Abberline solved the GSG

[c.d.]

Hello Jon,

I think the much more natural reaction is to try and break your fall with your hands outstretched.

c.d.

[DRoy]

Everything is possible, Phil.
Fact is that Stride has been killed in Berner Street, where prostitutes used to do their job.
But the spot turned out to be unfit for further mutilations - because of Schwartz, not Diemshitzshutz, imo.

Cheers

Dave,

Is that fact? What would make Berner's special compared to any other street near by? Are you saying this is where they went to do their business or where they solicited? I only point this out since there wasn't one witness statement about about seeing prostitutes anywhere within Berner's at least within the 30 minutes before Stride was murdered. Plus, why use a yard where there are people coming and going constantly?

Unfit for mutilations because of Schwartz? You know how I feel about Schwartz but regardless...why would BSM take her inside the yard after he was spotted by Schwartz? 'Jack' or not, he'd be stupid to do so. He had no idea what sort of view Schwartz had of him. Why risk killing her just to do so even though he knew he'd been spotted and couldn't mutilate? Sorry Dave, I don't get the logic.

Cheers
DRoy

[moonbegger]

Thought this was a GSG thread ?

[c.d.]

Hi DRoy,

I don't think the BS man killed Liz but it seems that you are assuming that he took Liz into the yard with the intention of killing her which as you say doesn't make a lot of sense after being seen by Schwartz and the Pipe Man. However, an argument could have escalated once in the yard and he killed her on the spur of the moment.

c.d.

[DRoy]

I do believe in a double event, but only because I discount Schwartz.

If Schwartz was right, the idea of a double event must be abandoned.

Damaso,

I'm one of the few that discount Schwartz as well. May I ask why you discount him and how you arrive at your double event conclusion?

Cheers
DRoy

[DRoy]

Thought this was a GSG thread ?

It still is Moonbegger. Because of the obvious ties with the 'double event' and the suspects tied to both murders it has to be considered whether the GSG can be tied to them as well.

However, I see your point and will back off.

Cheers
DRoy

[c.d.]

Thought this was a GSG thread ?

I was just following the crowd.

c.d.

[Cogidubnus]

Had to do a second one...It's the Jews' fault...they ain't to blame for nothing

And the most important question would be, "was this 'Jack'?" - and the answer would be a resounding "No!"

'Jack' did not perform for an audience.

Jack did not perform for an audience...oh Jon! For such a shy retiring individual he certainly took some bloody chances...Narrowly missing the carmen with Nicholls, narrowly missing everyone at No 29 with Chapman, narrowly missing the coppers with Eddowes, not to mention McKenzie and Coles if he did them too...So logic dictates that it'd hardly be surprising, if, on just one of his outings, he misjudged slightly and was (briefly) seen...

Think I'm reluctantly coming round to a Garry Wroe-type belief in Schwartz...I started off rather cynically disbelieving in him, in part because of his sudden disappearance from the scene ... one press statement, no inquest and he's gone...

Now those same "facts" seem to play differently...what if the police actually realised what a star witness they really had...a man who witnessed a JtR murder, and hid him away...away from the inquest, and subsequently (apart from the Seaside Home?) away from the world? An early form of witness protection...

So just possibly that could make sense...And if JtR thought he'd been spotted by two jews...Lipski and GSG...Nice one DVV/Abby...Not saying you're right but as a theory it's got a lot more legs than much I've read on here!

All the best

Dave

[DVV]

Many thanks, Dave.

[lynn cates]

violent

Hello Damaso.

"with minimal violence"

Then why were Polly and Annie bruised so badly?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

ins and outs

Hello Jon.

"The not very loud screams could have been because her windpipe was severed."

So she was killed OUTSIDE the yard?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

spot on

Hello CD.

"And then of course, there is always the cachous question. Why didn't they spill out when she was pushed to the ground?"

Thanks for remembering that. I could kiss you. Well, maybe not.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

fistful of cachous?

Hello Jon.

"She could have made fist around them to defend herself and could easily have used a fist to break her fall."

But:

1. They were NOT in her fist. They were between thumb and forefinger.

2. If she had broken her fall with her fist, her wrist should have been bruised.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

argument

Hello (again) CD.

"However, an argument could have escalated once in the yard and he killed her on the spur of the moment."

Now THAT is perfectly plausible. Slight problem--would she take out the cachous in the midst of a heated argument?

Cheers.
LC

[Cogidubnus]

Many thanks, Dave.

Au contraire, merci beaucoup...

Dave