death penalty

[Robert]

"Most law is based on the idea that a large amount of people need to agree on a way to behave and control each other."

Most law is based on the idea that lawyers must be paid. Anything else is a bonus.

[Hannibal Hayes]

In these days of saving every penny where possible, I think bringing it back would benefit the Country financially.

Apparently it costs about £50,000 per year to keep someone inside. Now, if we brought it back for the most obvious cases where there is absolutely no dispute that they are guilty, everyone’s a winner. Murderers, peodo’s, rapists etc.

The public win as there’s no chance of the person being let out in 20 years by some out of touch millionaire judge for ‘good behaviour’ & then committing another atrocious crime, the prisons won’t be so crowded & we (the taxpayer) saves money.

What’s not to like?

My suggestion would be a firing squad of 15 people & only 5 of the guns loaded with real bullets. They all take aim & fire at the same but no-one knows who fired the fatal shots. I really do think there would be a queue for people wanting to do this job – the public have had enough.

Alternatively, make ‘lifers’ suffer – don’t give them televisions, playstations & access to the outside via telephones. Lock them in a cell, 6ft X 6ft, no light, just one meal a day & let them go mad. These people are absolutely no use to society at all & should be punished.

Someone said on an earlier thread that the bible says ‘thy shall not kill; but it apparently also says ‘an eye for an eye’. It’s also clear that religion is the cause of most mass murders nowadays so that argument is out of the window.

Anyway, time for a lie down me thinks …..

[Sis]

I've read that in the US the cost of an execution is higher than the cost of life in prison. Plus in the US the states without death penalty have lower homicide rates than those with the death penalty.
Do you believe having the death penalty is a deterrent for murder?

There some who have been convicted of second degree murder after driving impaired causing accidents that have caused death. They choose to drink and to drive, although likely didn't intend to injure or kill. Then there some who choose not to take their medications knowing they have a mental condition and then choose to kill and received a not guilty by reason of insanity (likely will serve a short sentence in mental health facility).
Do you believe the scales of justice are equal? Do you believe a serial killer or rapists is of right mind? If not of right mind, do you believe they should be not guilty by reason of insanity or guilty by reason of insanity?

Do you believe your present justice system is equal to all or does it depend on your wealth or position in society? What is your belief regarding serial killers being studied?


Personally I believe until the justice system is without flaw there should be no death penalty (exceptions in cases such as Westley Alan Dodd who requested execution).

Two good documentaries on real life experiences:

Deborah Peagler - Crime After Crime

Kenneth Waters and his sister, Betty Anne Waters - Conviction

[GUT]

Recently I was having lunch with two retired QC's who had been practicing when the death penalty was abolished.

One had been a Prosecutor and one was Public Defender.

They agreed totally that when the Death Penalty was taken off the table conviction rates in murder trials almost tripled.

Now know that it was a small sample, but it does I think say a lot.

[Fleetwood Mac]

I've read that in the US the cost of an execution is higher than the cost of life in prison.

Wouldn't we just make it cheaper to kill 'em?

Hoy some rat poisoning down their gullets or something?

I don't think it's much of an argument to say we must keep them alive because it costs a billion to kill 'em. Let's get more efficient with these things. Just push 'em over a cliff or whatever it takes to reap the desired result at minimum cost.

I remember my Grandad chasing a massive banty that refused to accept its fate round the garden with an axe. Maybe that's the answer. Just put 'em all in a garden and hunt them down with axes. First clean swipe gets a free night on the ale up the workman's.

[Sis]

Wouldn't we just make it cheaper to kill 'em?

Hoy some rat poisoning down their gullets or something?

I don't think it's much of an argument to say we must keep them alive because it costs a billion to kill 'em. Let's get more efficient with these things. Just push 'em over a cliff or whatever it takes to reap the desired result at minimum cost.

I remember my Grandad chasing a massive banty that refused to accept its fate round the garden with an axe. Maybe that's the answer. Just put 'em all in a garden and hunt them down with axes. First clean swipe gets a free night on the ale up the workman's.

Thank you for the good chuckle: )

I believe the high costs for a death penalty are due to the court costs mostly likely due to all the appeals.

[Beowulf]

On the basis of abolishing the death penalty because of errors in the justice system wouldn't the logical approach be to improve the justice system?

Why not take the approach no one goes to jail because there could be a mistake. No prison, could be a mistake.

Fix the system. Execute killers.

[GUT]

G'day Beowulf

2 questions

What error rate is acceptable? AND

How do you make a system ran by man fool-proof? Juries get t wrong, how do you overcome this?

I have no problem with the death penalty per say, but it is murder to execute an innocent person.

[Beowulf]

I'm not coming up with error rates. No one cares what I think. I do not work in that field but it's obvious, all industries, businesses anything must work to improve and they of course will not be 100% foolproof.

Nothing is error free. To cease and desist trying is futile and illogical.

[Robert]

What error rate is acceptable? In a democracy, it's a question for the voters. In Britain, of course, it's different.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Thank you for the good chuckle: )

I believe the high costs for a death penalty are due to the court costs mostly likely due to all the appeals.

Let's get a kangaroo court installed made up of street sweepers, farmers, social misfits, door men, failed gangsters, petty criminals, street thugs, accountants and out and out lunatics. They'll be happy to take part free of charge and there won't be a great deal of expense spared in evidence gathering. It'll be like the 17th century again with people turning up with a picnic, and others getting turned away for not having a ticket. In fact, we can make money out of it with burger stalls and ticket touts. Let's make it an entrepreneurial venture rather than a drain on the economy!

[Sis]

I am against the death penalty not because of the costs but the margin of error is too great for making possible to execute an innocent person. I believe the Justice system is leaning too much in favor of the rights of the criminal instead of the rights of the victim or victim’s family.

Also believe I’m incapable of executing or witness an execution of a stranger. However if Tim McLean had been my son, I’d have no problem shooting Vincent Li between the eyes for decapitating Tim just because he was a fellow passenger on a bus. Maybe I'd also be able to do it if I was just another passenger and witnessed it. I guess that makes me a hypocrite.

[Beowulf]

Kick em all out of jail and prison, could be errors.

[GUT]

G'[day Beowulf

Big difference between gaol when an injustice can be rectified and death when it cannot.

[babybird67]

the right no to tbe murdered

yes everybody has the right not to be murdered, and that includes murder by the state , therefore a system whereby even one innocent life is lost to murder by the state is unjustifiable.

Today I read on the news that another man wrongly convicted and on death row has been released.

Thank God he was not murdered before this point, although at any time he could have been.

It is bad enough that the state has stolen 30 odd years of his life, time which is irreplaceable, that he was prevented spending with his son, and now grandchildren.

If that state tells its citizens murder is wrong, the state must not engage in murder. Anything less is just unjust hypocrisy.