9 out of 10 countries on this planet.....

[GUT]

BTW next year will be a biggy 100 years.

I'm not sure that others realise just how bg ANZAC day is in the Australian and New Zealand Psyche.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Those figures are somewhat debatable but taking them as are.

Britain out of a Population of about 45 mil
Australia out of under 5 mil
NZ out of 1.5 mil

And Anzacs were at Gallipoli or ANZAC cove. Brits and French at Helles. And it was a European War, we could easily have sat it out, but that would be unAustralian when a mate was in trouble.

That's an interesting proposition, GUT: "it was a European war".

When it came to Britain and the Empire I think it's generally accepted that if we were in, then so were you and Canada and South Africa et al. Like it or not, we were more than a mate. The Empire was obligated to defend Britain's interests and of course this notion was reciprocated.

There's an interesting debate going on in Britain at the moment as to whether or not we should have got involved, i.e. was it worth it. Personally I think not.

[Fleetwood Mac]

BTW next year will be a biggy 100 years.

I'm not sure that others realise just how bg ANZAC day is in the Australian and New Zealand Psyche.

I think we tend to focus on our countries, but I've seen the film Gallipoli and read the papers and I appreciate it's a big thing over here.

Here, it is the Somme with something like 60,000 British casualties in the first day and most of them in the first hour, which resonates most. The biggest disaster in the history of the British Army and for some it's a symbol of the futility of it all, while for others it was a necessary step in honing tactics and winning the war.

[GUT]

That's an interesting proposition, GUT: "it was a European war".

When it came to Britain and the Empire I think it's generally accepted that if we were in, then so were you and Canada and South Africa et al. Like it or not, we were more than a mate. The Empire was obligated to defend Britain's interests and of course this notion was reciprocated.

There's an interesting debate going on in Britain at the moment as to whether or not we should have got involved, i.e. was it worth it. Personally I think not.

LOL at the bit I highlighted, in WWII we had to beg to get troops released when Japan attacked.

Don't misunderstand me though I am proud of our British heritage and hope they never take the Union Jack off the Aussie flag. Even though I have as much or more ancestry in other places.

[GUT]

I think we tend to focus on our countries, but I've seen the film Gallipoli and read the papers and I appreciate it's a big thing over here.

Here, it is the Somme with something like 60,000 British casualties in the first day and most of them in the first hour, which resonates most. The biggest disaster in the history of the British Army and for some it's a symbol of the futility of it all, while for others it was a necessary step in honing tactics and winning the war.

The Somme and Villers Bretonneux are huge here, in fact another Aussie was awarded the French Legion of honour last week, in parts of France Aussies get treated like some sort of national heros even today because of the war.

[Fleetwood Mac]

LOL at the bit I highlighted, in WWII we had to beg to get troops released when Japan attacked.

Doesn't surprise me really, GUT, because the way the Empire was structured and the thought process among those who ran it; your priority was Britain as opposed to Australia. Whether you agree with it or not, I suppose that was the price that came with being part of the Empire.

Don't misunderstand me though I am proud of our British heritage and hope they never take the Union Jack off the Aussie flag. Even though I have as much or more ancestry in other places.

Well, one thing's for certain, of all the ex-colonies the two that retain closest links in terms of culture are Australia and New Zealand, and by quite some distance. Personally, while I like tradition, I've never really been a fan of the Union Jack because it stands for, at least in my eyes, a political or economic marriage of convenience. You can't (you being the British) say that it is something that speaks of home. The Cross of St George is our flag and whereas twenty years ago all of the flags at football and cricket matches would have been Union Jacks, they're now all The Cross of St George, which suggests that popular opinion has shifted away from the notion of Britain towards England and the like of the union and the Union Jack may be on their last legs.

[Fleetwood Mac]

The Somme and Villers Bretonneux are huge here, in fact another Aussie was awarded the French Legion of honour last week, in parts of France Aussies get treated like some sort of national heros even today because of the war.

I'm not surprised. They fought bravely as did the Canadians and others, and a lot of people gave their lives in awful conditions. I don't think any of that will ever be forgotten, certainly not in Britain.

And, the same goes for German soldiers who also fought bravely and lost untold numbers of soldiers, which is beautifully captured in Sassoon's piece of war poetry, Reconciliation.

WHEN you are standing at your hero’s grave,
Or near some homeless village where he died,
Remember, through your heart’s rekindling pride,
The German soldiers who were loyal and brave.

Men fought like brutes; and hideous things were done;
And you have nourished hatred, harsh and blind.
But in that Golgotha perhaps you’ll find
The mothers of the men who killed your son.

[GUT]

Doesn't surprise me really, GUT, because the way the Empire was structured and the thought process among those who ran it; your priority was Britain as opposed to Australia. Whether you agree with it or not, I suppose that was the price that came with being part of the Empire

To be clear what I mean is Australia had to beg England to release our boys to protect our home.

Well, one thing's for certain, of all the ex-colonies the two that retain closest links in terms of culture are Australia and New Zealand, and by quite some distance. Personally, while I like tradition, I've never really been a fan of the Union Jack because it stands for, at least in my eyes, a political or economic marriage of convenience. You can't (you being the British) say that it is something that speaks of home. The Cross of St George is our flag and whereas twenty years ago all of the flags at football and cricket matches would have been Union Jacks, they're now all The Cross of St George, which suggests that popular opinion has shifted away from the notion of Britain towards England and the like of the union and the Union Jack may be on their last legs.

