What kind of a man was JTR?

[Harry D]

Hi Abby

Sorry, not nitpicking but I thought someone without empathy is trait of a psychopath rather than a sociopath?

Or is it a trait of both?

Otherwise I agree with most of your points.

Martyn

Richard Chase = psychopath

Ted Bundy = sociopath

[FrankO]

If we use his crimes as a reflection of him as a man, what do they really tell us about him?

Hi TRD,

Based on his crimes, I see a man who wasn’t much of a planner. He struck during the nightly hours of lull, worked very quickly whilst seeing to it that he didn’t get much blood on him and, each time, got away in time, but he took no other precautions to diminish the risk of getting caught. Furthermore, he was enough in control of himself to not give himself away until it was too late for his victims and to get away unnoticed. His murders clearly show that he was interested in and, as far as I’m concerned, curious about the female body. I think the Ripper was a man who had not been able to get into normal (sexual) relationships with girls/women, but, after a number of years of this, burnt with a desire to discover the female body. Maybe he settled for visiting prostitutes for a while and was thereafter able to retain himself for another while, but at a certain point, probably after something important happened in his life, he just had to live out his fantasies. I would think that at this point, the Ripper was a man of some maturity, older than, say, 25, but not much older than 30. Furthermore, I think he was practical and to the point and he knew right from wrong. Even though I think the Ripper possessed some psychopathic traits, there’s nothing in the evidence to suggest he was a psychopath - or anything else for that matter. However, he didn’t need any smooth-talking abilities to get his victims where he took their lives. In fact, he could have pulled it all off by taking a very reactive role, letting his victims approach him and lead him to the crime spots without him even having to say much. As long as he showed them the money and didn’t act too suspiciously, they would trust him enough. Lastly, he seems to have known the streets where he killed very well and, so, I believe he, quite likely, was a local.

This is what I think his crimes could tell us about him (or perhaps a little more).

All the best,

Frank

[Herlock Sholmes]

A man who wasn’t part of a conspiracy. A man who killed for unknown personal reasons.

[FrankO]

I agree, but any characteristic is dependent on how one views the crimes. If one believes the GSG is from the killer, or some of the letters, that influences what kind of man one thinks he was.

I'm with you here, Kattrup. Therefore, I think that an answer to TDR's question can only be sensible if we base it on things that have directly to do with the Ripper's crime scenes, things we can be sure of that they were done by the Ripper (like the dumping of the apron part, but not the GGS).

Obviously, this might give us too limited a view of what kind of man the Ripper was, but there you go.

All the best,
Frank

[mpriestnall]

Richard Chase = psychopath

Ted Bundy = sociopath

Thanks, Harry. JTR is the only serial I've actually studied. Heard of TB and know a little about him. RC was new to me so had to look him up.

I know nothing about criminal psychology but JTR sounds more of a psychopath than a sociopath. Maybe that would be a question for another thread?

Martyn

[Darryl Kenyon]

When I was reading about the Yorkshire ripper one thing that struck me was he attacked his victims from behind hitting them on the back of the head with a hammer. Now I believe Sutcliffe could be intimidated by women, particularly his wife Sonia. So perhaps that's why he murdered his victims this way, being outwardly meek.
I believe Jack strangled most of his victims from the front with his bare hands. So he would not have been intimidated by women [ facing them, rather than by attacking from behind with a weapon].
So in my opinion Jack was someone who was used to violence. Probably someone who regularly got into fights and had a history of violence against women, in relationships or otherwise.

[mpriestnall]

Even though I think the Ripper possessed some psychopathic traits, there’s nothing in the evidence to suggest he was a psychopath [/COLOR]

This is a quote from FrankO post #17.

I agree with this observation.

I think a certain situation had developed that caused him to express the psychopathic side of nature. I.E. He was responding to a situation without which he would not have killed anyone.

Martyn

[Herlock Sholmes]

When I was reading about the Yorkshire ripper one thing that struck me was he attacked his victims from behind hitting them on the back of the head with a hammer. Now I believe Sutcliffe could be intimidated by women, particularly his wife Sonia. So perhaps that's why he murdered his victims this way, being outwardly meek.
I believe Jack strangled most of his victims from the front with his bare hands. So he would not have been intimidated by women [ facing them, rather than by attacking from behind with a weapon].
So in my opinion Jack was someone who was used to violence. Probably someone who regularly got into fights and had a history of violence against women, in relationships or otherwise.

