The Best Ever Trump Put-Down?

[rjpalmer]

Yes, there really is no reason to continue the discussion. You hate Trump. I do not. If your main cause is the environment you should be happy that The United States has reduced our carbon emissions to the lowest since 1990.

You're joking, right?

Trump's major policy platform pre-2016 was to deregulate environmental laws, including carbon emissions, and bring back coal. He succeeded somewhat in the first respect, but failed in the second; one of the major coal operations in Kentucky shutdown permanently, as did the largest coal generator in the western U.S. (located in Arizona). Technology moved on; Trump might as well have tried to bring back the butter churn and the donkey cart.

The 2nd biggest spike in carbon emissions in the past two decades occurred in 2018--two years into the Trump Administration. (The other was under Obama in 2010).

But even this had little to do with Trump's policies. 2018 was one of the coldest winters on record and people were burning more fuel. Again, you're looking for simplistic answers rather than nuance.

The weather has been warmer the past two years, and emissions have flat-lined. Technological improvements (which Trump has done nothing to promote---see below) explain the rest.

Let me remind you that the Trump administration FOUGHT California's stringent environmental regulations on the auto industry, but the auto industry ultimately ignored Trump and implemented them anyway, because California is their biggest market. The improvements were in spite of Trump, not because of him, yet, once again, the guy with the biggest mouth in the room (Trump) is given the credit.

Are you starting to recognize a pattern?

Let me just add an exclamation point: it was the state of California that led the way in the reduction of auto emissions IN SPITE OF TRUMP:

Hiltzik: How California beat Trump and the auto industry - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)


You think I'm not giving Trump credit. You're absolutely right. I'm not, because he had nothing to do with it. My view is that you are ridiculously giving Trump credit for something he actually fought against!


But hey, if you want to believe the image instead of the reality, there's nothing I can do to stop you. You're going to have to figure it out on your own.

[Al Bundy's Eyes]

As an outsider wading in, I'd have to give credit to Celee for putting forth a reasoned and coherent argument. OK, holes can be picked in his argument, I'm sure he'd argue otherwise, but it's good to hear a pro trump viewpoint that isn't based on outright bullshit hyperbole, of which there is much out there.

No three word chants. No calls to 'lock up' whoever. No call to arms. All that is sadly missing in the current debate is present in Celee's post.

In the current climate of hatred and vitriol, of calling the other side criminal, the "us Vs them", it's good to hear from a pro trump conservative republican who can actually articulate his views in a rational way. The same applies both ways. Respect. It's sadly missing lately. Disagreement is fine, by all means.

I'm not a big fan of Trump, or his war mongering followers. But if someone wants to talk about his pro's, I'll take Celee.

[celee]

Yes, there really is no reason to continue the discussion. You hate Trump. I do not. If your main cause is the environment you should be happy that The United States has reduced our carbon emissions to the lowest since 1990.

[Svensson]

"America achieved 4.8% economic growth. Obama never reached 2% in eight years. I do not know where you got the idea that Obama ever hit 3% economic growth"

I provided links to official economic statistics. Unless I'm half blind, I don't see where Trump achieved 4.8%. Can you provide a source for this statement?

[rjpalmer]

Your depiction of Obama's aid to Ukraine is grossly simplistic. You seem to be simply regurgitating a talking pointing often expressed by Matt Gaetz and similar right-wing pundits.

The Obama Administration gave millions of dollars in aid to Ukraine, including a $56 Million dollar aid package at the height of the conflict (2014) that included patrol boats, body armor, night-vision goggles, etc. etc. Don't be so eager to drink the Kool-Aid that Fox News is serving you.

The reason the Obama Administration didn't give lethal weapons to Ukraine (ie., Javelin anti-tank missiles) was BECAUSE they didn't trust Russia, and U.S. Intelligence services and the C.I.A. worried that Russian spies would end up with the technology. Obama also agreed with Europe that the conflict should not be escalated.

It was a tough call. When your friend is fighting your enemy, you want to give him the best weapons, but if your friend is infiltrated by Russian spies, you fear that your enemy will end up with that technology. Would the U.S. or the U.K. have given top secret military equipment to the French Resistance during World War 2? No way in hell; the Nazis would have ended up with it.

Can't you understand that? Or is it easier to pretend that simple answers are anything other than simple?

Further, bi-partisan support in Congress is what release this aid to Ukraine during the Trump administration. It wasn't something that Trump was pushing; indeed, Trump's knowledge of European politics was/is close to zero. It extended no further than him wanting to build the tallest tower in Europe. In fact, Trump was trying to WITHHOLD aid from Ukraine...that's why he was impeached. Have you already forgotten? He was insisting that the Ukrainians conduct an illegal smear campaign on a political opponent before he would release the money, even though it had already been approved by Congress. It was both illegal and unethical. It was Trump's own political advisor that raised the alarm, yet now you are giving Trump credit.