I might be a bit simplistic but to a degree I see the England, Wales, Scotland thing a little like the Queensland, New South Wales etc thing here.

I also think the Union Jack is perfect for Australia because we have a huge Irish and Scottish heritage, Wales not so heavily represented but still a fair percentage.

I presume you mean Aus and NZ culturally similar to Brit not so sure that Aus isn't closer to US now days.

[Fleetwood Mac]

To be clear what I mean is Australia had to beg England to release our boys to protect our home.

I understood. What I was trying to say is that according to the people who ran the Empire, your home was England and that was the price of being part of the Empire. Priority first and foremost: England. No matter where you lived in the world.

I presume you mean Aus and NZ culturally similar to Brit not so sure that Aus isn't closer to US now days.

Maybe so, GUT. I think usually when countries play the same sports they tend to retain closer links, and I was only going off Aussies I've met over here at the cricket who tend to conduct themselves in a similar way to what we do, but maybe times are changing and you'd know better than me!

[GUT]

G'day Fleetwood Mac

Certainly similar in Cricket.

But in many ways very americanised mainly due to TV movies etc.

I think the biggest thing is still that in a lot of ways whereas the Brits seem to me to be a bit staid and the Americans can think they're pretty special Aussies seems more laid back and relaxed, at least that's what my Pommie and Yank mates tell me.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Certainly similar in Cricket.

But in many ways very americanised mainly due to TV movies etc.

I think the biggest thing is still that in a lot of ways whereas the Brits seem to me to be a bit staid and the Americans can think they're pretty special Aussies seems more laid back and relaxed, at least that's what my Pommie and Yank mates tell me.

I was reading somewhere that cricket has lost a bit of popularity in Oz? Now down to third most watched sport but used to be number one thirty year back? Whenever I catch bits of test matches over there the grounds look empty unless you're playing England?

Staid? Us? Come to one of our parties and you'll get served crisps and be force fed untold conversations about the weather. It'll sharp change your mind.

[GUT]

Well I really like crisps, [or chips as we call 'em] do you have any chicken flavoured, or salt and vinegar?

I am not a big Cricket fan myself but I am pretty sure it is still the number one summer sport. At ground crowds are down in all sports mainly because there is so much TV coverage, why pay when you can see it at home for free seems to be the attitude.

In winter it is probably either Aussie Rules or Rugby League, depending on what state you are in, but crowds are still down compared to population growth.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Well I really like crisps, [or chips as we call 'em] do you have any chicken flavoured, or salt and vinegar?

Anything you want, GUT, we've got them all and always ship in far too many bags than we need for parties, especially when one of our cousins is on the way to the Mother country and we're looking to impress.

You call them chips in Oz?! Christ, we have lost our grip on the world...

I am not a big Cricket fan myself but I am pretty sure it is still the number one summer sport. At ground crowds are down in all sports mainly because there is so much TV coverage, why pay when you can see it at home for free seems to be the attitude.

In winter it is probably either Aussie Rules or Rugby League, depending on what state you are in, but crowds are still down compared to population growth.

Crowds are generally up here across the board, whether football, cricket, rugby, but it's all very sanitised these days. I wouldn't even call them crowds anymore, more like a gathering of enthusiasts - certainly not rowdy.

I didn't realise the population was growing over there. Immigrants or birth rate up?

[GUT]

Mate up to about 22 mil here now, you can't go a mile without running into someone. Though in the big smoke t's about 6 million all in one place must be a friendly lot to all want to live together I guess.

Mainly bloody immigrants, but aren't we all.

All sports are sanitised now. Never see good punch up anymore. Well sometimes in the crowd.

Some here call them crisps, but I think chips is still the most common, can get confusing when the shop sells both crisps and hot chips but we manage somehow.

Football [soccer] here has had to move to Summer so it doesn't compete with Aussie Rules and the two Rugbys.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Mate up to about 22 mil here now, you can't go a mile without running into someone. Though in the big smoke t's about 6 million all in one place must be a friendly lot to all want to live together I guess.

Mainly bloody immigrants, but aren't we all.

All sports are sanitised now. Never see good punch up anymore. Well sometimes in the crowd.

Some here call them crisps, but I think chips is still the most common, can get confusing when the shop sells both crisps and hot chips but we manage somehow.

Football [soccer] here has had to move to Summer so it doesn't compete with Aussie Rules and the two Rugbys.

It's thought over here, GUT, could be wrong as it's based on anecdotes and the like, that the Aussies aren't a particularly tolerant bunch and an immigrant trying to get into Australia has to jump through all sorts of hoops.

Think yourselves lucky you don't have the European Union where we're obliged to host peoples from other countries in the EU. Now, this wouldn't be a bad thing at all as most of us here don't have a problem with anyone coming over providing they pull their weight, but this island is crowded and public services are creaking under the weight. Statistics will tell you that immigrants are net contributors but it depends upon who's producing the stats. Either way, we've lost control over much of our destiny.

I've always found it strange that in the ex-colonies, Oz, New Zealand, South Africa etc that rugby and cricket are the sports of most young lads growing up, whereas in England they're generally middle class sports and 90% of young lads growing up play football which is the working man's game. The farther North you go in the industrial heartlands you don't see much cricket and rugby at all; where I come from in the North East everyone plays football. Not quite sure how that came about, except that football did start out being played in public schools in the 1870s and 1880s and the term soccer is often thought to be an Americanism - it's not, it's from the public schools in England and is a shortened term for Association Football. Maybe that's why, when the colonies were really getting going football was played in the public schools and as such it was shunned in the colonies. Dunno really.