A Whip and a Prod

[Ven]

A hand cart was pushed by the user... a horse cart was pulled by the horse... a hand cart had legs to stand the cart, a horse drawn cart did not ( please show me a picture where the horse drawn cart/barrow has legs"... i have used the word "cart" to describe the multitude of words you have used NBFN

[Herlock Sholmes]

Daily Telegraph:

I had been to the market near the Crystal Palace, and had a barrow like a costermonger's, drawn by a pony, which I keep in George-yard Cable-street.
...
I put my whip handle to it, and tried to lift it up, but as I did not succeed I jumped down from my barrow and struck a match.

A barrow like a costermonger's ... is a costermonger's barrow.
Diemschitz referred to it in that manner, at the inquest.
That he may have used generic terms like 'cart', when talking to the press, is irrelevant.
It is you who are playing semantics.

This makes no sense. If someone buys an item they don’t describe it as being like that item unless it wasn’t actually that item.

I wouldn’t go out and buy a cricket bat and then describe it as “a bat like a cricket bat.”

[Ven]

it's still a costermonger's barrow. Diemschitz...

[daily news] i was driving a pony harnessed to a costermonger's barrow.

[morning advertiser] i had a barrow, something like a costermonger's, with me. I was sitting in it, and a pony was drawing it. It is a two-wheeled barrow.

these devices can be wheeled around by hand when necessary - hence the name barrow.

This was auctioned as 'a victorian costermonger's cart or barrow'...



if you don't think these pictures of costermonger barrows are actually costermonger barrows, then please provide a picture of a real costermonger barrow.

this is a hand cart >>> not pulled by a pony

[Ven]

This is a hand cart...



Now show me a picture of what you regard to be a costermonger's barrow...

LOL HAHAHAHAHAHA... really NBFN... you want to compare that to a horse drawn cart LMFAO? Your image in #585 is a HAND cart... what are you not seeing?

[Herlock Sholmes]

Unless Diemschutz was dwarf, had short arms due to disease or was wearing a suit of armour then he’d have been able to have reached Stride with a whip from every Costermonger’s cart/barrow that has been shown on this thread with considerable ease. To try and prove that he couldn’t have done so is an exercise in futility as there are too many unknowns. You can’t ‘prove’ something by using ‘what if’s.’ How many more utterly desperate attempts are going to be made simply to disparage Diemschutz in order to shoehorn a non-existent conspiracy/cover up into place? There’s simply no evidence that Diemschutz lied.

Talk about flogging a dead horse.

[NotBlamedForNothing]

This is a hand cart...



Now show me a picture of what you regard to be a costermonger's barrow...

[Ven]

Your missing the word "hand" from your posts NBFN, Your picture in #585 is still a HAND cart,,, or whatever you want to call it.
Show me a picture of a horse drawn cart that has "legs" on it. They pushed "hand" carts from the shallow and but used a horse/donkey from the that same end...so going in different directions... and the seat was above the wheels.
What part of hand carts, horse carts are you missing?

[NotBlamedForNothing]

You seem too be playing semantics rather than serious research. Depending on which paper you choose to quote, Diemshitz referred to it as, "a cart", "a trap", a costermonger's barrow, and "a barrow like a costermonger's".

Daily Telegraph:

I had been to the market near the Crystal Palace, and had a barrow like a costermonger's, drawn by a pony, which I keep in George-yard Cable-street.
...
I put my whip handle to it, and tried to lift it up, but as I did not succeed I jumped down from my barrow and struck a match.

A barrow like a costermonger's ... is a costermonger's barrow.
Diemschitz referred to it in that manner, at the inquest.
That he may have used generic terms like 'cart', when talking to the press, is irrelevant.
It is you who are playing semantics.

[Herlock Sholmes]

586 posts later and is there a scintilla of evidence that Diemschutz couldn’t have prodded Stride with his whip?

Answer, absolutely not.

Someone must have put superglue on those conspiracy goggles. They just won’t come off

[drstrange169]

You seem too be playing semantics rather than serious research. Depending on which paper you choose to quote, Diemshitz referred to it as, "a cart", "a trap", a costermonger's barrow, and "a barrow like a costermonger's".

[NotBlamedForNothing]

so it's still a hand cart (first picture on Post #581)... and doesn't help at all?

It's still a costermonger's barrow. Diemschitz...

[Daily News] I was driving a pony harnessed to a costermonger's barrow.

[Morning Advertiser] I had a barrow, something like a costermonger's, with me. I was sitting in it, and a pony was drawing it. It is a two-wheeled barrow.

These devices can be wheeled around by hand when necessary - hence the name barrow.

This was auctioned as 'A Victorian costermonger's cart or barrow'...



If you don't think these pictures of costermonger barrows are actually costermonger barrows, then please provide a picture of a real costermonger barrow.

[NotBlamedForNothing]

#575 = someone capable of seeking and acknowledging evidence which probably goes against existing beliefs/theories. A rare thing, I would suggest.

Another example by the same maker - Costermonger's barrow

This should start ... #581 ...

Many of my maternal uncles and cousins were/are in the trotting industry.

Basically looking at a fulcrum.

However .....

Sorry about that Dave. False assumption.

[Ven]

so it's still a hand cart (first picture on Post #581)... and doesn't help at all?

[NotBlamedForNothing]

#575 = someone capable of seeking and acknowledging evidence which probably goes against existing beliefs/theories. A rare thing, I would suggest.

Another example by the same maker - Costermonger's barrow

[DJA]

LOL, i think we've proved enough. 1/ a cart/barrow pulled by a horse, does not have legs/supports as per post #1, 2/ a two wheeled cart/barrow was sat upon above the axle... my biggest issue... I have never seen someone sitting afore of the two wheeled axle.... even today's trotter/pacer drivers sit above the two wheels... and some drivers are rather large... sitting above the axle spreads the weight

Many of my maternal uncles and cousins were/are in the trotting industry.

Basically looking at a fulcrum.

However .....



Here's one with a nice ass .....