I find that bizarre. It smells more of propaganda, than nuanced reality.

I could go on, but why bother? You've clearly bought-in.

I don't view Trump as a Republican. I don't view him as anything, and I have family members on both sides of the political aisle. The reason many people (including lifelong Republicans like George Will, etc.) despise Trump has nothing to do with him wearing an 'R' on his shirt. Indeed, it wasn't too many years ago Trump was claiming to be a Democrat...and gave over $100,000 to the Clinton Foundation.

I sincerely believe that Trump has no politics. He has no deeply held political views. He has no convictions, no insights. And he has no causes...except himself. He is the very swamp that he is claiming to drain.

So for me, Trump is not about political questions. It's about the ability to recognize a grifter. Some have the ability; others do not.

Anyway, that's all from me. He's gone in three weeks, and I couldn't be happier. My main political interest is the environment, and the Trump administration has been an utter disaster on that front.

[celee]

It is obvious that you are not going to recognize everything Trump has accomplished during his Presidency and nothing is going to be good enough for you. The fact that you refuse to give the President any credit for the V.A. Accountability Act, Veterans Choice Bill, V.A. now has a 91% approval rate, the Criminal Justice Reform Bill, and the four major Middle East peace deals prove your bias against the President.

by any measure, President Trump's economy was the best and it had nothing to do with Obama. President Trump cut regulations on businesses and encouraged manufacturing companies to come back by reducing the corporate tax rate. He made better trade deals and created opportunity zones in black communities that led to an all-time low black unemployment rate. America achieved 4.8% economic growth. Obama never reached 2% in eight years. I do not know where you got the idea that Obama ever hit 3% economic growth. Obama killed the economy with restrictions on businesses. He told the American people that they would just "have to get used to no manufacturing jobs." Because of President Trump's policies, and despite eliminating restrictions on the oil industry, creating more jobs, America reduced its carbon emissions to the lowest since 1990. Even Democrats claimed NAFTA was a horrible trade deal for the United States. So was the Trans-Atlantic Partnership. President Trump ended one-sided trade deals. The claim that President Trump accomplished nothing for the American people is false. Even after the numerous lockdowns, the economy is still better than at any time during the Obama administration.

No President has been tougher on Putin. The president has doubled down on existing sanctions on Russia from previous administrations, and a total of 49 Russian operatives have been expelled under the Magnitsky Act a measure intended to punish Russian officials. President Trump approved the largest commercial sale of lethal weapons since 2014 to Russia’s foe Ukraine, a decision the previous administration declined to enact. A dozen executive orders have been signed by the president targeting Russia, which not only restricts their transnational businesses but also criminalizes relationships with some of their biggest energy companies. This includes the Countering America's Adversaries Through Sanctions Act, which requires the president to impose a series of sanctions on North Korea, Iran, and Russia.

President Trump also understands the deterrent value of a strong military. Congress approved his proposal for an additional $54 billion for our defense in 2017, equal to the entire defense budgets of countries such as Germany, France, and the U.K. The nearly $900 billion defense spending in 2018 dwarfs the $767 billion spent in Obama’s last year of office. This type of spending combined with the “peace through strength” mentality forces Russia and its allies to rethink their strategy going forward. In addition to addressing Russian aggression, consider the numerous steps Trump has taken to pressure our allies to recommit to our mutual security interests. He has projected an unwavering conviction to protect our national security by following through on the threat of military action in Syria and pressuring NATO countries to contribute more for their own defense unifying the Western world and deterring future threats. Trump also put the squeeze on Russian ally Iran when he withdrew from the failed nuclear deal and imposed more stringent sanctions on the mullahs.

Anybody who claims President Trump is soft on Russia is still trying to push the debunked Russian collusion theory. I am sure Putin is glad Biden may have won the election.

I do not wish to argue your opinions. A lot of what you posted is just rhetoric trying to justify your opinion that President Trump is horrible. There is no evidence that President Trump has "lined his pockets," He does not take a salary and his business brand has taken a big hit because half the country hates him. He obviously lost money and it would have been far more profitable for him to have stayed out of politics. He was a pop icon and largely beloved by the American public when he was just the "Donald." You might want to ask yourself how Obama and a small-town boy from Scranton. made millions of dollars as public servants. Joe Biden is worth 400 million dollars and he has been a career public servant. The one thing that frustrates me is that liberals overlook any corruption that involves the people they support. You do not think Hillary Clinton was corrupt? You can not see that Joe Biden is involved with China? Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. America's entire political system is corrupt. Washington is full of career politicians profiting from selling America out.