He probably needed to see the fear in their eyes.

[Harry D]

Thanks, Harry. JTR is the only serial I've actually studied. Heard of TB and know a little about him. RC was new to me so had to look him up.

I know nothing about criminal psychology but JTR sounds more of a psychopath than a sociopath. Maybe that would be a question for another thread?

Martyn

It was always my understanding that a psychopath has no conscience or moral code because they're insane. Whereas a sociopath knows what he or she is doing is morally unacceptable, but they don't care. It's not always easy to distinguish between the two.

[mpriestnall]

A man who wasn’t part of a conspiracy. A man who killed for unknown personal reasons.

So the conspiracy continues...

Martyn

[mpriestnall]

It was always my understanding that a psychopath has no conscience or moral code because they're insane. Whereas a sociopath knows what he or she is doing is morally unacceptable, but they don't care. It's not always easy to distinguish between the two.

Sometime ago I read Simon (not Sacha!) Baron-Cohen's book "Zero Degrees of Empathy - A New Theory of Human Cruelty and Kindness"
where he ascribes a psychopath "evil" cruel acts to another person being enabled by the lack of empathy.

"How can we ever explain human cruelty?

We have always struggled to understand why some people behave in the most evil way imaginable, while others are completely self-sacrificing. Is it possible that - rather than thinking in terms of 'good' and 'evil' - all of us instead lie somewhere on the empathy spectrum, and our position on that spectrum can be affected by both genes and our environments?

Why do some people treat others as objects? Why is empathy our most precious resource? And does a lack of it always mean a negative outcome?

From the Nazi concentration camps of World War Two to the playgrounds of today, Simon Baron-Cohen examines empathy, cruelty and understanding in a groundbreaking study of what it means to be human."

This is my source of my linking lacking of empathy to psychopathy. (but not neccesarily insanity).

Martyn

[Harry D]

This is my source of my linking lacking of empathy to psychopathy. (but not neccesarily insanity).

Yes, psychopathy would be correct, not insanity. It just sounded redundant when I typed it out.

[Abby Normal]

Richard Chase = psychopath

Ted Bundy = sociopath

bingo. chase=bat **** crazy Bundy= crazy like a fox

[Wickerman]

He probably needed to see the fear in their eyes.

Given that he carried a knife, I have always wondered why he didn't use it first. The Ripper is always portrayed in sketches as some wild-eyed knife wielding menace. Yet he never attacked his victims with the knife, none of them had initial stab wounds. It might be true to say his victims never saw a knife.

There is telling evidence that some, if not all his victims were suffocated, or strangled first.
I had to wonder if that wasn't the real turn on for him, that this killer was first and foremost a strangler, then the knife came out.
The knife was more to do with display, to shock the public. If he really only got his pleasure from the mutilations then why didn't he just stab them in the back and get on with the cutting up?
Strangling takes effort & time, there must be a reason why he chose that method of dispatch, something we've likely overlooked all these years.

As you say, I wonder if he drew some kind of satisfaction from looking them in the eyes as he strangled them, watching the life slowly drain while they gurgle and croak, gasping for air, that feeling of power over life & death!

[The Rookie Detective]

Some absolutely fascinating viewpoints and all of equal value in trying to determine & assess the Ripper's character & motive for such horrific crimes.

What's interesting from the comments so far is that no one has yet to describe a 'Kosminski,' which is somewhat surprising seeing as he's still considered a top 10 suspect. Kosminski doesn't fit the profile of JTR if we analyze our own comments

I think JTR suffered from what we today would describe as Mulit Personality Disorder; a man of many faces as it were.
He used a knife in his professional life, hence his competence with using a blade when you consider his timeframe working in the dark
He was a cannabal
He primary motives were to obliterate his victims and strip their identity as women by attacking the face and genitals
He was passive aggressive in his socail life
He was methodical and precise despite the apparent disorganisation of the inflicted wounds
He suffered abuse from a dominant female figure in his childhood
He wanted to show to the world what his victims were really made of; heartless abusers of thier own bodies.
He was married and led a double life with home/work
He was outwardly charming with women, like Bundy
He collected trophies from his victims

I dont believe he was insane or a lunatic and this is one of the key reasons why he was never caught.