one from the market if it didn't open till 5, the timings don't make sense.
All the best.

Hi Martin, what do u hear what do u say! Thats one of richardsons lies e was caught in. At the inquest richardson said he succefully cut the piece a leather from his boot n tied it up. When he was recalled he changed his story n said he cut it later on at the market, claiming he didn't actually cut his boot on the stairs. So what was he doing in the knife? I wonder abut this Francis Tyler, in the whitehall case, I read from a poster three shift workers were spotted with a parcel. They claimed to be getting tools from the basement. Was Tyler possibly with richardson that morning in the yard?

[RockySullivan]

The only explanation I can think of is chapmans body was there and richardson sat on the steps while he emptied her pockets. He used the knife to pry the rings from her fingers. But I think it's more likely we are looking at the killer and I'm starting to suspect it's more than richardson alone. Dark Cellars, tools going missing. Richardson said a saw was one of the tools stolen...debs any Chance this could be a fine toothed saw?

[Cogidubnus]

I too am something of a Richardson-doubter...his testimony rings somehow untrue almost every time...but to be unbiased we have to allow for the fact that he might, just might, be telling his version of the truth...and if so?

If so, he mightn't be the perpetrator...just someone who lied for his own reasons perhaps? (to submit to his ma, who seems to have been a strong character, perhaps...or to cover up some other crime he was involved in...?)

Every good wish

Dave

[RockySullivan]

I too am something of a Richardson-doubter...his testimony rings somehow untrue almost every time...but to be unbiased we have to allow for the fact that he might, just might, be telling his version of the truth...and if so?

If so, he mightn't be the perpetrator...just someone who lied for his own reasons perhaps? (to submit to his ma, who seems to have been a strong character, perhaps...or to cover up some other crime he was involved in...?)

Every good wish

Dave

But which version of his is his version of the truth ? That he never wen into the yard and only peeked at the padlock (even possible to see it), that he cut his boot or that he didn't cut his boot? Since he keeps changing his story, the only part id believe is that he was in the yard on the stairs with a knife...and the only reason for him to admit that is he's scared someone saw him

[Observer]

Come back Michael Richards all is forgiven

[RockySullivan]

Could the woman's voice heard by cadosche be the voice of a female accomplice? Doesn't really make sense as i still think an early TOD is more likely...but if chapman was killed before 5 am then who were the voices in the yard?

[Damaso Marte]

This "Richardson as suspect" thing is just an extended parody of Lechmere and Fisherman, right?