If you do not feel that there is a group of Globalists who are trying to control our lives you are not paying attention. The media is incredibly corrupt. You should read about "Operation Mockingbird." of course another "conspiracy theory." However, the media has been used to control the narrative in every communist country. If you do not feel that, at the very least, there is extreme media bias against the Trump administration you are mistaken Just look at how the media covered the Hunter Biden story compared to how they treated Don JR. If any member of the Trump family had been accused of half of what Hunter has done the accusations would be all the media would talk about.

I am ok with President Trump challenging the results of the 2020 election. The Democrats resisted the Trump administration for four years because they could not accept the results of the 2016 election. Most of the "Trump scandals" were fabricated by the Democrat establishment, the fake Russian Collusion, and a ridiculous impeachment. So, I think spending a few months investigating election fraud is justified.

I am not in love with any politician. I am a Republican, that believes in capitalism, and I support the America first agenda. I believe that there is a worldwide rejection of globalism. I think most reasonable people understand that the dream of, a new world order and a Star Trek utopia, is unattainable. There are too many bad actors on the world stage. The British public voted to leave the E.U. twice. Remember those who opposed leaving the E.U. claimed Russian interference too. So funny. It is the globalist that is trying to "back in through the back door." The U.K. will never be allowed to leave the E.U. Socialism is a wonderful idea in theory but the power brokers are too corrupt.

[Svensson]

He negotiated four major peace treaties in the Middle East.

The problem in the middle East is the relationship between Isreal and Palestine. What Trump did is redefine the problem to something that is solvable by attempting to have some muslim states normalise relationships with Israel. None of these relationships have anything to do with the root of the problem. In fact, he removed the US from the list of independent arbiters in this conflict.

Moved the American Embassy to Jerusalem recognizing the true capital of Isreal.

He had to make a yes/no decision and in the absence of Jerusalem's settled long-term status, his decision was wrong.

He got rid of NAFTA and replaced that horrible trade deal with the USMCA trade agreement.

It was a renaming and fine-tuning/revisioning (which is most likely warranted for a 20-year-old agreement) exercise. I'm not too involved with the details of international trade but given Trump's record of analysing existing trade-relations, I doubt that there is much truth to his public comments. In other words, I have no indications that NAFTA was indeed "horrible".

He ended the Trans Atlantic Partnership.

I don't know what you mean. Do you mean that he pissed off cultural, economical and political allies in Europe? Yes he certainly did but can you explain to me why this is a good thing? He certainly strengthened the Trans Arctic Partnership by giving Putin everything he wanted including another pass for what seems to be Russia's largest hack of US institutions to-date.

He created the greatest economy America has ever known with record-low unemployment and record-high economic growth and even after the pandemic and shutting down the economy our current economy is better than any time during the Obama administration.

Three things are certain. Death, Taxes and long-term economic growth. Guess who had "the greatest economy America has ever known" before Trump? It was Obama. Guess who had that title before Obama? George W. Bush. Failure to claim that tile for any one president is indeed a monumental failure of the entire presidency so the bar for this is pretty low. And btw, Trump never delivered "record-high economic growth" even though he likes to talk about it. I'm not sure what indicator you would use on this claim but I'm happy to work with the (IMO flawed indicator) of GDP growth. In his 4 years in office, Trump has broken 3 percent GDP growth annually in precisely 3 quarters. Obama did this 7 times in his presidency and he did not have the luxury of a stable economy on inauguration day: https://www.statista.com/statistics/...gdp-in-the-us/

On the job front, It's no contest either as Obama's last three years all beat Trump's best year and first three years combined: https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjo...h=4ae32a236ba6

Now I'm the first to admit that these naked stats are generally flawed indicators and that a larger number of stats need to be considered to get a fuller picture, but these are the stats that Trump goons are pushing in right-wing media as the tell-all indicator of their dear leader's success. Yes, the record-low unemployment stats are correct but they lack the context that Obama got the economy near the record and that Trump has just done enough to get over the record. To put it another way, Obama got the unemployment from 10% to 4.5 percent and Trump got it from 4.5 to 3.5 percent. You think that this is somehow proof of Trump's extraordinary abilities? Have a guess what Germany's pre-Covid unemployment numbers were? 3.2% and no Trump in sight. The United Kingdom has 3.8% which is the lowest since the early seventies and again, it had nothing to-do with Trump (you could actually argue that both could have been lower had it not been for Trump's misguided trans-Atlantic trade-wars but that's a different story altogether). Stock-markets on this side of the Atlantic have also been pretty high if not setting records this year alone. All of this despite Trump's best effort to throw spanners in the cogs of western political and economical systems.

The President signed the V.A. Accountability Act and an all-inclusive Veterans Choice Bill Veterans Affairs now has a 91% approval rating.

erm yes. Large departments need some sort of accountability (and whitleblower protection) legislation. I really don't know how that his is seen as a massive accomplishment. It's like congratulating my employer's HR department for posting a grievance procedure.... You don't get credit for what you're supposed to do.

signed the Criminal Justice Reform Bill He created opportunity zones for minority communities and provided long-term funding to historic black colleges Secured America's borders, built up the military, and returned America to the space race by establishing a fifth military branch the Space Force.

- Opportunity zones are often used by property developers to get government grants and to gentrify such zones in the process. I'm not saying opportunity zones don;t work in general (tbh, I just dont know) but they leave loop-holes for swampy estate agents to make a buck or five.
- Funding for history black colleges was subject to deep and sustained cuts from 2017 to 2019 which means he is not really getting credit for an problem he crated in the first place: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...largely-backed
- When you outspend the next 8 or nine countries combined, then the notion that there was a problem with military spending in the first place is ludicrous. Military spending more than doubled under Bush, Obama cut it a little but and then Trump increased it a little bit again but he is still not matching Bush's Bonanza: https://www.statista.com/chart/16878...na-and-russia/ Besides, the "achievement" of not starting major new wars and decreasing overseas troop numbers should mean that military spending cane be decreased. In a way he is using american tax dollars to have his cake and eat it at the same time.
- space race with who?

Let us be honest. Casebook has a very intelligent membership. The reason why President Trump has received so much resistance from the political establishment and establishment run media is he is not a globalist.

The media do not have a requirement to be a globalist, just to be sane.

His policies have not been horrible.

I would categorise them as Stupid, self-serving (monetary), self-service (ego), short-sighted, Authoritarian or plain Cruel. I think that around 90% of his policies would fit into one of these six buckets.

His big crime is he is not a member of the political establishment that includes Democrats and Republicans that have controlled the country for years,

You see, this is where things start getting weird. The need to come up with this ridiculous construct to explain why the media is apparently outraged with trump and not his policies. I had this discusion with someone else before where the question is, how do you really cover someone who takes a sharpie and draws onto a weather map to explain his own BS? The problem is that he is clearly insulting my intelligence when he does something like this and he is then correctly panned by the world media for This. Once you realise that this was all a bit silly, consider that some of this insanity would repeat every 3-5 days In fact, give me a list of all of Obama's worst scandals and I show you a quite month in MAGA-land by conparison.

He put it best when he said "They hate me because I am fighting for you."

Thing is, he never fought for you. He spent 4 years stuffing his own pockets and pardoning his friends and family. There is nothing in it for the US people when he diverts military flights from Rammstein to Glasgow Airport so that the Crew can stay at a Trump golf-course... He is also not fighting for his supporters by asking them for money for a phoney legal-challenge so he can divert the money to pay off his debts. His "trickle-down" economics serve his billionaire buddies first and foremost and what money they cant make legally, the attempt to take by grifting. This is why no administration has been surrounded by so many criminals in US history.

Who is "they" you might ask? They are the Globalists. Globalism is a worldwide movement to move towards a one-world socialist or communist system. Members of the Globalist movement are very powerful politicians, businessmen, and world leaders.

Ah yes, the world-wide (usually jewish) conspiracy again. I see Tucker Carlson and Sidney Powell are still going on about it...

England will never be allowed to leave the E.U.

the UK has left the EU on 01 JAN 2020. 363 days ago. The problem is that they are trying to get back in through the back-door....

Most of us are just pawns in the game of life and we are being manipulated and controlled. I feel very helpless.

Then Trump is not the answer because he is just manipulating those who aren't paying too much attention for his financial and mental benefit. right now he is attempting to subvert the will of the american people and to install himself for another 4 years in power. Is this not an example of being just a pawn in the game of life and feeling very helpless?

Trump is not the answer but he has shown all of us what the problem is more than anyone else in the western hemisphere.

[celee]

Yes, I think Graham ran for President in 2016. REgardless are all two-faced who care about nothing except money and power.

I wish I can delete posts with typos. I Think Graham ran for President in 2016. Regardless, most politicians are corrupt and all they care about is money and power.

[celee]

Graham wasn't running for office in 2016.

Yes, I think Graham ran for President in 2016. REgardless are all two-faced who care about nothing except money and power.

[rjpalmer]

Kamala Harris inferred Biden was a racist and said she believed the women who claimed Joe Biden sexually assaulted them. People say and do anything to win an election and when the election is over, all is forgotten. That is how the game of politics is played.

Graham wasn't running for office in 2016.

[celee]

I think the best Trump put-downs are still the ones by Ted Cruz and Lindsay Graham from summer 2016. Also because of having the benefit of observing Cruz and Graham 5 years later...

1. "Donald Trump is a Jackass": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SmM_N4Zy_U

2. "Donald trump is a pathological liar": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNRJJsjGdv0

Kamala Harris inferred Biden was a racist and said she believed the women who claimed Joe Biden sexually assaulted them. People say and do anything to win an election and when the election is over, all is forgotten. That is how the game of politics is played.

[celee]

Hi Gordon, I would not describe anyone who ascends to the most powerful office in the world, as an "idiot'. President Trump is not a perfect man. He is a narcissist and at times obnoxious. Just like every other President, I disagree with some of his policy decisions. I did not like the fact he pulled out of the climate accord. He could have ended the self-imposed sanctions without pulling out of the group. America needs to take the lead in fighting global warming. However, under the Trump administration America has reduced carbon emissions to the lowest since 1990. China, Russia, and India need to do much better. I feel the President should pull all of our troops out of senseless wars and I have some concerns with operation warp speed.

I think President Trump has done surprisingly well. He negotiated four major peace treaties in the Middle East. Moved the American Embassy to Jerusalem recognizing the true capital of Isreal. He reduced the number of American troops in Afghanistan and Syria. He is the first President who did not get the United States into a military conflict since Jimmy Carter. He got rid of NAFTA and replaced that horrible trade deal with the USMCA trade agreement. He ended the Trans Atlantic Partnership. He created the greatest economy America has ever known with record-low unemployment and record-high economic growth and even after the pandemic and shutting down the economy our current economy is better than any time during the Obama administration. The President signed the V.A. Accountability Act and an all-inclusive Veterans Choice Bill Veterans Affairs now has a 91% approval rating. The President signed the Criminal Justice Reform Bill He created opportunity zones for minority communities and provided long-term funding to historic black colleges Secured America's borders, built up the military, and returned America to the space race by establishing a fifth military branch the Space Force.

Let us be honest. Casebook has a very intelligent membership. The reason why President Trump has received so much resistance from the political establishment and establishment run media is he is not a globalist. His policies have not been horrible. In fact, his policies have been good for America and he is certainly no worst than any other President in recent American history. His big crime is he is not a member of the political establishment that includes Democrats and Republicans that have controlled the country for years, since Reagan. President Trump is not in favor of the "Great Reset" or a "New World Order." He is a Nationalist that puts America first. He put it best when he said "They hate me because I am fighting for you." Who is "they" you might ask? They are the Globalists. Globalism is a worldwide movement to move towards a one-world socialist or communist system. Members of the Globalist movement are very powerful politicians, businessmen, and world leaders. England will never be allowed to leave the E.U. I hope that Globalism will lead to a wonderful new world where everyone lives in a Star Trek utopia, but I have my doubts. Most of us are just pawns in the game of life and we are being manipulated and controlled. I feel very helpless.

Keeping with the good-natured fun of the topic. Here is my favorite Trump put down. https://youtu.be/hKf0k482PZQ

[celee]

The poor guys' wife can't stand to hold his hand in public.

Doesn't seem like value for money, he should ask for a refund.

The FLOTUS got a lot closer to the President than holding his hand. They have a son. The couple has been together for thirteen years I am sure there are times when they do not get along just like every couple. Unfortunately for them, they are always in the public eye.

[Svensson]

"crazy radicals"? like who..?

[Gordon]

Well, I’ll grant you Trump is an idiot, but there are pros and cons. Off the top of my head, three “pros”:

A tax cut that put a little money in my pocket.

Stemming the tide of foreign invasion, for a while at least.

Putting some stability into the Supreme Court: hopefully his most lasting achievement. As long as Biden doesn’t cheat the way FDR threatened to do (but didn’t).

And his worst fault? Being idiot enough to get people voting for that other crowd instead, including a bunch of crazy radicals!

Politics stinks. It’s Hobson’s choice. No moderation these days. We were better off in the 1950s when people were much more in agreement. “Consensus politics,” they called it back then. Consider the radical volte-face in public attitudes between “I Like Ike” and “We Hate Trump.” Oh, for the Good Old Days of civility!